Oct 11, 2022 Planning Commission

>> I DON'T KNOW IF THERE IS AN EXTRA MICROPHONE OR ANYTHING.

>> SORRY.

>> I'LL TRY TO TALK A LITTLE. CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW? I'M GOING TO TRY TO TALK MORE INTO THE MICROPHONE.

>> SORRY ABOUT THAT. THE CITY OF DECATUR IS JUST OVER FOUR SQUARE MILES AND 67 PERCENT OF DECATUR IS SINGLE-FAMILY ZONING, WHICH IS REALLY WHY THE TASK FORCE LOOKED AT OUR SINGLE-FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS AS A SOLUTION FOR PROVIDING MORE DIVERSITY OF HOUSING AND AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

IT'S ALSO BEEN A MANDATE THROUGH MANY DIFFERENT REPORTS FROM THE PAST, THAT NEIGHBORHOODS ALSO PARTICIPATE IN PROVIDING DIVERSITY OF HOUSING OPTIONS.

I JUST HAD TO ADJUST OUR AVERAGE FOR SALE HOME PRICE.

IT WAS OVER 700,000 ON MY LAST SLIDE THAT I DID A COUPLE OF MONTHS AGO, BUT AS OF SEPTEMBER 2022, IT'S OVER 800,000.

THE RENT DOWNTOWN FOR TWO BEDROOM IS BETWEEN 2500-3200 A MONTH.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE AVERAGE RENT FOR DECATUR, TYPICALLY AVERAGE IS AROUND 1,700, BUT THAT'S WHEN WE FACTOR IN A LOT OF THE OLDER APARTMENTS THAT ARE SCATTERED AROUND DECATUR AND THOSE ARE BEING LOST AT A VERY RAPID RATE.

DECATUR IS STILL EXPECTED TO GROW, POPULATION GROWTH IS PROJECTED AT 10,500 BY 2050 BY THE ATLANTA REGIONAL COMMISSION ALONG WITH SMALLER HOUSEHOLDS.

AN INCREASE IN THE NUMBER OF SMALLER HOUSEHOLDS AND OLDER RESIDENTS ALONGSIDE POPULATION GROWTH IN GENERAL.

DIVERSITY OF HOUSING WAS FORMERLY ALLOWED IN DECATUR.

A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT I TALK TO DON'T REALIZE THIS, BUT DECATUR ALLOWED DUPLEXES, TRIPLEXES, QUADPLEXES, AND SMALL APARTMENT BUILDINGS IN DIFFERENT AREAS OF DECATUR THROUGHOUT MANY DECADES, AND THEN SLOWLY DISALLOWED AND WENT MORE TOWARDS SINGLE-FAMILY ZONING AND SO DUPLEXES WERE THE LAST TYPE TO BE DISALLOWED IN 1986.

WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT DECATUR'S HOUSING TRAJECTORY, HOW IS OUR HOUSING UNITS CHANGED OVER TIME? THIS CHART COMPARES THE NUMBER OF HOUSING UNITS INDICATOR IN 2000-2020.

YOU CAN SEE WE WENT UP FROM AROUND 8,500 TOTAL HOUSING UNITS TO 9,975 IN THAT 20 YEAR PERIOD, BUT THEN IN THE FAR COLUMN OVER TO THE RIGHT, YOU CAN SEE THE INCREASE OR DECREASE IN THE NUMBER OF UNITS.

THE ONE-UNIT DETACHED, WHICH IS YOUR SINGLE-FAMILY HOME INCREASED BY 478 UNITS, ONE UNIT ATTACHED BY 410 AND THEN WE LOST UNITS IN THE 2, 3-4, 5-9 AND 10-19 UNIT AREA, WHICH IS THE MISSING MIDDLE.

THEN WE ADDED 1,100 AT THE 20 OR MORE UNITS.

YOU SEE WE'RE VERY WEIGHTED INDICATOR ON THE ONE UNIT SIDE AND THE MULTI-UNIT, 20 OR MORE UNIT SIDE.

BUT ARE MISSING MIDDLE HAS REALLY BEEN IN DECLINE AND FOR MANY YEARS AND THAT'S ANOTHER REASON DECATUR ALONG WITH A LOT OF OTHER CITIES IS LOOKING BACK AT THIS POLICY AND THE TYPE OF HOUSING THAT THOSE PROVIDED.

DECATUR ALSO DOES A NATIONAL CITIZEN SURVEY EVERY YEAR SO THAT WE CAN SEE WHERE THE COMMUNITY FEEDBACK IS ON DIFFERENT TOPICS INDICATOR AND BENCHMARK OURSELVES AGAINST PREVIOUS YEARS.

THIS IS A SNAPSHOT.

I THINK IT'S 500-600 PEOPLE A YEAR THAT ARE SURVEYED, AND DECATUR SCORES REALLY WELL IN THE SURVEY OVERALL.

VERY HIGH QUALITY OF LIFE,

[00:15:01]

HIGH PARTICIPATION AMONG RESIDENTS, JUST REALLY HIGH SCORES OVERALL.

SOME OF THE PARTICIPATION SCORES, I THINK ARE THE HIGHEST IN THE NATION FROM THE CITIES THAT THE NATIONAL COMMUNITY SURVEY DOES.

BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT AVAILABILITY OF QUALITY AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN THE GREEN, IT'S A GLARING DROP IN THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING FROM THESE SURVEYS.

IT'S ACTUALLY GONE DOWN.

IN 2008, THE AVAILABILITY OF QUALITY AFFORDABLE HOUSING WAS MEASURED AT 48 PERCENT BY THE RESPONDENTS, AND NOW WE'RE DONE AT 21 PERCENT AND THE VARIETY OF HOUSING OPTIONS IS ALSO VERY LOW AT 44 PERCENT.

WE HAVE A GLARING PROBLEM INDICATOR, AND I THINK A LOT OF COMMUNITY MEMBERS HAVE RECOGNIZED IT FOR A LONG TIME, AND WE'RE AT THE POINT NOW WHERE WE'RE TRYING TO DO ACTIONABLE ITEMS. THE LAST THING I'LL SAY ON THIS SLIDE IS THAT THE VISION FOR DECATUR IN THE STRATEGIC PLAN WHICH IS DRIVEN BY THE COMMUNITY FOR DECADES WAS ALWAYS ABOUT QUALITY OF LIFE AND IT'S SWITCHED A LITTLE BIT IN THE 2020 STRATEGIC PLAN TO TALK MORE ABOUT FOSTERING AN EQUITABLE THRIVING AND WELCOMING COMMUNITY.

THAT'S ACTUALLY THE VISION STATEMENT RIGHT THERE IN YELLOW IS DECATUR FOSTER AND EQUITABLE, THRIVING AND WELCOMING COMMUNITY FOR ALL TODAY AND IN THE FUTURE.

WE'VE GOT A GREAT QUALITY OF LIFE HERE.

I'VE REALLY ENJOYED LIVING HERE, RAISING MY KIDS.

I THINK MOST OF US HERE PROBABLY HAVE, BUT A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE LOOKED AROUND AND SAID, WE'VE LOST SOME THINGS TOO.

WE'VE LOST SOME EQUITY AND LOST HOUSING TYPES, DIVERSITY OF INCOME, AND THINGS LIKE THAT, WHICH I'LL GO INTO IN THE NEXT SLIDES.

ANOTHER THING WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING, WHICH IS LIKE I MENTIONED, THE 2-4 UNIT HOUSING TYPES WE'RE LOOKING AT IS HOUSING AT ALL STAGES OF LIFE.

IT'S A DIVERSITY OF HOUSING AND A DIVERSITY OF PEOPLE.

THAT COULD MEAN YOU'RE YOUNGER GEN Z, MILLENNIALS.

WE ALL KNOW THAT THERE'S AN ISSUE RIGHT NOW WITH YOUNGER PEOPLE BEING ABLE TO BUY STARTER HOMES AND THAT'S TRUE IN DECATUR AS WELL.

I KNOW THAT I COULD NOT BUY A STARTER HOME IN DECATUR RIGHT NOW, ALTHOUGH I DID THAT 20 YEARS AGO WHEN I MOVED HERE.

WE'RE ALSO LOOKING AT OUR OLDER AGING POPULATION.

AARP IS ONE OF THE BIGGEST ADVOCATES FOR MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING BECAUSE AARP REALLY UNDERSTANDS THAT THIS MISSING MIDDLE TYPE OF HOUSING IS VERY VALUABLE TO PEOPLE WHO ARE LOOKING FOR DIFFERENT LIVING SITUATIONS AS THEY AGE.

SOME OF THESE SLIDES MAY BE A LITTLE HARD TO SEE WITH ALL THE DATA ON THEM.

WHEN TALKING ABOUT TRAJECTORY DECATUR'S TRAJECTORY, SINCE THE TIME THAT THE MISSING MIDDLE WAS DISALLOWED IN THE LATE 80'S.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT THAT TRAJECTORY UP UNTIL NOW, THERE IS A LOSS OF SOME OF THE DIFFERENT DIVERSITY ITEMS IN DECATUR.

THIS ONE I PULLED OUT BECAUSE I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO LOOK AT AGE.

WHEN YOU'RE MEASURING AGE IN DIFFERENT AGE GROUPS, DECATUR IS IN THE BLUE, ATLANTA IS IN THE GREEN, AND METRO ATLANTA IS IN THE ORANGE.

YOU SEE THAT WE HAVE THE HIGHEST POPULATIONS AT 35-44 AND 45-54 YEARS, AND THEN IN THE CHILDREN POPULATION ARE UNDER FIVE UP TO AGE 19.

BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE POPULATION OF PEOPLE 20-24 AND 25-34 YEARS AND THEN THE PEOPLE OVER 55.

WE'VE GOOD BIT LESS OF POPULATION THERE AND I THINK IT'S A PRETTY DRAMATIC DIFFERENCE JUST LOOKING BETWEEN THE DECATUR IN ATLANTA.

ATLANTA IS IN THE GREEN AND DECATUR IS IN THE BLUE, YOU CAN SEE THE DIFFERENCE THERE IN THE YOUNG PEOPLE THAT ARE ATTRACTED TO ATLANTA AND DECATUR.

WHEN I LOOK AT A HEALTHY HOUSING MARKET OR A HEALTHY COMMUNITY, I DON'T THINK YOU WANT TO SEE SUCH A HUGE DISCREPANCY IN THE DIFFERENT POPULATIONS.

I THINK IT'S HEALTHY TO HAVE HOUSING AND THE ABILITY FOR DIFFERENT PEOPLE TO LIVE IN DECATUR.

WHEN I LOOK AT ATLANTA AND I'VE TRIED TO COMPARE WHAT ARE SOME OF THE DIFFERENCES.

PROPERTY TAXES ARE NOT THAT DIFFERENT IN ATLANTA, BUT I THINK THAT A LOT OF IT COMES DOWN TO A DIVERSITY OF HOUSING THAT THERE'S JUST MORE ACCESSIBLE TO YOUNGER PEOPLE THERE SO.

>> [INAUDIBLE] NOT UNTIL I OPEN PUBLIC COMMENT.

>> NO, SIR. NOT UNTIL I OPEN PUBLIC COMMENT.

>> SORRY. I'LL TRY TO TALK FASTER.

BUT A LOT OF YOU'VE NEVER HEARD THIS BEFORE, SO I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT.

WE'VE ALSO HAD A DECLINE IN INCOME DIVERSITY.

IF YOU LOOK AT THE BOTTOM, EVERYTHING UNDER 99,999, YOU CAN SEE THAT WE'VE GONE 2010-2020, THAT'S ALL DECREASED.

THEN WHEN YOU LOOK AT 100,000, 150,000, AND 200,000 OR MORE, ESPECIALLY THE 200,000 OR MORE, THE INCOME HAS JUST SKYROCKETED.

WE'VE HAD A LOSS OF INCOME DIVERSITY AS WELL.

A SLIDE I DIDN'T PUT UP HERE IS ALSO A LOSS IN RACIAL DIVERSITY OF HOMEOWNERS.

WE'VE LOST BLACK AND HISPANIC HOMEOWNERS, ABOUT 25 PERCENT DECLINE IN THOSE.

I ALSO WANT TO POINT OUT BECAUSE I KNOW THIS HAS BEEN A CONCERN ABOUT WHAT DOES THIS MEAN? WHAT COULD THE IMPACT BE? WE'VE BEEN STUDYING MINNEAPOLIS AND PORTLAND BECAUSE THEY'RE ARE

[00:20:03]

TWO CITIES WHO HAVE IMPLEMENTED THE MISSING MIDDLE POLICIES.

OTHER CITIES ARE LOOKING AT THIS WELL, ACTUALLY CHARLOTTE JUST PASS THIS, GAINESVILLE, FLORIDA PASSED IT, AND THEN I THINK ATHENS IS ALSO LOOKING AT IT AND YOU HAVE SOME OTHER CITIES AROUND THE SOUTH.

BUT MINNEAPOLIS AND PORTLAND, THEY'RE THE FIRST CITIES TO PASS THIS, SO WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO STUDY THE NUMBERS.

WE'VE SEEN ABOUT A 0.09 PERCENT INCREASE IN HOUSING UNITS, THAT EQUATES TO ABOUT 8-12 NEW UNITS PER YEAR.

DECATUR, WHICH IS SIMILAR TO WHAT WE'VE SEEN WITH THE GROWTH OF ADUS OR GRANNY FLATS SINCE THEY WERE ALLOWED IN 2014.

OVER 10 YEARS, THIS EQUATES TO ABOUT 80-120 NEW, SMALLER MISSING MIDDLE HOMES SCATTERED THROUGHOUT DECATUR'S NEIGHBORHOOD BUT THE POSITIVE IS WHEN YOU BLEND IT IN WITH OTHER INITIATIVES FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING, YOU CAN ACTUALLY IMPACT AFFORDABILITY TOO, WHICH I CAN TALK ABOUT IN A SECOND.

THE IMPORTANCE OF THE MISSING MIDDLE IS THE FLEXIBILITY.

MISSING MIDDLE IS ONE OF THE 23 RECOMMENDATIONS, LIKE I SAID.

THE RECOMMENDATIONS IN THE TASK FORCE REPORT ALL WORK TOGETHER AND SO THE FLEXIBILITY OF ALLOWING DUPLEX, TRIPLEX, AND QUADPLEX IS REALLY IMPORTANT TO THE GOALS BECAUSE THE SMALLER UNITS EQUALS SMALLER HOUSEHOLDS, FEWER CARS, DIVERSITY OF PEOPLE, AND QUADS IN PARTICULAR ALLOWS SMALLER MARKET RATE UNITS THAT ARE IN DIRE NEED.

THEY ALSO OFFER THE OPPORTUNITY FOR ENTRY-LEVEL HOME OWNERSHIP AND THE BEST UTILIZATION OF LAND.

SMALLER UNIT OPPORTUNITY FOR AFFORDABLE SOLUTION, WHICH WOULD BE SOMETHING OF INTEREST WE MIGHT LOOK AT, WHAT SHOULD BE A NON-PROFIT OR SUBSIDIZED SOLUTION AND THEN ALSO YOU HAVE A MARKET SOLUTION WHERE THERE COULD BE NON-SUBSIDIZED WEALTH BUILDING OPPORTUNITIES.

THEY DO NOT CREATE LUCRATIVE DEVELOPMENT OPPORTUNITIES AND THEY CAN HELP WITH PRESERVATION IF SOMEONE MIGHT BE ENCOURAGED INSTEAD OF TEARING DOWN A HOME TO ADD ON OR TO DIVIDE THE HOUSE.

ONE THING THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT TOO IS PERFORMANCE MEASUREMENT.

WE'VE SEEN FROM OTHER CITIES, THIS IS A VERY GENTLE DENSITY, ABOUT 8-10 UNITS PER YEAR BUT THE CITY WOULD TAKE THIS UNDER PERFORMANCE MEASUREMENT TO DO AN ANNUAL REVIEW OF THE MISSING MIDDLE, ALONG WITH INCLUSIONARY HOUSING UNITS AND AFFORDABLE HOUSING UNITS THAT ARE CREATED THROUGH THE DIFFERENT MECHANISMS THAT WE HAVE.

ZONING CREATES THE ABILITY TO ADAPT AS WELL.

IN THE PERFORMANCE MEASUREMENT, IF THERE ARE THINGS THAT NEED TO BE TWEAKED, THEY CAN BE TWEAKED THROUGH THE ZONING CODE.

THE ZONING CODE HAS BEEN CHANGED THROUGHOUT THE YEARS, REGULARLY AS WE'VE SEEN WITH THIS TYPE OF HOUSING BEING DISALLOWED AND WE CAN USE THAT ABILITY TO ADAPT THESE TO MAKE SURE THAT ANY CONCERNS THAT COME UP ARE RAISED.

CONCERNS RAISED DURING THE COMMUNITY INPUT SESSIONS AND TONIGHT WILL BE UNDER CONSIDERATION TO INFORM POLICIES THAT MIGHT SURROUND THIS.

DECATUR HAS EXISTING OPPORTUNITIES TO CREATE AFFORDABLE MISSING MIDDLE HOMES.

THIS IS ONE THING I WANT TO POINT OUT IS THAT WE ACTUALLY HAVE SOME OPPORTUNITIES OUT THERE.

THERE'S A HOME THAT THE CITY JUST BOUGHT AT 600 COMMERCE DRIVE THAT COULD BE ONE OF OUR FIRST QUADPLEX OPPORTUNITIES THAT COULD FIT INTO, I THINK APPROXIMATELY THE SAME FOOTPRINT OF THAT EXISTING HOME THAT'S THERE, WHICH IS A BONUS BECAUSE THEY WERE LOOKING AT TOWN HOMES BEFORE BUT WHEN YOU PUT IN THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO A QUADPLEX THERE, YOU CAN DO A SMALLER FOOTPRINT BUT STILL PUT SOME AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN THERE.

THERE ARE ALSO SOME HOMES THAT THE SCHOOL BOARD OWNS THAT HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO BE POTENTIALLY SUBDIVIDED THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT FOR TEACHER HOUSING.

WE HAVE OPPORTUNITIES RIGHT NOW, ASIDE FROM JUST 8-10 THAT MIGHT BE MARKET RATE.

WE ACTUALLY HAVE OPPORTUNITIES OUT THERE WHERE WE CAN INFLUENCE AND CREATE AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN DECATUR, WHICH IS THE WHOLE GOAL OF THIS POLICY.

IT'S A GENTLE DENSITY [NOISE] AND IT'S GOING TO TAKE TIME BUT LIKE I SAID, IT'S THE TRAJECTORY THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT.

I JUST WANT TO WRAP IT UP THERE.

I KNOW HAVE TAKEN A LONG TIME BUT JUST TO REQUEST THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION PROVIDE A RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL TONIGHT TO THE DECATUR CITY'S COMMISSION, SO THAT I'M ABLE TO CONTINUE THIS WORK. THANK YOU.

>> ALL RIGHT. [APPLAUSE] DOES ANYONE ON THE COMMISSION HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? YES.

>> YOU MENTIONED THERE WILL BE AN ANNUAL REVIEW OF THE ORDINANCES.

WILL THAT REVIEW HAVE A COMMUNITY INPUT ELEMENT TO IT?

>> I'M PRETTY NEW BUT I HAVEN'T DONE THE PLANNING, THE PERFORMANCE REVIEW.

BUT ANGELA, DO YOU MIND WEIGHING IN ON HOW THAT PROCESS WORKS?

>> SURE. EXCUSE ME.

>> [OVERLAPPING] CAN'T HEAR THE QUESTION.

>> THE QUESTION THAT I ASKED WAS WILL THE ANNUAL REVIEW OF THESE ORDINANCES, IF THEY SHALL PASS, WILL THAT HAVE A COMMUNITY INPUT ELEMENT OR PUBLIC FORUM LIKE WHAT WE HAVE TODAY?

>> WHAT'S THE ANSWER?

>> I HAVEN'T GIVEN IT YET.

[LAUGHTER] THE CITY OF DECATUR, WE DO HAVE A PERFORMANCE MEASUREMENT TEAM AND WHEN NEW POLICIES ARE ADOPTED BY THE CITY, [OVERLAPPING] WE SET SOME MEASUREMENTS SO THAT OVER TIME,

[00:25:02]

YEAR AFTER YEAR, WE ARE QUANTIFYING THE POLICIES AS TO WHETHER THEY ARE BEING SUCCESSFUL OR NOT.

FOR THIS PARTICULAR ONE, IF THIS POLICY WAS TO BE ADOPTED, WE WOULD BE MEASURING HOW MANY DUPLEXES ARE CREATED, HOW MANY TRIPLEXES AND QUADPLEXES ARE CREATED IF THIS POLICY WAS TO BE ADOPTED.

WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PERFORMANCE MEASUREMENT, THAT'S WHAT WE WOULD BE LOOKING AT.

WE WOULD BE REPORTING THAT AS PART OF OUR ANNUAL BUDGET, SO WE USUALLY PROVIDE THOSE PERFORMANCE MEASURES AT THAT TIME.

>> [OVERLAPPING] YOU DIDN'T ANSWER THE QUESTION.

>> [NOISE] LET ME TELL YOU WHAT WE'RE NOT GOING TO DO TONIGHT.

WE ARE NOT GOING TO START SHOUTING FROM THE AUDIENCE.

THIS IS THE FORMAT FOR THE MEETING.

WE HAVE A SPEAKER, WHEN THE SPEAKER HAS DONE SPEAKING, PRESENTING THE PROPOSAL, THEN MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION GET TO ASK QUESTIONS.

ONCE THE SPEAKER IS DONE, I WILL ASK ANYONE WHO WANTS TO SPEAK IN SUPPORT OF THIS TO SPEAK.

NOW, TONIGHT WE'RE USING A SIGN-UP SEAT BECAUSE THE SIZE OF THIS CROWD IS UNPRECEDENTED.

I HAVE BEEN A MEMBER OF THIS COMMISSION SINCE 2015.

I HAVE NEVER SEEN A CROWD THAT OVERFLOWED OUT OF THE ROOM, SO WE'RE DOING THE VERY BEST WE CAN.

>> SO DISRESPECTFUL.

>> GO AHEAD.

>> GREG, TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION DIRECTLY AS TO WHETHER OR NOT IS PUBLIC INPUT IS PART OF A PERFORMANCE MEASUREMENT? THERE IS NOT. THIS IS NUMERICAL.

WE LOOK AT BUILDING PERMITS THAT WERE ISSUED, CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY THAT ARE ISSUED.

IT'S JUST WHAT IS ON THE RECORD.

THERE IS NO PUBLIC INPUT AS IT RELATES TO PERFORMANCE MEASUREMENT AND QUANTIFYING THINGS.

DOES THAT HELP ANSWER YOUR QUESTION?

>> IT DOES. [OVERLAPPING] THANK YOU VERY MUCH, ANGELA.

>> GREAT. THANK YOU. YOU'RE WELCOME.

>> I ASK ONE MORE FOLLOW ON TO THAT.

>> TRY TO AH.

>> SURE. THE QUESTION I WOULD HAVE IS WHY THERE WOULD NOT BE A REOPENING OF A PUBLIC DEBATE ON AN ANNUAL BASIS, YOU WOULD BE TRACKING THE DATA, WOULD THERE BE, I GUESS, A QUALITATIVE-TYPE IMPACT ASSESSMENT AS WELL? IS IT HAVING THE DESIRED EFFECT? IS WHAT'S HAPPENING RELATIVE TO URBAN FABRIC, A POSITIVE, NEGATIVE? WOULD THERE BE ANY METHODOLOGY FOR ASCERTAINING THAT?

>> WELL, WE'RE DEFINITELY COLLECTING THE DATA BUT AS FAR AS THE QUALITATIVE PART, WE WOULD BE LOOKING TO MS. ALLEN TO TAKE A LOOK AT THAT OVER TIME.

IF WE NEED TO REVISIT BECAUSE SOMETHING IN THE CODE IS NOT WORKING, THEN WE WILL REVISIT THAT.

CODES ARE NOT WRITTEN IN STONE AND HERE WE ARE LOOKING AT THE ZONING CODE AT THIS TIME AND SO WE WILL REVISIT IT IF WE NEED TO.

>> ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS?

>> MA'AM, THE MICROPHONE IS ATTACHED TO THE PODIUM.

WE ARE DOING THE VERY BEST WE CAN.

THANK YOU FOR BEARING WITH US.

DOES ANYONE ELSE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> [BACKGROUND] I'M ASKING FOR QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMISSION.

ORDINARILY, I WOULD ASK FOR PEOPLE WHO WANTED TO SPEAK IN SUPPORT TO SPEAK AT THIS TIME BUT WITH THIS NUMBER OF PEOPLE, THAT IS NOT WORKABLE.

THAT'S WHY WE HAD THE SPEAKER SIGN-UP SHEETS AND THAT IS WHY WE ASKED YOU TO MARK WHICH AGENDA ITEM YOU WANTED TO SPEAK TO.

NOW, I'M GOING TO GO THROUGH THE SPEAKER SIGN-UP SHEET TO CALL PEOPLE WHO WANT TO SPEAK.

THE FIRST NAME ON THE SHEET IS MARY VICIA.

MS. VICIA DID NOT CHECK IN AGENDA ITEM, SO ARE YOU HERE TO SPEAK ON THIS ONE OR ANOTHER?

>> I APOLOGIZE. I DIDN'T SEE THAT [INAUDIBLE].

>> WE'D LOVE TO HEAR FROM YOU.

>> GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS MARY FISHER.

I'VE LIVED AT 317 OAKLAND STREET, AND I'VE LIVED IN DECATUR SINCE 1984.

MY PROFESSION IS A LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT, AND I WANT TO SPEAK NOT EXACTLY FROM A NEUTRAL POSITION, BUT I HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT THE PROPOSAL THAT DIDN'T SEEM TO BE ANSWERED BY THE PRESENTATION OR THE MATERIAL ONLINE.

[00:30:04]

I UNDERSTAND THE STATED GOALS WHICH THE CITY HOPES TO ACHIEVE BY ALLOWING MULTIFAMILY STRUCTURES IN THE SINGLE FAMILY ZONING DISTRICTS.

MY FIRST QUESTION IS BECAUSE ABSENTEE LANDLORDS WERE PROBLEMATIC IN THE PAST.

WILL THE PROPERTY OWNER BE REQUIRED TO LIVE ON SITE, IF NOT, HOW WOULD PREVIOUS PROBLEMS NOT BE REPEATED? IF IT IS REQUIRED THAT THE OWNER LIVE ON SITE, HOW WOULD THAT REQUIREMENT BE MONITORED? WHAT WOULD BE DIFFERENT FROM PRE 1986 CONDITIONS? WOULD IT EVER BE ALLOWED FOR THE INDIVIDUAL UNITS AND A TRIPLEX, DUPLEX TRIPLETS OR QUADRUPLETS TO BE SOLD INDIVIDUALLY LIKE CONDOMINIUMS, WOULD THE UNIT HAVE TO BE MAINTAINED AS A SINGLE OWNERSHIP AND THEN RENTED OUT FROM THE SINGLE OWNER.

IN A QUAD FOR EXAMPLE, WOULD ANY OR ALL OF THE UNITS BE AVAILABLE FOR SHORT-TERM RENTAL LIKE AN AIRBNB EVEN IF AN OWNER LIVED ON-SITE.

I'M SORT OF PROJECTING, THERE COULD BE POSSIBLE PROBLEMS IF YOU HAD THREE UNITS THAT WERE SHORT-TERM RENTALS, EVEN WITH AN OWNER ON-SITE, THAT'D BE A LOT OF COMING AND GOING FOR NEIGHBORS AND THAT SORT OF THING.

WHAT WOULD THE RECOMMENDATIONS OR REQUIREMENTS BE THERE? WOULD A MINIMUM SQUARE FOOTAGE BE REQUIRED FOR INDIVIDUAL UNITS? HOW SMALL IS TOO SMALL, EFFICIENCY APARTMENTS 400 SQUARE FEET.

RECENTLY THERE WAS A NEW YORK TERMS ARTICLE ABOUT MICRO APARTMENTS IN TOKYO THAT ARE 95 SQUARE FEET, PROBABLY WOULDN'T WANT TO GO TO THAT EXTREME.

HOW DO WE WANT TO CONTROL LIVING SPACE BECAUSE THAT HAS AN IMPLICATION FOR QUALITY AND THE LENGTH OF TIME SOMEBODY WOULD LIVE THERE.

HOPEFULLY THE LONGER-TERM ATTENDANT YOU HAVE, THE MORE STABILIZING IT IS FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

AS FOR SAFETY, WHAT WOULD BE REQUIRED.

SPRINKLER SYSTEMS, WHAT OTHER SAFETY STANDARDS WOULD BE RELEVANT? WOULD OWNERS BE REQUIRED TO REGISTER THEIR STRUCTURE WITH THE CITY AND COUNTY AS MULTIFAMILY? WOULD EACH UNIT HAS ITS OWN ELECTRIC, GAS, AND WATER METERS? I DO QUESTION THE AFFORDABILITY FACTOR, IF A MILLENNIAL FOR EXAMPLE, CAN'T AFFORD A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME IN THE CITY OF EDUCATOR, HOW CAN THEY AFFORD A DUPLEX TRIPLEX OR QUADRIPLEX? I'M SURE AS YOU'RE ALSO AWARE, CORPORATE INVESTORS BUY UP A LOT OF RENTAL PROPERTIES.

IN FACT, THEY'RE CURRENTLY ACROSS THE COUNTRY DEVELOPING ENTIRE SUBDIVISIONS FOR THE PURPOSES OF RENTING THEM OUT WITHOUT THE INTENTION OF SELLING THE PROPERTIES.

THE RENTER SORT OF BECOMES TRAPPED IN THIS CYCLE OF AFFORDABILITY FOR PURCHASING SOMETHING WHILE THEY'RE RENTING.

OUR CONCERN IS IF YOU DON'T REQUIRE ON-SITE OWNERSHIP, WHAT IS TO PREVENT CORPORATE INVESTMENT AND REITS AND SO FORTH FROM COMING INTO THE CITY AND DOMINATING THE RENTAL MARKET.

WOULD CONVERSIONS OF EXISTING HOUSES BE INSPECTED BEFORE BEING RENTED TO ENSURE THAT ALL CURRENT BUILDING CODES ARE MET.

IN OTHER WORDS, BECAUSE SOMEBODY SAY I'M GOING TO DO PLAGUES AND JUST RUN OUT MY BASEMENT.

IS IT SAFE, IS IT UP TO STANDARDS? WILL ANY ADA REQUIREMENTS APPLY? IS DECATUR'S EXISTING INFRASTRUCTURE CAPABLE OF HANDLING AN UPTICK IN POWER, INTRANET, AND WATER CONSUMPTION.

MY STREET JUST EXPERIENCED A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, A YEAR-LONG REPLACEMENT OF THE SANITARY SEWER TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL OF OUR PARTIES COULD FLUSH IN THE FUTURE.

WHAT DO WE HAVE IN THE REST OF THE CITY AS FAR AS SANITARY SEWER.

FOR EXAMPLE, WHAT IS THE CAPABILITY? I REALIZE THAT WE'RE SAYING THAT THE IMPACT WOULD ONLY BE ABOUT 0.9 PERCENT.

BUT OVER TIME, I THINK WE NEED TO PLAN FOR LONG-TERM GROWTH.

I THINK WE NEED TO PLAN FOR INFRASTRUCTURE FOR 25, 50, 75 YEARS AND BEING ABLE TO ANTICIPATE WHAT THE TAXES WILL BE, WHAT THE BUILD-OUT WILL BE, AND THE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES WILL BE.

HAVE PROJECTIONS HAS BEEN DONE TO DETERMINE ANY INCREASED DEMAND ON CITY AND CITY POLICE AND FIRE.

OF COURSE, THE CITY SCHOOLS MAY HAVE ADDITIONAL STUDENTS AS WELL.

THAT SOUNDS PRETTY MINIMUM.

[00:35:02]

IS THERE A MINIMUM LOT REQUIREMENT FOR A DUPLEX, TRIPLEX, AND QUADRIPLEX? WOULD THE LARGEST NUMBER OF UNITS, FOR EXAMPLE, A QUADRIPLEX, BE ALLOWED ON A 50 BY 150 FOOT LOT, OR WOULD THAT BE RESERVED FOR A LARGER LAW THAT MIGHT BE A THIRD OF AN ACRE OR HALF AN ACRE.

THE IMPLICATIONS OF THAT ARE OBVIOUS.

IT'S MY OPINION THAT ALLOWING DUPLEXES FOR A PERIOD OF TIME, FOR EXAMPLE, FIVE YEARS, A REASONABLE AMOUNT OF TIME THAT COULD PROVIDE RELIABLE DATA THAT WILL INFORM THE CITY AND RESIDENTS WHETHER WE SHOULD ALLOW TRIPLEX IN QUADRIPLEX IN THE FUTURE.

PUTTING THE GENIE BACK IN THE BOTTLE WON'T BE EASY, AND LASTLY, AS A METHOD OF KEEPING RENTS DOWN, I THINK THAT IS A FOOL'S ERRAND.

I THINK THAT THE DIVERSITY COULD BE GOOD, I THINK THE VARIABILITY OF AGES AND A COMMUNITY IS GOOD.

BUT MY HUSBAND AND I ARE EXPERIENCED LANDLORDS AND I CAN TELL YOU FROM MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE THAT OWNING AND MAINTAINING RENTAL PROPERTY IS TIME-CONSUMING, EXPENSIVE, AND IT'S A TRUE COMMITMENT, ESPECIALLY IF THE LANDLORD INTENDS TO PROVIDE A SAFE, CLEAN, ADEQUATELY INSURED, AN UPDATED LIVING ENVIRONMENT TO FAMILIES AND INDIVIDUALS.

THERE'S A LOT OF LIABILITY INVOLVED, AND I HOPE THAT THE PEOPLE WHO EMBARK ON THIS ENDEAVOR UNDERSTAND THAT.

AT THIS TIME, I THINK THAT THE CITY HAS MORE DUE DILIGENCE TO PERFORM BEFORE PASSING OR BEFORE YOUR COMMISSION WOULD RECOMMEND THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE.

AS A REMINDER, CITIZEN DEMOGRAPHICS ARE CYCLICAL.

LIKE I SAID, I'VE BEEN HERE SINCE 1984 AND IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD, WHICH IS BEHIND THE TAQUERIA DEL SOL.

WHEN WE MOVED THERE, WE WERE THE YOUNGEST ONES.

WE DIDN'T HAVE CHILDREN, OUR OLDER SON JUST GOT MARRIED LAST WEEKEND, AND SO WERE SOME OF THE OLDER RESIDENTS.

BUT WE'RE STARTING TO SEE THE CYCLE STARTS UP AGAIN, SO DEMOGRAPHICS AREN'T STATIC.

I THINK TO ASSUME THAT WE'RE GOING TO AGE OUT AND NEED SMALLER UNITS IS TEMPORARY.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH. [APPLAUSE]

>> DAVID ZIMMER.

>> HELLO, MY NAME IS DAVID ZIMMER.

I LIVE AT 116 EVANS DRIVE, IN OAKHURST, ACROSS THE WAY.

BEEN THERE SINCE 1988.

I THINK AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND DIVERSITY ARE ADMIRABLE GOALS.

I'M NOT SURE THAT THIS IS THE APPROPRIATE WAY TO ADDRESS THEM AS I UNDERSTAND THE ORDINANCE, BECAUSE IT WILL HAVE POTENTIALLY HAVE DEGRADATION OF QUALITY OF LIFE.

I CAN STAND ON MY FRONT PORCH AND LOOK AT FOUR LOTS THAT NOW HAVE BIG MANSIONS, $1.4 MILLION MANSIONS THAT WERE PUT THERE IN PLACE OF THE TWO AND THREE BEDROOM HOUSES THAT WERE THERE BEFORE.

I THINK IF YOU WANTED TO LIMIT AFFORDABILITY, YOU SHOULD HAVE PROBABLY INSTITUTED SOMETHING TO KEEP FROM DESTROYING EXISTING AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN FAVOR OF BIG MANSIONS.

IN ADDITION, ARE ON STREET PARKING ALREADY TAKES UP PROBABLY ABOUT A THIRD OF THE SPACE ON THE AVERAGE EVENING.

WE GET OCCASIONAL COMPLAINTS FROM THE POST OFFICE ABOUT CARS BLOCKING ACCESS TO MAILBOXES AS IT IS, AND THAT'S WITH ONE GRANDFATHER, TRIPLEX, AND OTHERWISE SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLINGS.

I THINK PARKING WILL BE AN ISSUE.

TRYING TO ADD PARKING LOT WILL COME UP AGAINST THE IMPERVIOUS SURFACE REGULATIONS, AND ON EACH OF THOSE LOTS, BY THE WAY, THAT WERE CONVERTED INTO LARGER HOMES, THAT THERE WAS AN AVERAGE OF TWO CANOPY TREES TAKEN DOWN FOR EACH ONE.

I SUPPOSE SOMEWHERE REPLACED WITH SOME SAPLING THAT DOESN'T PROVIDE CANOPIES INTENDED BY THE CURRENT TREE REGULATIONS.

I THINK EXCESS DENSITY WILL DENIGRATE THE LIABILITY OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD, THE TRIPLEX IS THE ONLY DWELLING

[00:40:01]

IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD FOR WHICH I'VE HAD TO COMPLAIN ABOUT NOISE.

I THINK HAVING RENTAL UNITS LEADS TO LESS RESPONSIBILITY IN MANY CASES, AND THE INCREASED DENSITY IS GOING TO ADD TO TRAFFIC AND NOISE IN ADDITION TO THAT.

IN SHORT, I THINK AS PREVIOUS SPEAKER EMPHASIZE, THERE SHOULD BE MORE THOUGHT GIVEN TO QUALITY OF LIFE ISSUES AND NOT JUST DIVERSITY AND AFFORDABILITY.

[APPLAUSE]

>> PLEASE TRY TO REFRAIN FROM APPLAUSE.

ALL THAT DOES IS DRAG OUT THE LENGTH OF THE MEETING, AND I'M SURE THAT WE ALL WOULD LIKE TO GET OUT OF HERE BEFORE 11:00, 12:00 TONIGHT.

THE NEXT [INAUDIBLE] [NOISE]

>> I ACTUALLY BROUGHT HANDOUTS, BECAUSE YOU KNOW I USED TO BE A TEACHER AND ALL [LAUGHTER].

CANDY, HALLOWEEN'S COMING.

I WANT TO GET SOME FACTS.

[OVERLAPPING] [BACKGROUND] I ONLY HAD SIX.

I'M SORRY, I MISCOUNTED.

I MEAN ONE, ONE TO THE COMMISSIONERS BECAUSE YOU'RE THE ONES WHO ARE MAKING THE DECISION, SO THAT'S WHY I WANT TO SEE YOURS.

[BACKGROUND] CAN YOU ALL HEAR ME? [BACKGROUND] I'M SHORT.

MY NAME IS LYNN GATHER COLE.

I LIVE AT 1003 KT GURAGE DRIVE AND I'VE LIVED IN DECATUR FOR 30 YEARS.

I HAVE KIDS THAT ARE AND HAVE BEEN IN THE CITY SCHOOL SYSTEM.

I'M HERE TO TALK ABOUT THIS CHANGE TO THE VARIANCE, I MEAN, TO THE ORDINANCE.

[NOISE] I DID HAVE A QUESTION I'D LIKE TO ASK BEFORE I GET STARTED BECAUSE IT IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT TO HOW PEOPLE SIGN UP.

I'M CERTAINLY COGNIZANT OF HOW MUCH TIME THIS IS GOING TO TAKE BECAUSE THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE HERE WHO HAVE THINGS TO SAY.

WHEN WE GET TO THE END OF THE SPEAKING PERIOD, COULD WE ALLOW PEOPLE WHO JUST WANT TO COME UP AND SAY, THIS IS MY NAME, THIS IS WHERE I LIVE, I LIVE IN THE CITY OF DECATUR AND I AGREE OR I OPPOSE, CAN WE DO THAT?

>> WE'RE NOT GOING TO STOP ANYONE WHO WANTS TO SPEAK.

>> SO ANYBODY WHO WANTS TO SPEAK CAN SPEAK?

>> WONDERFUL. THANK YOU SO MUCH.

I'VE WATCHED A FEW OF YOUR VIDEOS.

I'M SORRY THAT YOU'RE USUALLY VERY LONELY.

[LAUGHTER] WE HAVE COME TO GIVE YOU COMPANY.

LET'S TALK ABOUT THIS.

THIS IS THE SECOND TIME THIS HAS BEEN PRESENTED.

THE FIRST WAS AN INFORMATIONAL PRESENTATION BACK IN YOUR LAST MEETING IN AUGUST.

I LISTENED TO THAT MEETING AND I DON'T THINK THE CITY HAS PRESENTED A CASE THAT SUPPORTS WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DO. LET ME TELL YOU WHY.

FIRST, YOU TALK ABOUT THAT WE HAVE DECATUR 2020, DECATUR 2030, THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK FORCE, ALL THESE THINGS SHOW COMMUNITY INVOLVEMENT AND WHAT WE AS A COMMUNITY WANT.

THEY DIDN'T INCLUDE THE COMMUNITY.

THEY INCLUDED NOT ONLY US, BUT PEOPLE WHO DO NOT LIVE HERE HAVING A VOICE IN THE STRATEGIC DIRECTION OF OUR COMMUNITY.

THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN TACTICAL AND STRATEGIC.

STRATEGIC IS, WHAT DO WE AS A COMMUNITY, PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN DECATUR, PAY TAXES IN DECATUR, OUR KIDS LIVE HERE.

WE WORK, THIS IS OUR COMMUNITY.

THIS IS WHERE WE LIVE. WHAT DO WE WANT? WE'RE VERY PROGRESSIVE VERSUS PEOPLE WHO DON'T LIVE IN DECATUR AND ARE COMING HERE TO PUSH THEIR OWN AGENDAS.

NOW, I'VE BEEN ON AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK BLOGS AND COME TO DECATUR, YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

TWO THINGS, I HAVE [INAUDIBLE] FRIENDS.

LET'S TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT DEMOGRAPHICS.

IN FRONT OF YOU I PULLED FROM THE BUDGETS FOR THE CITY OF DECATUR.

I WENT TO 2006.

[NOISE] I WON'T BE THAT GUY DRINKING WATER.

I PULLED SOME SAMPLE THINGS AND I WOULD LIKE TO CALL ATTENTION TO YOU.

IF YOU LOOK AT 2008, 2011, 2015, THOSE NUMBERS ARE ACTUALLY PRETTY STABLE.

NUMBER OF PEOPLE LIVING HERE, 18,000, 19,000, THINGS DIDN'T REALLY CHANGE.

[00:45:03]

IF YOU LOOK BETWEEN 2015 AND NOW, WE HAVE ADDED 5,250 PEOPLE INTO THE CITY OF DECATUR SINCE 2015.

OF THOSE, 3,734 WITH CHILDREN UNDER THE AGE OF 11.

WHEN WE TALK ABOUT NO KIDS COMING IN, WE HAVE ADDED 3,734 SINCE 2015.

THEY TALK ABOUT THE MISSING AGES.

THEY HAVEN'T CHANGED THAT MUCH.

BUT WE HAVE INCREASED THE NEXT GROUP UP 35 TO 54, WHICH ARE PEOPLE WHO HAVE KIDS.

WE'VE LOST PEOPLE IN THE 55 TO 64 RANGE, SOON AS THEIR KIDS GRADUATE SCHOOL THEY GET OUT OF HERE BECAUSE THEY CAN'T AFFORD TO STAY.

THEN WE HAVE THE OLDER POPULATION THAT WE LOVE.

THE MEDIAN AGE AND I THINK MEDIAN IS A MUCH BETTER INDICATION OF WHERE WE ARE THAN AVERAGE.

THE MEDIAN AGE IN 2008 WITH 36, WENT TO 38 IN 2011, WENT DOWN TO 35 IN 2017.

WE'RE AT 37 AND CHANGE NOW.

IT HASN'T CHANGED.

WE'RE NOT LOOKING AT HAVING, OUR MEDIAN AGE IS 50.

WE'RE JUST SEEING WE'RE BOUNCING ALONG.

THE OTHER THING I WANT TO PULL UP IS IF YOU TALK ABOUT DEMOGRAPHICS AND YOU TALK ABOUT RACE, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT GETS BROUGHT UP.

IT'S CHANGED, BUT IT'S BOUNCED AROUND AS WELL.

WE'VE GONE IN 2008, WE HAD IT WAS 65-30 AND NOW IT'S 70-26.

IF YOU JUST LOOK BETWEEN 2015 AND NOW, YOU'RE JUST SEEING SOME VARIABILITY, BUT THIS ISN'T ABOUT THAT.

THIS IS ABOUT THE VALUE OF OUR PROPERTIES.

ONE OF THE REASONS PEOPLE LEAVE DECATUR IS THEY CAN'T AFFORD TO STAY HERE.

BETWEEN NOW AND 2015, THE BUDGET FOR THE CITY OF DECATUR INCREASED $23 MILLION.

APPRAISED PROPERTY, INCREASED $1 BILLION.

THAT'S THE ASSESSED VALUE OF PROPERTIES WITHIN OUR COMMUNITY.

WE'VE GOT ALL THIS MONEY COMING IN.

WHAT'S HAPPENING IS THE CITY KEEPS SPENDING IT.

THEY THINK THEY HAVE A CHECKBOOK, IT DOESN'T HAVE AN END ON IT, AND THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE DOING, THEY'RE SPENDING MONEY.

THEY SPEND $600,000 TO BUY A PIECE OF PROPERTY IN THE NAME OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING, WHICH IS INTERESTING, IS IMPORTANT.

BUT WE AS A COMMUNITY SPENT A LOT OF MONEY ON AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND I DON'T THINK THIS COMMUNITY ACTUALLY KNOWS HOW MUCH WE BOUGHT A PARK.

THE PARK VALUE FOR THAT LAND, $9.5 MILLION.

THAT'S ON THE SOUTH SIDE.

THAT'S NOT EVEN COUNTING THE NORTH SIDE AND ALL THE OTHER PROPERTIES THAT WE PURCHASED.

IT'S A LONGER STORY, I DON'T WANT TO GO INTO THAT PART, BUT ANYWAY, SURPRISINGLY TO SAY THAT WE HAVE GONE FROM A CITY THAT HAD AN IN-DEPTH PER CAPITA, $1,514.

THEY ARE NOW, PER CAPITA HAS MORE THAN DOUBLED.

WE'RE AT $3,977 OF DEBT FOR THE PEOPLE OF THIS CITY.

IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT MAKING US AFFORDABLE, THAT IS HOW WE MAKE OURSELVES AFFORDABLE.

THE ONE THING THAT HASN'T CHANGED IS THE NUMBER OF PARKS THAT WE HAVE, NOT THE NUMBER OF PARKS, THE NUMBER OF FIELDS.

BUT ANYWAY, ONE OF THE THINGS I WANT TO TALK ABOUT AS THEY'RE TALKING HERE ABOUT THE PROPERTIES THAT WE HAVE.

WE HAVE MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING.

IT'S A COST FOR HOUSING, IT'S NOT A TYPE OF HOUSING.

WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT DECATUR AND YOU TALK ABOUT THE HOUSING THAT WE HAVE CURRENTLY, IT'S NOT ABOUT HOW MUCH LAND A PARTICULAR UNIT IS TAKING UP.

IT'S ABOUT HOW WE'RE SETTLED OUT.

IN DECATUR, 55.6 PERCENT OF THE UNITS ARE SINGLE-FAMILY, ONLY 55.6 UNITS ARE SINGLE-FAMILY, 44.4 PERCENT ARE MULTIFAMILY DWELLINGS.

I THINK THAT'S IMPORTANT.

WE HAVE OWNER OCCUPIED AT 66.9.

[00:50:01]

RENTAL IS AT 38.1 EQUALS 100.

DO WE WANT MORE RENTAL IN HERE? THERE'S PLENTY OF RENTAL PROPERTY.

JUST RENT YOUR APARTMENTS, DECATUR DOESN'T NEED MORE PEOPLE.

WE GOING TO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT WHAT THE CITY HAS NOT SHOWN.

THE MISSING MIDDLE IS A COST, IT'S NOT A TYPE HOUSING.

WHAT THIS ORDINANCE DOES IS IT ALLOWS PARKING.

WE'RE GOING TO ALLOW YOU SPLITTING UP PROPERTIES AND YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND PARK ON THE STREET.

NOW, THE CITY EDUCATOR HAS BEEN WORKING VERY HARD TO MAKE IT HARD TO GET AROUND DECATUR.

[APPLAUSE] WHAT HAS HAPPENED IN MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE BECAUSE I LIVE IN WYOMING PARK AND THEN I MOVED AROUND THE CORNER ANYWAY, I LIVED IN WYOMING IN A PARK BECAUSE THE TRAFFIC THAT'S ON COLUMBIA DRIVER DRIVERS NOW MAKE GOING THROUGH OUR NEIGHBORS PART OF THEIR DAILY COMMUTE.

YOU PUT CARS ON THE STREETS.

YOU'RE NOW MAKING IT EVEN MORE DANGEROUS FOR OUR KIDS ON BIKES, WALK AND ROLL TO SCHOOL TO GET AROUND THESE CARS, GET AROUND COMMUTERS WHO ARE TRYING TO GET AROUND OUR TRAFFIC TO GET WHERE THEY'RE TRYING TO GET.

THEY HAVEN'T SHOWN THAT THEY NEED TO DO THIS FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

WE HAVE SOMETHING CALLED THE EAST DECATUR TAD, WHERE THE CITY HAS GIVEN $5 MILLION TO AN APARTMENT COMPLEX FOR A COUPLE OF AFFORDABLE UNITS.

WE'RE WELL AT $20 MILLION OF THIS COMMUNITY INVESTING IN AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

ARE WE GOING TO LOSE OUR SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES TOO? IT SHOULDN'T BE SOMETHING THAT IS DONE WITH A BROAD BRUSH ACROSS THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY.

I CAN SEE INDIVIDUAL SITUATIONS, INDIVIDUAL UNITS WHERE IT MAKES SENSE, WHERE THEY COULD DO SOMETHING WITH THE PARKING, WHERE IT WORKS FOR THAT COMMUNITY.

BUT TO SAY, HEY, WE'RE JUST GOING TO MAKE IT, HAVE AT IT.

CITY OF DECATUR IS THE MOST DENSELY POPULATED CITY IN GEORGIA.

LET THAT SINK IN.

MOST DENSELY POPULATED CITY IN GEORGIA, WE ARE 4 SQUARE MILES IN A BIT.

THAT'S IT. THAT'S WHAT WE GET.

WE SHOULD NOT BE COMPARING OURSELVES TO ATLANTA.

ATLANTA IS THE LARGEST CITY IN ALL OF THE SOUTHEAST.

THAT'S NOT WHO WE COMPARE TO.

THAT'S NOT WHERE I LIVE.

I KNOW MY NEIGHBORS. WE WALK THE CITY, WE WALK THE STREETS TOGETHER.

WELL, BUT ANYWAY, WHEN THE CITY IS SAYING THAT THEY HAVE COMMUNITY OUTREACH, PAY REALLY CLOSE ATTENTION TO WHAT WORDS THEY'RE PUTTING ON THEIR THINGS AND HOW MANY PEOPLE ACTUALLY SHOWED UP.

THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK FORCE IN 2019, THEY WERE FORMED, THEY WENT OFF TO DO THEIR THING.

THE ONE THING THEY DIDN'T EVER SAY WAS LEGACY PARK.

IN DECEMBER OF 2019, THEY CAME HERE BEFORE YOU, NOT A SINGLE PERSON SPOKE IN SUPPORT OR OPPOSITION TO CHANGING THE PLAN FOR LEGACY PART FROM 80 UNITS TO 175 HOUSING UNITS IN OUR PARK, NOT ONE PERSON.

FIVE DAYS LATER, IT WAS VOTED IN BY THE CITY COMMISSION.

THAT IS WRONG AND IT'S NOT COMMUNITY OUTREACH.

THEY DIDN'T USE THE WORD LEGACY PARK, THE AD JUST LIKE THEY DIDN'T HERE SAY, WE'RE CHANGING THE ORDINANCES UNTIL THE BLUE SIGNS WENT UP.

THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN PEOPLE SEE THOSE SIGNS.

WE'RE LIKE, WAIT WHAT'S GOING ON? OKAY. IT'S IMPORTANT YOU ALL LIVE HERE.

THIS IS OUR COMMUNITY.

ONE OF THE REASONS I MOVED HERE, ONE REASON I'VE STAYED HERE IS IT'S A SMALL TOWN, CLOSE TO A BIG CITY.

WE HAVE THAT SMALL TOWN FEEL WE KNOW EACH OTHER.

I'D LIKE TO SEE THAT CONTINUE.

I THINK OTHER PEOPLE HAVE THINGS TO SAY.

I WANT TO THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME AND LET'S LOOK AT THE FACTS.

THE ONE THING I REALLY URGE YOU TO DO IS TABLE THIS.

DO NOT GIVE IT TO THE CITY OF DECATUR COUNTY COMMISSION.

THEY HAVE A PROVEN TRACK RECORD OF NOT PAYING ATTENTION TO WHAT WE AS A COMMUNITY WANT AND DOING WHATEVER THEY WANT. I'VE GIVEN THEM.

I CAN TALK OFFLINE, I'VE GOT SO MUCH INFORMATION I COULD SHARE WITH YOU.

BUT REALLY IT'S QUITE IMPORTANT.

DON'T GIVE IT TO THEM. THEY'LL PASS IT.

[00:55:01]

THEY'RE THE ONES THAT ARE BEHIND THIS.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME.

>> NATALIE GREGORY, [APPLAUSE] ARE YOU HERE TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM? [BACKGROUND] WHICH ONE ARE YOU HERE FOR? [BACKGROUND] OKAY. ELIZABETH MOOR.

WINTILL,.

>> LINDA RASCOFF.

>> THE NEXT SPEAKER ON THE LIST AFTER THIS ONE IS LINDA RASCOFF. GO AHEAD, SIR.

>> GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS WINTILL.

I LIVE AT 525 PONCE DE LEON AVENUE.

RIGHT HERE IN DECATUR.

I GUESS I DON'T UNDERSTAND COMPLETELY THE PROCESS.

IF I WANTED TO PUT AN ANCILLARY OR EXHILARATION DWELLING UNIT ON MY PROPERTY I WOULD HAVE TO GO BEFORE THE COMMUNITY BOARD AND ASKED FOR PERMISSION TO HAVE IT DONE.

THERE WOULD BE A SIGN IN THE YARD.

MY NEIGHBORS WOULD ALL BE ABLE TO GET UP AND SPEAK FOR OR AGAINST AND EVERYTHING, AND IT WOULD BE APPROVED OR DISAPPROVED ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS.

WHAT I DON'T UNDERSTAND IS IF THIS PROCESS MEANS THAT THEY'RE GIVING A BLANKET APPROVAL FOR THESE SO THAT IF AN INDIVIDUAL PROPERTY OWNER DECIDES TO DO IT, WELL, IT'S A DONE DEAL ALL THEY HAVE TO DO IS MEET THE BUILDING REQUIREMENTS.

IT JUST DOESN'T SEEM RIGHT THAT I'M NOT OPPOSED TO TRY PLEXUS DUPLEXES, QUADS I THINK THERE ARE SOME PLENTY OF PLACES THAT THEY MIGHT BE APPROPRIATE.

BUT JUST TO SAY THAT ALL R6, ALL ZONING AREAS, ALL RESIDENTIAL ZONING AREAS, ARE NOW OPEN TO THESE STRUCTURES I THINK IS TOTALLY WRONG.

I THINK IF THEY HAVE TO COME IN AND APPLY FOR THE ZONING, FOR A SPECIAL ZONING OR WHATEVER THE REQUIREMENT IS TO DO IT AND THE COMMUNITY GETS TO COME IN AND TALK ABOUT THEIR PROBLEMS WITH THAT PARTICULAR SITE, THEN IT'S A REASONABLE REQUEST.

I THINK THAT THE SPEAKERS BEFORE US, ESPECIALLY THE FIRST SPEAKER, HAD A TON OF THINGS THAT I'M NOT SURE HAVE EVEN BEEN ADDRESSED.

IF WE WERE SITTING HERE IS TALKING ABOUT AN INDIVIDUAL PROPERTY, ALL OF THOSE THINGS COULD BE ADDRESSED WITH SPECIFICS.

I'M AGAINST A BLANKET APPROVAL OF THIS, BUT I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH SAYING, WELL, YEAH, WE CAN HAVE DUPLEXES, TRY PLEXUS, QUADS, INNER NEIGHBORHOODS, BUT LET'S LOOK AT THEM ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU, SIR. JUST A POINT OF CLARIFICATION.

THIS DOES NOT NEGATE YOUR POINT.

WE HEAR YOUR COMMENT THAT YOU THINK THESE MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING TYPES SHOULD BE APPROVED ON A CASE-BY-CASE BASIS.

BUT IN TERMS OF AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, THOSE ARE NOT SUBJECT TO ANY SORT OF A PUBLIC HEARING REQUIREMENT.

IF YOU MEET THE MINIMUM PROPERTY SIZE AND YOU CAN COMPLY WITH ALL THE OTHER REGULATIONS, YOU CAN JUST GO AND PULL A PERMIT WITHOUT ANY SORT OF PUBLIC INPUT FOR AN ADU.

>> WE HAD ONE IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD THAT APPLIED, AND THERE WAS A MEETING, AN APPROVAL MEETING, AND IT WAS EITHER APPROVED OR DENIED.

THE NEIGHBORS CAME, TALKED, IT WAS ON A SHARED DRIVEWAY.

THEY'RE JUST ALL KINDS OF PROBLEMS WITH IT.

>> THAT'S WHY, IT DIDN'T MEET ALL THE REQUIREMENTS.

>> THEY HAD TO GET A VARIANCE.

WHAT HAROLD WAS SAYING IS WHEN YOU SAID IF IT WAS A CARTE BLANCHE APPROVAL, IF IT MET ALL THE REQUIREMENTS, WOULD THEY BE ALLOWED TO DO IT? CURRENTLY, THE WAY AN ADU IS STRUCTURED IS IF IT DOES MEET ALL THE REQUIREMENTS, IT'S ALLOWED.

THE REASON WHY I SPECULATE, THE REASON WHY THEY WERE ASKING FOR THEY DIDN'T HAVE EVERYTHING THAT MET ALL THE REQUIREMENTS.

>> BUT TO BE CLEAR, THAT DOESN'T TAKE AWAY THE REST OF YOUR COMMENTS.

>> SOMEONE IF THEY WANTED TO DO A DUPLEX OR A TRIPLEX OR IN THEIR PROPERTY, AS IT'S CURRENTLY ZONED, THAN THEY COULD COME IN AND ASK FOR A VARIANCE AND IT

[01:00:05]

WOULD GO THROUGH AS A SUBJECT.. [OVERLAPPING] WHY DON'T WE DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

WE'RE NOT GETTING RID OF THEM, WE ARE NOT DISALLOWING THEM, BUT WE'RE LOOKING AT THEM ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS RATHER THAN A BLANKET. THANK YOU.

>> LINDA RASCOFF.

THE NEXT PERSON AFTER MS. RASCOFF IS KATHY SHANE.

[BACKGROUND] OKAY.

>> HI. I'M LINDA RASCOFF AND I LIVE AT 604 PONCE DE LEON PLACE, RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET FROM THE TILLS, I'VE BEEN HERE SINCE 1985.

I JUST HAVE A COUPLE OF THINGS BECAUSE MOST OF MY THINGS WERE ALREADY COVERED BY OTHER SPEAKERS.

BUT I REALLY DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW THIS WILL RESULT IN AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

BECAUSE WHO WILL BE ENFORCING OR WATCHING RENTS? WON'T THE RENTS BE CHARGED AT MARKET RATE? HOW DO WHY DO YOU THINK IT WILL BE RESULT IN AFFORDABLE HOUSING? WE HAVE PLENTY OF APARTMENTS ALL READY AND WELL BY MY STANDARDS, ARE NOT AFFORDABLE AND I DON'T KNOW WHY PUTTING IN MORE EVEN DUPLEXES, QUADRAT PLEXUS WOULD CHANGE THAT.

ALSO, I THINK THAT A NUMBER OF THEM WILL PROBABLY END UP BEING AIRBNBS AND THAT CERTAINLY DOES NOTHING TO HELP RESIDENTS WITH AFFORDABLE HOUSING THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU, LYNN TEAL WOULD YOU LIKE TO SPEAK ON THIS MATTER?

>> I THINK MY CONCERNS HAVE BEING ADDRESSED

DORIS MANN.

>> THANK YOU. DAVID SHARER.

>> AND THE NEXT PERSON ON THE LIST IS VALERIE WILSON, JUST SO THAT YOU KNOW YOU'RE UP NEXT.

>> MY NAME IS DAVID SHARER.

I LIVE AT 526, PONCE DE LEONE PLACE, AND I'VE BEEN CO-OWNER FOR PROPERTY THERE FOR EIGHT YEARS.

THE OBJECTIVE OR THE ISSUE WHICH THIS PROPOSAL IS INTENDED TO DEAL WITH IS LAUDABLE.

WE COULD DEBATE WHETHER THIS FIX IS THE RIGHT FIX.

BUT I DIDN'T SEE ANYTHING SERIOUSLY IN THE PRESENTATION WHICH ADDRESSED ANY [NOISE] CONSEQUENCES OF THIS CHANGE.

SO MY CONCERN ON THE BASIS OF WHAT I KNOW TODAY IS THAT I WOULD CERTAINLY IF ASKED, NOT SUPPORT IT.

WHY? TWO PRINCIPAL CONCERNS, I BELIEVE THERE ARE PROPERTIES IN MY IMMEDIATE NEIGHBORHOOD WHICH ARE CANDIDATES.

WOULD I WANT TO LIVE NEXT TO A DUPLEX TRIPLEX QUADRUPLETS? IN PRINCIPLE, I'M OKAY WITH THAT.

BUT I SEE TWO PARTICULAR AXUM ISSUES, ONE IS I SUSPECT THE ABSENTEE LANDLORDS WILL NOT BE AS CAREFUL WITH THE PROPERTY AND AS CONSIDERATE OF NEIGHBORS COMPLAINTS AS I WOULD LIKE.

I'M PARTICULARLY CONCERNED THAT INCREASING THE DENSITY ON MY PARTICULAR STREET OR OTHERS LIKE IT, WOULD LEAD TO EVEN MORE PARKING.

WE HAVE FAR TOO MUCH PARKING ON OUR STREETS BECAUSE IN MY OPINION, RESIDENTS DON'T LIKE TO USE THEIR EXISTING PARKING PLACES.

WE SAW IN THE PRESENTATION TODAY THAT DUPLEXES WOULD BE PROVIDING TWO PARKING PLACES, I BELIEVE SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

FRANKLY, I DON'T BELIEVE THAT THAT WOULD CATER TO THE PARKING NEEDS.

SO I WOULD BE OPPOSED TO AN INCREASE OF THE DENSITY, UNLESS THERE WAS SOME WAY TO REDUCE PARKING ON THE STREET OR MINIMIZE ADDITIONAL PARKING ON THE STREET THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU, MS. WILSON.

AND AFTER MS. WILSON IS KELLY RICHARDSON.

>> GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS VALERIE WILSON.

I LIVE AT 421 SOUTH MCDONALD'S STREET, JUST DOWN THE STREET ACROSS FROM AGNES SCOTT COLLEGE.

FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO THANK THE COMMISSION UPSET IN YOUR SEAT CANOFSOTTO WHEN I WAS ON THE SCHOOL BOARD HERE AND I'VE HAD AUDIENCES LIKE THIS WHO HARDWARE IN ONE POSITION AND ANOTHER,

[01:05:06]

OTHERS IN OTHER POSITIONS AND DIFFICULT DECISIONS TO BE MADE.

I'M NOT GOING TO GET INTO THE DETAILS OF THE DEMOGRAPHICS BECAUSE I'M NOT A PLANNER AND I CAN'T TELL YOU WHAT PLANNERS CAN TALK TO YOU ABOUT.

WHAT I CAN TELL YOU IS REGARDLESS OF WHAT YOU HEAR ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING, THERE IS A PROBLEM IN THE CITY OF DECATUR AS IT RELATES TO AFFORDABILITY AND FOR SOME OF US IN THIS ROOM, IT DOES NOT MATTER.

IT DOES NOT MATTER THAT PEOPLE CANNOT AFFORD TO LIVE IN THE CITY OF THE DECATUR.

I MYSELF HAVE LIVED IN THE CITY OF DECATUR FOR OVER 30 YEARS, I LOVED THE CITY OF DECATUR, IT IS MY HOME.

OVER 20 YEARS AGO, I TALKED TO THE THEN MAYOR OF THE CITY OF DECATUR BECAUSE AT THAT TIME I WAS WORKING FOR THE ATLANTA BELT LINE.

AND I SAID TO THE MAYOR, WE'VE GOT TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT AFFORDABILITY IN THE CITY.

BECAUSE OUR TEACHERS, OUR POLICE OFFICERS, OUR FIRE MEN, THE PEOPLE WHO WORK IN THESE BUSINESSES THAT WE LOVE TO GO TO, CAN'T AFFORD TO LIVE HERE.

AND WE GOT TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

NOW, I CAN'T TELL YOU IF THIS IS RIGHT OR THIS IS WRONG BUT WHAT I CAN TELL YOU IS THAT STRUCTURES ARE BEING PUT IN PLACE THAT WOULD AFFORD US THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE AFFORDABLE HOUSING, PERMANENTLY QUALITY AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN THE CITY OF DECATUR.

I SERVE ON THE DECATUR LAND TRUST AUTHORITY AND I'M EXCITED ABOUT THE POSSIBILITIES OF WHAT WE CAN DO IN THE CITY OF DECATUR TO CREATE QUALITY AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

MY SON GRADUATED IN 2010 FROM CITY SCHOOLS OF DECATUR, MY SON LOVES TO DECATUR.

HE WANTED TO COME BACK AND LIVE IN DECATUR. HE COULDN'T DO IT.

MY SON LIVES ON THE BELT LINE FOR CHEAPER THAN HE COULD LIVE IN THE CITY OF THE DECATUR.

WHEN I SAY, HE LIVES ON THE BELT LINE THAT HALLWAY IS THE BELT LINE FOR WHERE MY SON LIVES, HIS TOWNHOUSE, BUT HE COULDN'T COME BACK TO THE DECATUR TO LIVE.

HIS FRIENDS PARENTS, WHEN THEY GRADUATED, A LOT OF THEM MOVED AWAY.

THEY DIDN'T MOVE AWAY, THEY MOVED AWAY BECAUSE THEY NEEDED THE DOWNSIDE.

THEY DIDN'T NEED THE BIG HOUSES ANYMORE.

BUT THERE WAS NOWHERE ELSE IN THE CITY OF DECATUR THAT THEY COULD AFFORD TO GO LIVE, AFTER THEY SOLD THEIR HOMES.

NOW FOR SOME, THAT DOESN'T MATTER AND WHEN WE TALK ABOUT DEMOGRAPHICS, I WANT YOU TO LOOK AT THIS ROOM.

I WANT YOU TO THINK ABOUT WHAT TRULY, IF WE REALLY CARE ABOUT DEMOGRAPHICS AND THE CITY OF DECATUR, THIS ROOM WILL LOOK DIFFERENT.

BECAUSE THE DIVERSITY IN THIS ROOM WOULD BE DIFFERENT.

IF WE REALLY CARED ABOUT THAT.

BUT THAT'S SOMETHING PEOPLE HAVE TO DEAL WITH IN THEIR OWN HEARTS, BUT IF YOU CARED ABOUT DIVERSITY IN THE CITY, WE'D BE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT MY NIECE IS A BIOCHEMIST AT CDC.

HER HUSBAND WORKS FOR UPS, THEY WANTED TO LIVE IN THE CITY OF DECATUR, THEY COULDN'T AFFORD IT.

I DON'T WANT TO SEE DECATUR BECOME WHAT WE HAVE NOW AROUND THE ATLANTA BELT LINE, WHERE PEOPLE CANNOT AFFORD TO COME AND LIVE.

BECAUSE THAT WAS NOT SOMETHING THAT THEY DIDN'T PAY ATTENTION TO BEFORE.

GENTLE DENSITY IS NOT SAYING WE'RE GOING TO COME IN AND WE'RE GOING TO BUILD, WE'VE ALREADY DONE THAT LOOK AROUND THE CITY, WE'VE GOT APARTMENT IS EVERYWHERE.

WE'VE ALREADY DONE THAT.

THIS IS TALKING ABOUT CREATING THE OPPORTUNITY, I BELIEVE, FOR US TO CREATE AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND AFFORDABLE HOUSING TO SOME PEOPLE EQUATES TO SUBSIDIZE HOUSING AND A LOT OF PEOPLE SEE OTHER THINGS WHEN YOU SAY THAT.

BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE LIKE MY SON WHO WORKS EVERY SINGLE DAY, BEING ABLE TO COME BACK AND LIVE IN THIS COMMUNITY.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE LIKE MY NIECE WHO WORKS AT THE CDC AND HER HUSBAND FOR UBS BEING ABLE TO COME HERE AND LIVE AND RAISE THEIR CHILDREN.

THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SO THERE ARE ISSUES AND THERE ARE THINGS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE THAT I DON'T DISCREDIT SOME OF THE THINGS BECAUSE SOME OF THE ISSUES I THINK NEED TO BE ADDRESSED.

BUT I THINK AS A COMMUNITY, WE HAVE TO COME TOGETHER AND DETERMINED THAT WE DO NEED AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND WE DO NEED TO MOVE ON IT.

BUYING A PIECE OF PROPERTY DOES NOT AFFORDABLE HOUSING MAKE BUYING A PIECE OF PROPERTY IS HAVING A PIECE OF PROPERTY, BUT THEN YOU GOT TO DO THE WORK.

AND THAT'S THE PART THAT WE'VE GOT TO DO IN THE CITY OF THE DECATUR.

WE'VE GOT TO DETERMINE THAT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE WANT TO DO, SO I WOULD IMPLORE UPON YOU IF YOU DON'T MAKE THIS RECOMMENDATION OR IF YOU DO RAKE THIS RECOMMENDATION.

WE CANNOT WALK AWAY FROM HERE, THINKING THAT WE DON'T NEED AFFORDABILITY INDICATOR.

[01:10:01]

WE CAN NOW WALK AWAY FROM HERE THINKING THAT WE HAVE THE MIXTURE OF PEOPLE.

MAYBE FOR SOME PEOPLE WE DO, THAT IT'S OKAY.

IF WE SAY WE'RE THIS BELOVED DIVERSE COMMUNITY THAT WE ALWAYS TAUGHT WHEN WE'RE OUT AND TALKING ABOUT THE DECATUR, OUR BELOVED COMMUNITY, LET'S MAKE IT OUR BELOVED COMMUNITY AND DO WHAT'S RIGHT.

LET'S CREATE HOUSING OPPORTUNITIES FOR ALL.

FOR MY SON WHO'S 30 YEARS OLD, WORKS EVERY SINGLE DAY REALLY HARD.

LOVES THE CITY, HAS ALWAYS LOVED THE CITY, FOR THEM TO BE ABLE TO COME BACK HOME AND LIVE.

LET'S MAKE IT A COMMUNITY THAT BLACK PEOPLE AND HISPANIC PEOPLE AND PEOPLE WHO DON'T LOOK LIKE MOST OF THE PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM ARE ABLE TO COME HERE AND FEEL AS THOUGH THEY ARE WELCOME AND THEY HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO LIVE.

THAT IS WHAT WE NEED TO CREATE IF WE DON'T SAY WE'RE A BELOVED COMMUNITY SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU WILL DO WITH THIS, BUT I WOULD ADVISE YOU THAT THE LAND TRUST IS REALLY WORKING HARD TO CREATE PERMANENTLY AFFORDABLE HOUSING, QUALITY, AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR THAT MIDDLE-INCOME THAT MIDDLE HOUSING.

WE'VE GOT TO HAVE THAT INDICATOR BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE IT ANYMORE.

AND ONE PERSON CAME HERE AND SHE SAID IF SHE HAD NOT BOUGHT HER HOUSE WHEN SHE DID, THEY COULDN'T LIVE HERE 30 YEARS AGO.

IF MY HUSBAND AND I HAD NOT BOUGHT THAT HOUSE ACROSS THAT LOT, ACROSS THE STREET FROM AGNES SCOTT COLLEGE WE COULD NOT COME IN LIVE AND LET ME TELL YOU I DO ALL RIGHT.

HE DID ALL RIGHT BUT WE COULDN'T AFFORD TO LIVE IN THE CITY OF THE DECATUR.

THAT'S A PROBLEM AND IF NOBODY ELSE IN THIS ROOM SEES THAT WE GOT A BIGGER PROBLEM THANK YOU ALL.

>> THANK YOU [APPLAUSE] KELLY RICHARDSON.

>> HI. MY NAME IS ERIN WIENER.

>> BILLY.

ERIN WIENER.

I LIVE AT 507, WEST HOWARD.

BEEN THERE SINCE 2017.

I THINK AS IT STANDS, THE WAY THE ORDINANCE OR THE CHANGES OF THE ORDINANCES IS SHOULD BE DENIED.

I THINK JUST DOING THE BLANKET APPROACH, WHICH HAS BEEN SAID BEFORE, ISN'T A GOOD IDEA.

I THINK IT SHOULD BE LOOKED AT IT ON A CASE-BY-CASE BASIS.

I JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT AND THAT'S IT. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. LORI HAWKINS.

>> NO, I DON'T NEED TO SAY ANYTHING.

>> IRENE WHEELIE.

>> JOHN, IS THAT LICK LIKE BLAKE 255 WEST PARK?

>> LICK.

>> GOOD EVENING, MR. CHAIRMAN, COMMISSIONERS.

I'M JOHN LICK, I LIVE AT 255 WEST PARK WOOD ROAD AND HAVE LIVED THERE SINCE 1953.

I COME UP TODAY TO SPEAK IN OPPOSITION TO THIS PROPOSAL.

IT'S AN OVERREACH BY THE COUNTY OR BY THE COMMISSION.

I BELIEVE, THERE'S ALREADY A PROCESS.

YOU'RE FACING IT TONIGHT WITH A BUNCH OF THINGS FOR CONDITIONAL USE OF A PROPERTY.

THAT HAS BEEN USED THROUGHOUT A DECADE OR FOREVER IF YOU WANT TO CHANGE THE ZONING ON ONE PARTICULAR TRACT.

BUT BY COMING OUT WITH THESE AMENDMENTS, WHAT YOU'RE EFFECTIVELY DOING IS CREATING ANOTHER ZONING DISTRICT THAT ALLOWS WHAT THEY'VE TERMED AS WOKE UP FLAT, BUT IT HAS NO REAL SUBSTANCE TO IT.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE WHOLE UDO, THERE'S SOMETHING AMISS WITH IT.

WHEN IT DEFINES, IN DEFINITIONS FAMILY, THE FIRST SENTENCE IT SAYS, ONE INDIVIDUAL IS A FAMILY.

IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

A FAMILY IS DIFFERENT.

AN INDIVIDUAL AND TWO INDIVIDUALS.

OR THE PLURAL OF INDIVIDUAL IS TWO INDIVIDUALS.

IT'S NOT ONE INDIVIDUAL, IS A FAMILY.

THAT DOESN'T WORK, BUT ALL THROUGH THESE AMENDMENTS, IT TALKS ABOUT FAMILY.

YOU HAVE TO BELIEVE THAT WHAT THE PENMAN WHO WROTE THIS BELIEVED A FAMILY IS ME.

I'M A FAMILY AND THAT DOESN'T COMPUTE WITH ME.

I DON'T THINK WITH ANYBODY THAT ONE PERSON IS A FAMILY.

A FAMILY HAS ALWAYS BEEN A MINIMUM OF TWO SO I OPPOSE IT FOR THOSE REASONS.

FOR OTHERS AT THE STREET ON WIDE

[01:15:02]

ENOUGH TO HAVE OWN STREET PARKING THE WAY THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT.

THAT IS JUST OVERREACH. THANK YOU.

>>THANK YOU. MISS LICK.

>> NO, I WAS JUST SIGNING.

>> SEAN MAX.

>> IS THIS LOUD ENOUGH FOR PEOPLE IN THE HALLWAY?

>> IT'S LOUD.

>> OKAY. IS THIS GOOD?

>> YEAH. [OVERLAPPING]

>> ALL RIGHT, COOL. HI. MY NAME IS SEAN MAX.

I LIVE AT 350 HILLCREST AVENUE, UNIT 4 AND THAT LAST PART OF MY ADDRESS, I'M SURE YOU CAN TELL WHERE THIS IS GOING.

I JUST WANT TO START BY SAYING THAT THE PERSON IN YELLOW THAT SPOKE EARLIER BASICALLY TOOK THE WORDS RIGHT OUT OF MY MOUTH.

AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS NOT THE CONNOTATION THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE IN HERE HAVE WITH AFFORDABLE HOUSING ANYMORE.

IT'S FOR PEOPLE LIKE ME.

I'M IN COLLEGE RIGHT NOW, I GO TO GEORGIA STATE UNIVERSITY AND I LIVE IN A QUAD PLANKS WITH MY BOYFRIEND AND MY UNCLE AND THAT'S PROBABLY THE ONLY WAY I WOULD BE ABLE TO GO TO COLLEGE.

IF I WERE RENTING A UNIT BY MYSELF, I WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO AFFORD IT, ESPECIALLY IN THE CITY OF DECATUR AS WE SAW IN THE PRESENTATION.

BEING ABLE TO LIVE IN AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS GREAT BECAUSE I WANT TO START MY OWN LIFE AWAY FROM, I LOVE MY PARENTS, BUT AWAY FROM MY PARENTS.

I WAS ALWAYS TAUGHT THAT, YOU GRADUATE HIGH SCHOOL, YOU MOVE OUT, YOU GO TO COLLEGE AND YOU START YOUR OWN LIFE.

I FEEL LIKE THIS MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING IS EXACTLY FOR THAT PURPOSE.

ONCE I GRADUATE COLLEGE, I WOULD LOVE TO LIVE IN JUST A REGULAR HOME IN THE CITY OF DECATUR.

AS IT STANDS RIGHT NOW WITH THE PRICES OF THE HOUSES IN THE CITY OF DECATUR, I WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO DO THAT FOR A LONG TIME.

NOT AS A SLIGHT TO PEOPLE IN SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES, BUT IF IT TAKES TURNING MILLION-DOLLAR HOMES INTO AFFORDABLE MULTIFAMILY HOUSING TO GIVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO MY GENERATION THAT A LOT OF THESE PEOPLE HAD 20, 30 YEARS AGO, I'M ALL FOR THAT.

MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING IS THE NEW VERSION OF A STARTER HOME.

STARTER HOMES DON'T REALLY EXIST ANYMORE UNFORTUNATELY.

WITHOUT DUPLEXES AND QUAD PLEXUS AND MULTI-UNIT HOUSING, PEOPLE ARE EITHER GOING TO STAY WITH THEIR PARENTS LONGER ONCE THEY GRADUATE HIGH SCHOOL, OR THEY'RE SIMPLY GOING TO HAVE THEIR CHECKS BOUNCE AND BE HOMELESS.

I WANTED TO FOCUS ON DECATUR A LITTLE MORE.

WE'RE SQUAT IN-BETWEEN THREE TRANSIT STATIONS EASTLAKE, DECATUR AND AVONDALE.

INEVITABLY, MARTA IS GOING TO WANT TO DO SOME KIND OF TRANSIT-ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT AROUND THOSE THREE STATIONS IF THEY HAVEN'T ALREADY.

I FEEL LIKE THIS TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT THAT'S COMING TO THE FOREFRONT NOW.

IT'S GOING TO BRING IN A LOT OF BUSINESS, IT'S GOING TO BRING IN A LOT OF ECONOMIC REVENUE, BUT WE NEED THE RESIDENTS TO SUPPORT THOSE LOCAL BUSINESSES.

I FEEL LIKE IF WE'RE ABLE TO PUT MORE PEOPLE IN THE SAME AMOUNT OF SPACE, ESPECIALLY IN A CITY AS WALKABLE AS DECATUR, I FEEL LIKE THAT'LL BE A GREAT OPPORTUNITY FOR LOCAL BUSINESSES LATER ON TO BE ABLE TO GROW BEYOND THE CITY CENTER AND REALLY CATER TO THE PEOPLE IN THE NEW MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING THAT WOULD BE ABLE TO SUPPORT THEIR LOCAL BUSINESSES INSTEAD OF HAVING TO BUY THE CHEAPER THINGS ON AMAZON OR WHATEVER.

I DO HAVE A COUPLE OF CONCERNS ABOUT IT, NOT MAJOR, REALLY.

JUST ONE THING REALLY IS A CONCERN ABOUT STREET PARKING.

IF YOU'RE CONVERTING SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES TO MULTI-UNIT HOUSING, I'M NOT QUITE SURE HOW PARKING WOULD WORK.

I FEEL LIKE YOU WOULD HAVE TO INCREASE THE DRIVEWAY SPACE.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU ESPECIALLY FOR FOUR UNIT QUAD PLEXUS, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU WOULD WANT TO EXACTLY KEEP A DRIVEWAY.

I THINK YOU'D HAVE TO ADD THAT POINT, MAKE ACTUAL PARKING SPOTS.

THIS STREET PARKING IS OTHER PEOPLE HAVE BELABORED.

IT'S PRETTY BAD.

I DON'T KNOW IF THAT MEANS THAT FOR A CERTAIN NUMBER OF UNITS ON A PROPERTY, YOU WOULD HAVE TO COMPLETELY CONVERT THE PROPERTY TO SOMETHING MORE WHAT THE LEGACY DUPLEXES AND QUAD PLEXUS LIKE I LIVE IN.

[01:20:03]

I DON'T KNOW IF THAT MEANS YOU WOULD HAVE TO TEAR DOWN AND REBUILD OR WHATEVER, BUT I THINK IT'S JUST SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT.

ANOTHER THING TO THINK ABOUT IS RENT CONTROL.

AS THE PRESENTER MENTIONED, I DON'T WANT THIS TO BE AN INVESTMENT OPPORTUNITY TO PEOPLE.

I REALLY WANT THIS TO BE TRULY AFFORDABLE FOR PEOPLE LIKE ME TO GROW AND SUSTAIN THEMSELVES AND BUILD THEIR OWN LIVES.

IF THIS JUST BECOMES BASICALLY OPEN TO ANYBODY AND PEOPLE ARE GOING TO SNAP IT UP.

PROBABLY CORPORATIONS WILL SNAP IT UP BEFORE THE PEOPLE THAT ACTUALLY LIVE HERE.

IT'S JUST GOING TO KILL THIS ENTIRE PROJECT BECAUSE THEN NOTHING HAS FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGED.

THE RENT IS STILL EXTREMELY PROHIBITIVELY EXPENSIVE AND NOW THERE'S JUST MORE APARTMENTS, AND THAT'S NOT REALLY THE SOLUTION HERE.

THEN ONE QUESTION TO THINK ABOUT DEPENDING ON THE SIZES OF PROPERTIES THAT SOMEBODY MIGHT WANT TO CONVERT.

WOULD SOME PEOPLE LIKE SAY IF SOMEBODY WANTS TO BUILD A QUAD FLEX, WOULD THEY BE ABLE TO COMBINE LIKE TWO SINGLE-FAMILY LOTS INTO A FOUR OR SIX UNIT HOUSING BLOCK, AND THAT WOULD PROBABLY HAVE TO GO TO THE ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS AND STUFF LIKE THAT, BUT LIKE IS THAT ALSO AN OPTION TO HAVE A LITTLE BIT MORE SPACE FOR INSTEAD OF MAYBE TWO DUPLEXES NEXT TO EACH OTHER, BEING ABLE TO ADD A THIRD PROPERTY NEXT TO IT AND BEING ABLE TO MAKE TWO QUAD PLEXUS AND HAVING MORE PEOPLE.

BUT YEAH, I DID TO SUMMARIZE.

I'M ALL FOR IT.

I JUST THINK IT NEEDS TO BE DONE THE RIGHT WAY.

I THINK IT NEEDS TO BE TRULY AFFORDABLE SO THAT I HAVE THE SAME OPPORTUNITY AS A LOT OF THESE PEOPLE DID 25, 30 YEARS AGO. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU, MR. MAX. I KNOW THAT IT CAN BE VERY INTIMIDATING SPEAKING IN FRONT OF A BIG CROWD LIKE THIS, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU'RE ON THE YOUNGER SIDE, YOU DID A GREAT JOB.

>> THANK YOU. PLEASE EXCUSE ME IF I MISPRONOUNCE YOUR NAME, JADER ADAMS, 15, 67 PONCE DE LEON DRIVE. ALL RIGHT.

NEXT PERSON'S STRUCK THROUGH THEIR NAME.

FAUCET SKIP OR SKIP FAUCET.

THE NEXT PERSON IS JOAN CATO.

>> HI. I'M SKIP FAUCET AND I LIVE ON LAMONT DRIVE.

I THINK I COME IN SECOND, BEHIND THE GUY WHO'S BEEN HERE SINCE 1953.

I WAS BORN IN DECATUR, I WENT TO WINONA PARK.

WELL, I'LL STOP FROM THERE.

WHAT MADE DECATUR STRONG AT THE BEGINNING WAS COMMUNITY SCHOOLS.

NOW, OUR SCHOOLS HAVE GONE AWAY FROM THE COMMUNITY MODEL.

I MEAN, YOU'RE IN A SCHOOL FOR ABOUT THREE YEARS.

THAT'S ONE OF THE PROBLEMS WITH THE COMMUNITY THAT I SEE.

BUT HOW THAT RELATES TO HOUSING, MOST OF THE POINTS HAVE BEEN MADE.

I REALLY DIDN'T PREPARE COMMENTS, SO THESE ARE EXTEMPORANEOUS.

SEATTLE AND MINNEAPOLIS WERE POINTED OUT IN THE PRESENTATION. PORTLAND, SORRY.

I'M NOT SURE THOSE ARE TWO CITIES THAT WE REALLY WANT TO TRY AND FOLLOW.

I HAVE SOME CONCERN ABOUT THE PRESENTATION.

THE LANGUAGE, IT SEEMS VERY POSITIVE AND A LITTLE BIT FLOWERY, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF RECOMMENDATIONS AND THERE'S NOT SPECIFICS.

YOU HEAR RECOMMENDATION, BUT YOU DON'T HEAR REQUIRED.

ON DUPLEXES, EXCUSE ME, IT MENTIONS THAT THERE HAS TO BE ONE PARKING SPACE AND THEN COMPACT CARS PARKING ON THE STREET.

HOW DO WE ENFORCE COMPACT CARS? IF YOU HAVE A SPECIFIC QUESTION, I'LL GET BACK TO IN A MINUTE.

I WOULD ALSO ASK YOU TO TAKE A LOOK AT WHEN THIS WAS ATTEMPTED.

I THINK IT'S A VALIANT EFFORT, AS MS. WILSON POINTED OUT, TO GET THE PEOPLE WHO WORK ON BEHALF OF THE CITY TO BE ABLE TO LIVE IN DECATUR.

[01:25:06]

WELL, WE TRIED THIS ONCE, RIGHT UP ON THE TOWNHOUSES UP BEHIND THE HIGH SCHOOL.

I DON'T HAVE ALL THE FACTS ON THIS, I JUST KNOW FROM LIVING HERE.

AGAIN, I DIDN'T PREPARE LIKE THE ONE LADY WHO HAD HANDOUTS AND I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO PLEASE FOLLOW HERS.

BUT I THINK THERE WAS A MINIMUM TIME THAT THE OWNERS HAD TO LIVE IN THOSE HOUSES.

THAT WAS GREAT BECAUSE MOST OF THEM HAD TO WORK IN THE CITY IN DECATUR.

BUT AS SOON AS THEY'VE MET THAT MINIMUM TIME, THEY SOLD THE HOUSES, TOOK THE MONEY AND LEFT THE CITY IN DECATUR.

SPECIFICALLY, THE ONE THING THAT SEEMS TO BE MISSING, AND ANOTHER SOMEONE ELSE MENTIONED ABOUT THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT THE CATERER IS SPENDING IS, IS THEIR MONEY THAT IS UNDERGIRDING THIS EFFORT AND THE TAXPAYERS PAYING FOR THAT? I DON'T KNOW THAT MUCH ABOUT THE TRUST.

BUT I DO KNOW IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, I LIVE ON LAMONT, BY DARWIN LAMONT COME TOGETHER.

THREE YEARS AGO AND THE NEIGHBOR, HE WOULD BE HERE TONIGHT, INSTEAD HE'S TAKEN 101-YEAR-OLD MOM TO THE BEACH BECAUSE SHE WANTED TO GO BECAUSE SHE DIDN'T KNOW HOW MUCH TIME SHE HAD AND SHE WANTED TO GO TO THE BEACH.

HE'S NOT HERE, BUT I APPROACHED HIM BECAUSE A LOT OF PEOPLE FROM OUR NEIGHBORHOOD HERE, AND THEY'VE GOTTEN BITS AND PIECES AND THAT'S PART OF THE THING IS THE SPECIFIC INFORMATION DOESN'T SEEM TO BE COMING UP.

IF YOU WERE ON OUR STREET, HERE'S THE INFORMATION THAT'S COMING UP.

THE GENTLEMAN WHO OWNS THE PROPERTY, HE TOLD ME THREE YEARS AGO, HE HAD A CONVERSATION WITH ONE OF THE COMMISSIONERS AND HE WAS TALKING ABOUT AFFORDABILITY.

HE'S GOING TO LEAVE DECATUR BECAUSE TAXES ARE GETTING SO HIGH.

ONE POINT I WOULD MAKE ABOUT THE DECREASE IN AGING POPULATION IS MAYBE THEY SHOULD GO BACK AND LOOK AT THE TAX EXEMPTION THAT THEY JUST REMOVED FOR PEOPLE OVER 62 AND OVER.

THAT WOULD BE A WAY TO KEEP AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR OLDER PEOPLE.

THIS GENTLEMAN IS TALKING ABOUT SELLING HIS HOUSE.

HE COULD DIVIDE HIS PROPERTY, IT'S A TWO LOT PROPERTY.

THE HOUSE WHEN IT WAS REDONE BEFORE THEY BOUGHT IT WAS PROBLEMATIC AND I THINK THE NEIGHBORHOOD BACK THEN CAME AND PROTESTED BECAUSE THEY WANT TO PUT THREE UNITS THERE.

BUT APPARENTLY, THE CITY SOMEONE FROM THE CITY HAS COME AND MET WITH HIM.

HE SAID THERE WAS SOME TALK ABOUT A 99 YEAR LEASE FOR THE LAND.

THAT WOULD MAKE THE COST OF THE HOUSING LOWER.

BUT IT'S NOT TWO PROPERTIES, IT'S TWO DUPLEXES.

IF YOU LOOK AT THE DUPLEX, YOU'VE GOT TWO FAMILIES.

YOU HAVE PARKING FOR ONE CAR, AND THEN THE REST HAS TO BE ON THE STREET.

IT SOUNDS LIKE THAT'S CODE THROUGHOUT DECATUR.

BUT IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, MOST PEOPLE HAVE ENOUGH PARKING AND IT'S OFF THE STREET.

FOR EXAMPLE, WE CAN PART THREE CARS IN OUR PARKING BEHIND OUR HOUSE.

BUT IN THIS HOUSE SPECIFICALLY, THERE WOULD BE MORE PARKING AT AN INTERSECTION AND WE FACED THE SAME PROBLEM THAT WAS MENTIONED, IT'S A CUT THROUGH BECAUSE THEY'VE SLOWED DOWN THE TRAFFIC AND THE ENTRANCES INTO DECATUR.

IT'S A BROADER PROBLEM AND I WOULD REITERATE FIRST TABLING AND THEN GOING BACK AND DOING A LOT MORE WORK.

I APPRECIATE WHAT MS. WILSON SAID ABOUT AFFORDABLE, BUT THAT NEEDS TO BE A LITTLE BIT MORE QUANTIFIED AND QUALIFIED.

MY DAUGHTERS, I DOUBT THEY'LL BE ABLE TO COME BACK AND LIVE HERE.

IT'S NOT A PROBLEM THAT'S UNIQUE TO DECATUR.

I MEAN, ATLANTA HAS BECOME NOW ONE OF THE MOST EXPENSIVE CITIES IN THE US.

I WOULD ASK YOU ONE TABLE THE MOTION, TWO, GO BACK AND RESEARCH MORE AND ANSWER SOME OF THE MANY UNANSWERED QUESTIONS AND ALSO AVOID TRYING TO SWEEP THIS WITH A BROAD BRUSH. THANKS.

>> THE NEXT PERSON WHO SIGNED IN IS JIM AND JOHN KIDDLE.

[01:30:04]

>> NEXT AFTER YOU. I'M JOHN KIDDLE AND I LIVE AT 128 GARDEN LANE.

I'VE LIVED THERE SINCE 1986.

GARDEN LANE IS INTERESTING BECAUSE WE'VE GOT A NUMBER OF LEGAL, NON-CONFORMING, MULTI-UNIT DWELLINGS.

THE DEMOGRAPHIC OF THE FOLKS THERE ARE GENERALLY THE GROUP THAT HAS BEEN LOST, THE GRADUATE STUDENTS, THE YOUNG FAMILIES NOT WITH KIDS IN SCHOOL, BUT JUST HAVE STARTED A FAMILY.

IT MAKES FOR A WONDERFULLY DIVERSE COMMUNITY.

WE HAVE NOT HAD PARKING ISSUES, AND THESE ARE MOSTLY DUPLEXES RATHER THAN TRI OR QUAD-PLEXES, BUT YOU CAN ALWAYS FIND A PLACE TO PARK.

I FEEL LIKE THAT THE PROPOSAL BY CITY STAFF IS QUITE AN APPROPRIATE RESPONSE TO EVERYTHING WE'VE BEEN SAYING ABOUT THE MISSING MIDDLE, ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

IT PROBABLY WON'T WORK PERFECTLY, BUT IT'S WORTH A SHOT.

IT PROVIDES SOME OPTIONS IN WHAT CAN BE BUILT IN OUR COMMUNITY AND I ENCOURAGE YOU TO APPROVE IT. THANK YOU.

>> JIM ATKINS. JIM ATKINS.

>> OH DEAR.

>> OKAY. WE WILL COME BACK TO YOU.

>> YOU AND I DON'T KEEP ROLLED.

>> PAUL DACUS.

HOPE BAKER.

WE HAVE TWO IN ONE PART, BENSON AND THEN DENNIS BENSON.

>> I'M HOPE BAKER FOR MORE THAN 83 OF MY DRIVING.

I'VE JUST A REALLY QUICK THING TO SAY BECAUSE EVERYONE HAS REALLY ADDRESS A LOT OF MY QUESTIONS.

FIRST, I REALLY APPLAUD AND FULLY SUPPORT EFFORTS TO CREATE AFFORDABLE HOUSING INDICATOR AND TO REALLY BRING BACK SOME DIVERSITY THAT I FEEL LIKE WE'VE LOST.

I'VE LIVED HERE FOR 30 YEARS.

MY KIDS HAVE GONE THROUGH TO DECATUR CITY SCHOOLS.

ONE HAS BEEN ABLE TO COME BACK TO DECATUR.

THE OTHER ONE CANNOT AFFORD TO COME BACK INTO DECATUR.

BUT THE CONCERN I HAVE IS EVERYTHING I'VE HEARD SO FAR PRIOR TO COMING INTO THE UNITED HAS BEEN FOCUSING ON CREATING UNITS TO BE SOLD, NOT RENTAL UNITS.

THE CONCERN I'VE HAD WITH THAT IS JUST TO SKIP FAUCET MENTIONED THE UNITS THAT WERE BUILT DOWN ON COMMERCE IN HOWARD IS THAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THE COMMENT THAT WE'RE GOING TO LOOK AT THIS IN A YEAR AND WE'RE GOING TO DETERMINE SUCCESS BY THE NUMBER OF UNITS THAT HAVE BEEN CREATED.

BY DOING THIS, I'M MORE CONCERNED ABOUT THE EFFICACY OF THE WHOLE PROPOSAL AND THE PROCESS.

ARE WE TRULY GOING TO CREATE AFFORDABLE HOMES THAT PEOPLE CAN BUY? I'M WORRIED THAT IF IT'S BEING SUPPORTED BY THE CITY IN SOME WAY SO THAT YOU ARE OFFERING THE HOUSES AS A CERTAIN PRICE POINT THAT AS SOON AS THEY'RE ABLE, THE UNITS ARE GOING TO GO UP TO MARKET VALUE.

I THINK IF YOU TOOK MY HOUSE BY LOTS FAIRLY LARGE AND IT WERE TO BE CONVERTED TO THREE UNITS THAT COULD BE SOLD.

I JUST THINK YOU'RE GOING TO END UP WITH MORE 750 TO 1.5 MILLION DOLLAR UNITS.

THEY'RE GOING TO END UP BEING PUT ON THOSE LOTS.

MY CONCERN IS THAT REALLY DOING THE RESEARCH ON THIS TO ANSWER ALL THE OTHER QUESTIONS ARE GREAT QUESTIONS AND POINTS THAT OTHER PEOPLE HAVE MADE.

BUT ALSO JUST LOOK AT THE EFFICACY OF IT AND REALLY LOOK AT, IS THIS TRULY GOING TO CREATE AFFORDABLE HOUSING. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. PAT BENSON.

>> OUR ISSUES HAVE BEEN ADDRESSED.

>> I GUESS I'M A NEWCOMER.

I'M SORRY I LIVE OVER IN THE GREAT LAKES AREA.

[01:35:02]

I'M SORRY. I STAY A LITTLE OVER ON GREAT LAKES AREA.

WE'VE A NEWCOMER I GUESS WE'VE ONLY BEEN HERE NINE YEARS.

IN THAT TIME I'VE BEEN VERY IMPRESSED WITH THE CITY OF DECATUR AND WHAT THEY HAVE DONE WITH DIVERSITY AND TRYING TO COME UP WITH AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I THINK IT'S BEEN A GREAT JOB.

BUT I THINK SOMETHING IS BEING OVERLOOKED IS WE ARE NOT THE CITY OF ATLANTA.

THE YOUNG LADY THAT SPOKE EARLIER COMPARED OUR CITY.

AGAIN, MY MEMORY IS BAD, SO I WON'T TO TALK ABOUT IT THEN TO HUGE METROPOLITAN AREAS.

WE ARE NOT THAT THERE ARE SUBDIVISIONS IN GWINNETT COUNTY WHERE WE CAME FROM THAT ARE BIGGER THAN THE CITY OF DECATUR.

WE ARE BASICALLY A SUBDIVISION.

A SUBDIVISION WITH VERY NICE HOMES, WITH VERY NICE SERVICES OR POLICE AND ALL THAT WE GET.

I THINK THEY MENTIONED THAT WE WERE FIVE SQUARE MILES.

I WOULD THINK THAT 30 OR 40 PERCENT OF THAT AT LEAST IS ROAD SURFACE AND COMMERCIAL BUILDINGS.

WHAT DOES THAT LEAVE FOR HOUSING? THREE MILES. HOW MUCH CAN WE DO FOR DIVERSITY AND AFFORDABLE HOUSING? I MEAN, I THINK WE'VE DONE A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT GIVEN WITH WHAT WE HAVE TO WORK WITH, YOU CAN ONLY DO SO MUCH.

WE ARE BASICALLY A SUBDIVISION, THE LADY SAID THAT OUR AVERAGE HOUSES WERE $700,000 SO WE ARE BASICALLY A SUBDIVISION WITH 700,000-DOLLAR HOUSES.

THAT'S WHAT WE ARE. PEOPLE DON'T WORK HERE BY ENLARGE, THEY GO TO THE CITY OF ATLANTA OR WHEREVER IT IS, THEY GO TO WORK.

THEY COME HERE TO SLEEP AT NIGHT AND IT'S A WONDERFUL PLACE.

MY WIFE AND I GOT MARRIED IN 76, WE SPENT THE FIRST YEAR OF OUR MARRIAGE BUILDING UP MONEY AND GETTING OUR AVERAGE INCOME UP SO THAT WE GET BY OUR FIRST HOUSE, WHICH BELIEVE ME, IN SOUTH GWINNETT COUNTY WAS DEFINITELY AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

WELL, HOUSES RUNS $700,000.

I'M SORRY. JUST NOT REASONABLE.

THE WHOLE AREA HERE, EVEN OUTSIDE OF OUR CITY LIMITS, IS VERY MUCH LIKE THE CITY OF DECATUR.

I THINK EVEN IN THOSE AREAS, THERE HAVE BEEN LARGE APARTMENTS BUILT, TOWN HOMES, TRYING TO GET THE COST OF UNITS DOWN. THAT'S A GREAT THING.

BUT THERE'S ONLY SO MUCH YOU CAN DO WHEN YOU ONLY HAVE LIKE THREE MILES OF AVAILABLE RESIDENTIAL AREA.

I THINK WE'VE DONE GREAT WITH WHAT WE'VE DONE.

I DON'T REALLY SEE THAT WE CAN DO MUCH MORE IF WE WANT TO TOTALLY CHANGE THE WAY THE CITY WORKS AND THE WAY IT LOOKS, WE CAN COME IN AND BULLDOZE EVERYBODY.

YOU'RE ABOUT TO RUN ME OUT ANYWAY BECAUSE YOU DID TAKE MY TAX BREAK AWAY AT NINE GRAND PROPERTY TAXES.

I MAY WELL HAVE TO LEAVE AND YOU CAN MAKE A MULTI-FAMILY OUT OF MY HOUSE.

I LOVED THE CITY HERE AND I DON'T WANT TO SEE IT CHANGED, AND I THINK THIS IS HEADING IN THAT DIRECTION.

ALSO AS I UNDERSTAND IT, AND MAYBE ANOTHER GENTLEMAN ADDRESSED THIS, THERE ARE A LOT OF SUGGESTIONS IN THE PLAN AS TO WHAT DEVELOPERS HAVE TO DO.

BUT AS I UNDERSTAND, THERE'S NOT ANY, WHAT'S THE WORD I'M LOOKING FOR? THERE IS NOT ANY LAWS RELATED TO WHAT THEY HAVE TO DO.

THEY CAN COME IN AND BASICALLY DO ANYTHING THEY WANT TO, SO LONG AS THEY MEET THE BASIC BUILDING CODE.

YOU CAN PUT IN A NEIGHBORHOOD THAT HAS BEEN RESIDENTIAL FOR THE LAST HUNDRED YEARS, ALL OF WHOSE HOUSES ARE VERY DIVERSE, WONDERFUL TO WALK THROUGH, GREAT COMMUNITY.

YOU CAN PUT IN SOMETHING THAT TOTALLY IS AT ODDS WITH THAT.

I JUST DON'T THINK THAT THAT'S WHAT OUR CITIZENS WANT.

CERTAINLY NOT WHAT I WANT.

NOW SOMEONE ELSE MENTIONED THE MANSIONS THE CITY HAS ALLOWED.

WHERE IS THE DIVERSITY IN THAT?

[01:40:02]

THEY LET PEOPLE COME IN AND TEAR DOWN A PERFECTLY, WELL, EVEN THE HOUSE THEY TORE DOWN ACROSS THE STREET FROM ME WASN'T AFFORDABLE.

BUT THEY TORE IT DOWN AND PUT UP A $1.1 DOLLAR HOUSE AND RAN SOMEBODY OUT WHO POSSIBLY COULD HAVE BOUGHT THAT HOUSE.

I HEAR JUST A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT WANT TO TALK ABOUT LOW-INCOME HOUSING AND DON'T SEEM TO BE FOLLOWING THROUGH WITH IT EVEN AT THE CITY LEVEL.

IT SEEMS LIKE THEY JUST DON'T PLAN VERY WELL.

I LIKED THE CITY THE WAY IT IS.

I GUESS THAT'S WHERE I STAND.

>> THAT'S ME. [LAUGHTER]

>> WORK ON YOUR SIGNATURE.

>> ANDREW SILKS.

>> SHORTS.

>> SHORTS? PLEASE. EXCUSE ME.

>> HI EVERYONE. FIRST-TIME. IT'S GREAT. YOU GUYS ARE AWESOME.

I'M HONESTLY IN AWE AT ALL OF YOU AND HOW SAINTLY AND JUST FANTASTIC.

>> TRULY.

>> FIRST TIME IN A MEETING, LISTENED TO A LOT OF THINGS, LEARNED, A LOT OF THINGS.

SOMETHING I'VE NOTICED THAT MAYBE JUST FOR NEXT TIME, IT SEEMED AS IF THE TERM MISSING MIDDLE IS BEING MISCONSTRUED OR AT LEAST MISUNDERSTOOD BY A LOT OF FOLKS.

MAYBE JUST DEFINING THAT COULD HELP RESOLVE A LOT OF THE CONFUSION.

AS FAR AS I UNDERSTAND, IT'S NOT MEANT TO BE LOW-INCOME HOUSING IS THE SIZE OF THE UNIT.

I THINK THAT WOULD HELP ALLEVIATE SOME OF THE CONCERNS.

ANYWAY. I DON T THINK THIS GOES FAR ENOUGH.

I'VE BEEN HERE FOR TWO YEARS.

I'VE TOLD MY WHOLE STORY.

IT'S ALMOST NINE O'CLOCK, DOESN'T MATTER.

I'M INCREDIBLY LUCKY TO BE HERE.

NEVER THOUGHT I'D MAKE IT.

I'M SO HAPPY TO BE LIVING HERE AND I SHOULD HAVE STARTED THAT WITH MY ADDRESS.

I APOLOGIZE, 624 THIRD AVE IN OAKHURST.

A LOT OF THINGS I DON'T FEEL LIKE GO FAR ENOUGH, BUT ESSENTIALLY THE PARKING MINIMUMS, DO GRIND MY GEARS A LITTLE BIT.

WHY DO WE HAVE THEM? I KEEP SEEING THOSE SIGNS EVERYWHERE THAT DECATUR IS A BIKE FRIENDLY CITY.

I RIDE MY BIKE AROUND TOWN.

THIS IS THE LEAST FRIENDLY BIKING PLACE I'VE BEEN IN A LONG TIME.

DRIVERS TRY AND HIT YOU, THERE'S NO BIKE LANES.

IF THERE IS, IT'S SOME PAINT, THE TRAIL IS A JOKE AT BEST.

I ALMOST GOT HIT ON THE WAY HERE.

TURNING LEFT ONTO MCDONALD, A CAR AND THE RIGHT TURN LANE DECIDED TO PASS ME, TO TURN LEFT FROM THE RIGHT TURN LANE.

LOVE IT. IF ONLY WE HAD PROTECTED BIKE INFRASTRUCTURE, MAYBE WE WOULDN'T NEED TO WORRY ABOUT PARKING MINIMUMS. WE COULD JUST GET RID OF THEM.

NO ONE NEEDS TO WORRY ABOUT CARS ON THE ROAD.

IF YOU CAN WALK EVERYWHERE OR YOU CAN BIKE EVERYWHERE OR TRANSIT, WE'RE RIGHT SMACK ON THE MARTA LINE.

BUT HOW MANY OF US ACTUALLY TAKE MARTA WHEN WE COULD? INSTEAD, WE'RE DRIVING OUR CARS AND WE'RE PUTTING PEOPLE AT RISK.

IT'S A LITTLE BIT OFF TOPIC, DON'T WANT TO GO THERE.

BUT LET'S GET RID OF THE PARKING MINIMUMS. LET'S TRY AND DO SOMETHING LIKE TRULY PROACTIVE.

JUST PUTTING CARS ON THE STREET AIN'T REALLY THAT.

I DO WANT TO ALSO MENTION I GUESS REALLY FOR MY EXPERIENCE WITH ELDERLY.

I HAVE TWO GRANDMOTHERS THAT ARE STILL KICKING LATE IN THE 90S, AND I JUST HAD TO MOVE ONE OF THEM OUT OF HER SINGLE-FAMILY HOME IN A SUBURB TO A HOME BECAUSE SHE CAN'T DRIVE ANYMORE.

AS SOON AS SHE CAN'T DRIVE, SHE'S ON AN ISLAND.

THERE'S NOWHERE TO WALK TO.

WITH THIS MIDDLE, IT INCREASES THE DENSITY.

WE CAN HAVE WALKABLE COMMUNITIES AND NOT LOOKING AT THE ZONING MAP OVER THERE AND SO MUCH OF IF YOU LIVE IN LIKE CLOSE TO THAT RED AREA, YOU COULD WALK TO GET YOUR GROCERIES.

BUT I LIVE IN OAKHURST AND I CAN'T WALK TO THE KROGER.

I COULD WALK TO A FEW MARKETS WHICH ARE ALL RIGHT BUT I DON'T HAVE THE OPTION TO TAKE A BUS.

I DO HAVE A CAR BUT FOR THE ELDERLY FOLKS, AS SOON AS YOU CAN'T DRIVE WITHOUT THAT DENSITY,

[01:45:02]

YOU LOSE INDEPENDENCE, AND IT'S REALLY SAD WATCHING MY GRANDMOTHER GO THROUGH THAT AND I THINK THIS WOULD BE SUPER AWESOME TO HELP PROMOTE A COMMUNITY, WHICH WOULD BE NICE.

ON THAT, I STILL THINK IT'S RELATED TO THIS NOT GOING FAR ENOUGH AND INCREASING THE DENSITY.

I STILL DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY WE CAN'T HAVE LIKE LIVE WORKSPACES OR IF I DECIDE TO TEAR MY HOUSE DOWN, PUT A LITTLE SHOP UNDERNEATH A HOUSE I'VE GOT ABOVE THAT, WHATEVER.

THEY DID THAT IN CANADA PARK, IN THAT DOWNTOWN AREA, AND IT'S BEAUTIFUL.

IT INCREASES THE DENSITY, IT MAKES THE NEIGHBORHOOD MORE VIBRANT.

THERE'S PEOPLE OUTSIDE.

IT'S AWESOME.

WHEN'S THE LAST TIME YOU'VE LOOKED OUTSIDE AND THERE'S PEOPLE OUTSIDE BEING PEOPLE INSTEAD OF PEOPLE BEING IN CARS.

IT CHANGES THE VIBE.

I COULD GO ON FOREVER SO MANY PEOPLE ALREADY DID SO LET'S CALL THAT A DAY. THANKS EVERYONE.

I HOPE THIS GOES THROUGH AND I HOPE WE CAN START MOVING FORWARD FROM THERE, AND I'M GOING TO BE BACK.

THANK YOU. THIS HAS BEEN FUN.

>> IN YOUR RIGHT, OAKHURST IS NOT AS WELL-SERVED BY MARTA AS IT SHOULD BE.

AS A MATTER OF FACT, WHEN I MOVED INTO OAKHURST, THERE WAS AN ADDITIONAL BUS LINE THAT WAS TAKEN OUT BY MARTA.

[LAUGHTER] LET'S TAKE ACTIVISM TOMORROW. AGAIN, OUR BUS LINES.

>> WHAT WAS THAT ROUTE?

>> IT WAS ON, WAS IT FIFTH AVENUE OR FOURTH AVENUE? WELL, THERE WAS ONE ON SECOND, BUT THERE WAS ANOTHER ONE ON EITHER FOURTH OR FIFTH.

[OVERLAPPING] THAT'S AN ASIDE.

CASEY PARSER.

>> HI, I'M CASEY PARSER.

I LIVE ON 714 TWIN OAKS DRIVE.

I MOVED HERE TWO MONTHS AGO, SO PRETTY NEW TO THE DECATUR AREA.

I'M A COLLEGE STUDENT.

I GO TO CLASS WITH SHAWN WHO SPOKE BEFORE, AND MY MAJOR IS PUBLIC POLICY, SO THAT IS THAT'S WHY I'M HERE.

I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW THIS WAS HAPPENING TODAY.

I JUST CAME HERE FOR A CLASS.

[LAUGHTER] I'VE BEEN THROWN INTO THIS FIGHT.

WHAT I CAN SAY FROM MY KNOWLEDGE AND FROM MY EXPERIENCE, THIS POLICY IS AN EXPERIMENT.

IT IS SOMETHING THAT HAS NOT BEEN REALLY DONE FOR MANY DECADES.

AS DECATUR WENT THROUGH THIS OF [NOISE] REMOVING ALL THE DUPLEXES, REMOVING THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE FLEXIBILITY WITH HOW MANY FAMILY UNITS YOU CAN HAVE ON YOUR HOME.

THAT HAPPENED ACROSS THE WHOLE COUNTRY, AND WE HAVEN'T HAD A MOVEMENT WHERE CITIES HAVE REALLY LOOKED INTO AN ALTERNATIVE OF THE STATUS QUO FOR DECADES.

I THINK THAT WHAT MANY PEOPLE HAVE VOICED HERE IS FEAR.

FEAR OF AN EXPERIMENT THAT MIGHT GO WRONG.

FEAR OF A POLICY THAT MIGHT NEGATIVELY IMPACT THEM, AND THOSE FEARS ARE COMPLETELY VALID.

I DO THINK THAT AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE'RE IN A SERIOUS ISSUE ACROSS THE METROPOLITAN AREA OF NOT PEOPLE NOT BEING ABLE TO AFFORD TO LIVE.

I WORKED FOR A VERY LONG TIME WITH ATLANTA DOWNTOWN HELPING HOMELESS PEOPLE, THAT HAVE BEEN ALL ACROSS THE ATLANTA AREA.

THIS, IT TRICKLES DOWN, NOT HAVING AFFORDABLE HOUSING AFFECTS PEOPLE AT ALL LEVELS, AND EVEN THOUGH DECATUR DOESN'T SEE A LOT OF THE ISSUES ATLANTA SEES, WE SEE SOME OF IT AND IT'S GOING TO GET AND WORSE AND WORSE IF THE PROBLEM IS NOT ADDRESSED.

I THINK THAT LOOKING AT THIS DECISION, LOOKING AT THIS POLICY FROM THE PERSPECTIVE THAT THIS AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS AN URGENT NEEDED ISSUE THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED AND THAT THIS IS AN EMERGENCY THING THAT IS HAPPENING ACROSS THE NATION TO EXPERIMENT AND TRY SOMETHING THAT HASN'T BEEN TRIED FOR DECADES, AND THEN REWORK IT.

I THINK I'VE ALREADY HEARD FROM THE COMMISSION FROM HOW THEY ALL TALKED THAT THIS IS AN ONGOING DISCUSSION OF FIGURING OUT HOW THIS CAN BE IMPLEMENTED EFFECTIVELY, AND I BELIEVE THAT IF Y'ALL APPROVE THIS TODAY, THAT TWO, THREE YEARS DOWN THE LINE,

[01:50:03]

IF THERE'S ISSUES, THEY'LL BE ADDRESSED.

IF THERE'S CONCERNS ABOUT PARKING, THERE'S CONCERNS ABOUT UNSIGHTLY BUILDINGS BEING BUILT.

THERE'S MORE OPPORTUNITIES TO ADD REGULATIONS AND ADD THINGS THAT CAN FIX THAT.

BUT RIGHT NOW, IF NOTHING IS DONE, IF WE WAIT MONTHS AND YEARS TO ADDRESS THIS ISSUE, THEN IT'S JUST GOING TO KEEP GETTING WORSE.

SO DOING THIS TODAY AND EXPERIMENTING AND BEING CAPABLE OF HAVING THE OPPORTUNITY FOR CHANGE AND FOR SOMETHING NEW AND ACCEPTING THAT THERE MIGHT BE A LONG PROCESS TO HAVE IT WORK RIGHT AND WORK PERFECTLY.

I THINK IT HAS AN OPPORTUNITY TO HELP ADDRESS THE HOUSING AFFORDABILITY CRISIS AND HOPEFULLY MAKE THE CITY MORE DIVERSE AND A BETTER COMMUNITY. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH. JAMES CALASKI?

>> HELLO. MY NAME IS JAMES CALASKI I LIVE AT 501 WEST HOWARD AVENUE.

WE'VE BEEN HERE FOR ABOUT FIVE YEARS.

I WANT TO START OFF BY SAYING THANK YOU TO THE COMMISSION.

THIS IS A VERY SERIOUS ISSUE AND THERE'S A LOT OF RESPONSIBILITY ON YOUR SHOULDERS.

I APPRECIATE YOUR SERVICE TO THE GROUP AND TO OUR COMMUNITY, AND I ALSO WANTED TO THANK THE FELLOW FOR HER PRESENTATION IT'S NOT EASY HAVING YOUR WORK CRITICIZED AND SO MANY PEOPLE HAVING OPINIONS ABOUT IT.

IN THE SMALLEST WAYS I FOUND THE PRESENTATION A LITTLE IMBALANCED, THAT THERE WEREN'T REALLY ANY LIMITATIONS OR THERE WEREN'T ANY ADVERSE EFFECTS POTENTIALLY AT THE PROPOSAL OF WHAT WAS GOING TO COME.

I THINK WILL ALSO TOUCH ABOUT MS. WILSON'S PRESENTATION AS WELL.

I REALLY LISTENED TO WHAT SHE HAD TO SAY AND I THINK THAT THIS MISSING MIDDLE ISSUE WITH THE HOUSING IS VERY SERIOUS.

THAT HAVING BEEN SAID, I THINK THAT MY VOTE WOULD BE THAT THE COMMISSION WOULD HAVE TO SAY NO TO THIS PROPOSAL.

I THINK THAT THE TRAFFIC ISSUE IS VERY SIGNIFICANT.

THEN THE OTHER THING ALSO THAT I'M GETTING A LOT, IS A LOT OF MISTRUST LITTLE BIT FROM THE COMMUNITY WHEN IT COMES TO THE COMMISSION, AND THAT THEY HAVE SOME CONCERNS ABOUT IF POLICIES ARE SET IN PLACE, THEY WOULDN'T BE APPROPRIATELY POLICED.

MY RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE SIMILAR TO SOME OF THOSE WHO SPOKE EARLIER, IS THAT I THINK THAT WHEN THESE ISSUES COME UP, WHETHER IT'S A DEVELOPER, OR WHETHER IT'S A FAMILY, THEY WANT TO MOVE TO DUPLEX, TRIPLEX OR QUADS.

I THINK THAT OUR COMMUNITY IS SMALL ENOUGH THAT PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO COME IN AND PLEAD THEIR CASE ON A ONE-ON-ONE BASIS WHERE THEY CAN TALK ABOUT THE SPECIFICS OF THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD, THE SPECIFICS OF THEIR BLOCK, THE SPECIFICS OF THEIR COMMUNITY, SO THAT THEY CAN PITCH, THEY CAN EXPLAIN.

THEY CAN GIVE THEIR SIDE OF THE ARGUMENT BECAUSE IT SEEMS PRETTY CLEAR THAT THIS IDEA OF ONE POLICY FOR ALL OF THE HOUSING IT'S NOT GOING TO WORK.

IN ORDER FOR US TO HAVE WARMER RELATIONSHIPS WITH THE COMMISSION AND WITH THE CITY, PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO WORK ON A ONE-ON-ONE BASIS. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. SHERRY SINCLAIR?

>> I'VE BEEN HERE 38 YEARS IN OCHRES, MAYBE 40.

I DIDN'T WANT TO BE HERE. I COULD BE ON MY PORCH EATING ICE CREAM.

I SURE DIDN'T WANT TO BE SPEAKING EITHER.

BUT I WAS STANDING OVER THERE ON THE WALL AND I WAS LOOKING AT THAT ART PIECE THAT SAYS WELCOME AND INCLUSION AND ALL THOSE NICE WORDS.

THEN I HEARD ALL THESE SPEAKERS THAT MIRRORED A LOT OF WHAT I'VE READ ONLINE COMMENTS, AND ALL I HEAR IS THIS OVERARCHING LITANY OF FEARS.

WHAT IF? WHAT IF IT'S AN ABSENTEE LANDLORD? WHAT IF IT'S A RENTAL? A NEED FOR CONSTANT TINY DETAILS TO FEEL SAFE AND COMFORTABLE.

BUT MOST OF THESE PEOPLE DON'T CARE THAT WHEN THEY CAME HERE THEY COMPLETELY OVERTURNED THE COMMUNITY A REALLY NICE COMMUNITY THAT HAVE BEEN HERE FOR DECADES.

THAT DOESN'T SEEM TO OCCUR.

I HEAR A FEW PEOPLE SAY, OH, I'M ALL FOR DIVERSITY, [NOISE] BUT I THINK MS. WILSON HIT THE NAIL ON THE HEAD WHEN SHE SAID, A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T CARE.

THEY KNOW IT'S WRONG, BUT THEY REALLY DON'T CARE BECAUSE LIKE YOU'VE HEARD OVER AND OVER, WE DON'T WANT ANYTHING TO CHANGE.

WE WANT IT TO BE JUST LIKE THIS.

I HAVE A COUPLE OF THINGS TO SAY TO YOU AS COMMISSIONERS AND WHEN YOU HAVE THE PRIVILEGE OF BEING IN A POSITION OF LEADERSHIP, SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO DO THE VERY UNPOPULAR THING BECAUSE IT IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO.

SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO LEAD PEOPLE WHO ARE AFRAID, WHO DON'T WANT CHANGE,

[01:55:01]

WHO ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THEMSELVES AND THEIR PEOPLE AND CAN'T REALLY BE INCONVENIENCED OR CONSIDER CHANGES THAT WILL BE BETTER FOR THE WHOLE.

WE CAN'T LIVE IN A COMMUNITY LIKE THIS FOREVER.

YOU CAN'T LIVE IN YOUR LITTLE GATED WORLD AND THINK THAT THAT'S OKAY AND IT IS NOT.

SO I URGE YOU TO PLEASE PUT THIS THROUGH, ALLOW THIS SMATTERING OF NOT LOW INCOME, BUT WHAT? EIGHTY PERCENT OF THE MEDIAN INCOME, A SMATTERING OF PEOPLE, AND ALL OF THESE FEARS ARE REALLY MOSTLY JUST FEARS.

MY DAD TOLD ME 1,000 TIMES.

MOST OF THE THINGS YOU'RE AFRAID OF IN LIFE NEVER HAPPEN, SO PLEASE PASS THIS. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. DAVID SPENCER? [NOISE]

>> HI, EVERYONE. MY NAME IS DAVID SPENCER.

I LIVE ON SYCAMORE STREET.

BEEN HERE FOR WHAT THOUGHT IT WAS A LONG TIME UNTIL THIS MEETING.

BUT NOW I'VE BEEN HERE ABOUT 25 YEARS NOW.

MOVED HERE IN 97, WENT DOWN THE MORTAL LINE TILL I FOUND A HOUSE THAT I COULD AFFORD ACTUALLY.

THAT'S HOW I ENDED UP IN DECATUR.

I DIDN'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT DECATUR.

WE LIVED THERE FOR QUITE AWHILE, BOUGHT ANOTHER HOUSE IN DECATUR THE FIRST ONE WE MAINTAINED AS A RENTAL AFTER WE SOLD IT.

I'VE GOT A LITTLE EXPERIENCE RENTING PROPERTY HERE, IN DECATUR AND WE ENDED UP SELLING THAT FIRST HOUSE ABOUT FIVE YEARS AGO BECAUSE IT WAS NOT PRACTICAL TO OWN ANYMORE.

WE COULDN'T PAY THE TAXES ON THAT HOUSE AND STILL MAKE IT A WORTHWHILE INVESTMENT TO MAINTAIN.

WE SOLD THE HOUSE AND BOUGHT PROPERTY IN ANOTHER CITY WITH THAT MONEY.

THE SECOND HOUSE THAT WE LIVED IN HERE, A DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOOD OVER WINONA PARK.

THAT HAD BEEN A RENTAL FOR I COULDN'T EVEN TELL YOU, DECADES WHEN WE BOUGHT IT.

THE ONLY REASON IT WAS STILL STANDING IS BECAUSE IT'S THE 1920S HOUSE AND ACTUALLY BUILT WELL, BUT IF IT WERE NEWER HOUSE, I CAN ASSURE YOU THAT THE 20 YEARS OF ABUSE THAT HOUSE HAD AS A ABSENTEE LANDLORD OWNED RENTAL, IT WOULD NOT BE STANDING OR LIVABLE AT THE TIME WE BOUGHT IT.

I'LL JUST MAKE A FEW MORE QUICK POINTS.

FIRST OF ALL, THE PRACTICALITY OF WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IT JUST DOESN'T EXIST.

IF SOMEBODY BUYS THE HOUSE IN DECATUR, SAY AN INEXPENSIVE HOUSE IN DECATUR THEY'RE BUYING IT FOR $400 TO $500,000.

DO YOU PUT A QUADPLEX ON THAT.

LET'S JUST SAY THAT'S 4,000 SQUARE FEET.

YOU'RE LOOKING AT ANOTHER MILLION DOLLARS JUST TO BUILD IT OUT PLUS THE LAND.

THERE'S NO WAY THAT ANYBODY CAN DO THAT AND RENT THOSE UNITS AT A REASONABLE PRICE FOR WHATEVER THIS NEBULOUS CONCEPT OF MISSING MIDDLE IS, IT JUST WON'T HAPPEN.

IT DOESN'T WORK FINANCIALLY AND IF YOU'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT AFFORDABILITY IN DECATUR, I THINK YOU NEED TO START WITH THE TAXES IN DECATUR WHICH ARE OFF THE CHARTS AND YOU ALSO NEED TO TALK ABOUT, AND I HAVEN'T SEEN THIS BROUGHT UP.

BUT THE REGULATORY LOAD ON PEOPLE WHO TRIED TO DEVELOP IN DECATUR ADDS MASSIVE AMOUNTS TO THE COST OF CONSTRUCTION ON A PROJECT.

TAKE A LOOK AT THOSE FIRST BEFORE YOU GO AND ELIMINATE THE SINGLE FAMILY ZONING IN THE CITY.

THAT'S JUST MY THOUGHT. APPRECIATE IT.

>> THANK YOU. CAROL TINGHAM.

MARK ARNOLD.

>> GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS MARK ARNOLD.

I LIVE AT 15 GLENCORE AND I'VE LIVED IN DECATUR SINCE 1999.

A LOT HAS BEEN SAID WHILE THE GOOD THING, SO I'LL TRY NOT TO REPEAT EVERY GOOD POINT THAT'S BEEN MADE.

YOU GUYS HAVE TAKEN ON A VERY DIFFICULT ISSUE SO I APPLAUD YOU FOR THAT MAY HAVE BEEN SMART, MAYBE NOT SMART WE'LL SEE HOW IT PLAYS OUT.

LOTS OF GREAT POINTS RAISED, A LOT OF PASSION ON BOTH SIDES OF THE ISSUE.

I WILL REGISTER MYSELF AS SOMEONE WHO IS VERY MUCH IN FAVOR OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I'M ON RECORD.

[02:00:01]

I'VE TAKEN SOME VOTES THAT HAVE ADVANCED AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN THE CITY.

BUT I DON T THINK THIS PROPOSAL AS WORDED REALLY CAN DELIVER ON THAT GOAL.

I SUPPORT THE GOALS OF DIVERSITY, I SUPPORT THE GOALS OF EQUITY AND INCLUSION AND HAVING OUR WORKERS LIVE HERE.

I JUST DON'T SEE ANYTHING IN THIS LANGUAGE THAT REALLY SAYS THAT IF WE PASS THIS, WE WILL THEN ACHIEVE THAT SO I'M GOING TO JUST HIT A COUPLE OF POINTS MADE ON THE PRESENTATION.

I APPRECIATE THE WORK THAT WENT INTO IT.

I THINK IT COULD HAVE BEEN MORE BALANCED.

THERE'S SO LITTLE AGEISM USED IN THERE.

IT'S A DEDUCTIVE DEVICE THAT LEADS TO A FALSE CONCLUSION.

ATLANTA IS A CITY DECATUR IS A CITY.

ATLANTA HAS A GROWING POPULATION OF PEOPLE OVER 30 DECATUR THAT HAS THE DECLINING, ATLANTA HAS MORE DIVERSE HOUSE TYPES THEREFORE, THAT'S WHY DECATUR HAS, IT'S A FALSE DEDUCTIVE LOGIC.

THERE'S A LOT MORE THAT IT'S ATTRACTING PEOPLE UNDER 30 TO ATLANTA THAN JUST THE DIVERSITY OF HOUSE TYPES.

AS A RHETORICAL POINT I APPRECIATE IT, BUT THIS IS NOT DEBATE SCHOOL.

SECOND POINT IS THAT I WANT TO TOUCH ON, AND IT WAS RAISED BY A COUPLE OF PEOPLE THAT THERE'S NOTHING THAT REALLY SAYS, IF YOU PASS THIS AND PEOPLE COME IN AND INVEST, THAT THEY'LL WILL PRODUCE AFFORDABLE UNITS.

THERE IS A FEDERAL RESERVE REPORT THAT ATLANTA LEADS THE COUNTRY IN INVESTOR OWNED HOME BUYING.

FOREIGN INVESTOR OWNED INVESTMENT GROUPS OWN 27,000 UNITS IN METRO ATLANTA, THERE ARE CERTAIN ZIP CODES IN METRO ATLANTA WHERE IN 2021, 60-65 PERCENT OF ALL SINGLE HOME PURCHASES WERE BY INVESTOR LEAD GROUPS.

IN DECATUR YOU HAVE A APARTMENT COMPLEX THAT ABUTS PURE THE SERVICE SHOP GAS STATION ON PONDS THAT WAS BOUGHT BY AN INVESTOR AND THE RENTS WERE RAISED $1,000 OVERNIGHT.

THAT'S THE THING WHERE THIS PROPOSAL IS JUST SILENT ON.

THE OBJECTIVES ARE LAUDABLE, THEY'RE GREAT.

BUT THERE'S NO MECHANISM THAT ENSURES THAT IF WE TAKE ON THIS DISRUPTION, THE TRAFFIC, THE AMMUNITION OF QUALITY OF LIFE, WE'RE GOING TO GET THIS VERY WORTHWHILE GOAL.

WHAT THE MARKET SHOWN, THIS IS WHAT WE'RE LIKELY TO GET, IS VERY EXPENSIVELY PRICED UNITS, WHICH WILL NOT ACCOMPLISH THIS.

I THINK UNLESS YOU CAN PUT SOME REAL TEETH IN IT, HAVE A REAL MECHANISM MAYBE IF YOU WANT TO DO DUPLEXES, TRIPLEXES, WHATEVER, YOU'VE GOT TO COMMIT TO A REAL AFFORDABILITY NUMBER AND IF YOU'RE NOT WILLING TO DO THAT, THEN WE WON'T BE IN THE POSITION TO GIVE YOU THE LICENSING WAIVERS, WHATEVER.

BUT I THINK I APPRECIATE YOUR EFFORT, I DON T THINK YOUR PROPOSAL AS WORDED AND DRAFTED REALLY WILL ACHIEVE WELL, THERE'S SOME REALLY WORTHWHILE OUTCOMES, BUT THANK YOU FOR TRYING AND I HOPE YOU CONTINUE TO DO SO.

THANK YOU [APPLAUSE] MAX RUTHENBERG MARSHALL.

>> HELLO. I'M MAX RUTHENBERG MARSHALL.

MY PARTNER KEVIN AND I HAVE LIVED IN DECATUR FOR SEVEN YEARS.

WE ARE CURRENTLY BUILDING A HOME ON DREXEL AVENUE AND RENTING IN THE OMNI ACROSS THE STREET FROM HERE.

I'M SPEAKING IN THE UNIQUE POSITION OF SIMULTANEOUSLY BEING BOTH A HOMEOWNER AND A RENTER WITHIN THIS CITY.

AS MANY PEOPLE HAVE SAID, AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS A WORTHY GOAL THAT WE SHOULD WORK TOWARDS BUT I DON'T BELIEVE IT'S GOING TO BE ACCOMPLISHED BY THIS PROPOSAL BECAUSE THE RENTS HERE ARE ASTRONOMICAL.

THESE UNITS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IN THESE MULTIFAMILY DWELLINGS ARE NOT GOING TO BE THE OLDER APARTMENTS MENTIONED EARLIER THAT RENT FOR 1,700.

THEY'RE GOING TO BE ALL REMODELED OR NEW CONSTRUCTION BY DEFINITION BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO AT LEAST SUB-DIVIDE THE SINGLE-FAMILY HOME TO MAKE THIS POSSIBLE.

THE NEW RENTS, MY RENT AT THE OMNI IS DOUBLE THAT.

I DO NOT THINK IT IS REMOTELY AFFORDABLE AND I DON'T THINK WE'RE GOING TO CREATE AFFORDABLE HOUSING WITH THIS PROVISION EITHER.

IF WE GO FORWARD WITH A MULTI-UNIT PROPOSAL

[02:05:01]

IT SHOULD INCLUDE PROTECTIONS OF AFFORDABILITY.

I ALSO HAVE A QUESTION FOR MS. ALLEN.

MANY PEOPLE HAVE EXPRESSED A CONCERN ABOUT ABSENTEE LANDLORDS AND I SHARE THAT CONCERN.

IN HER PRESENTATION SHE STATED THAT THIS WAS NOT GOING TO BE A LUCRATIVE INVESTMENT OPPORTUNITY FOR LANDLORDS AND COMPANIES AND I WOULD LOVE TO SEE THE EVIDENCE THAT SUPPORTS THAT IF THAT COULD BE SHARED BY THE COMMISSION MAYBE ON THE WEBSITE OR SOMETHING.

I THINK IF THE EVIDENCE TRULY SUPPORTS THAT I BELIEVE A LOT OF PEOPLE'S CONCERNS ABOUT THIS WOULD BE ALLEVIATED.

UNFORTUNATELY AS A RENTER CURRENTLY, I HAVE BEEN REMINDED OF HOW UNINVESTED LANDLORDS AND RENTERS CAN BE AND THAT'S CERTAINLY NOT ALL RENTERS.

I THOUGHT MOVING INTO A RENTAL UNIT IN THE CITY OF DECATUR WHICH I'D ALREADY LIVED IN FIVE YEARS AT THAT POINT THAT I WOULD BE IN A GREAT, RESPECTFUL COMMUNITY AND I FIND THAT THAT IS NOT THE CASE.

CERTAINLY SOME OF MY NEIGHBORS ARE GREAT BUT MANY OF THEM TREAT THE COMPLEX WITH DISRESPECT I BELIEVE BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT INVESTED IN THEIR LONG-TERM RESIDENCE HERE.

THE RENTS GO UP AND THEY GET PRICED OUT.

THEY KNOW THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO MOVE BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO CONTINUE TO AFFORD IT.

EVEN AS A LANDLORD WITH A MAJOR COMPANY AS A LANDLORD THAT HAS A LEASING OFFICE AND MAINTENANCE PRESENCE ON SITE EVERY DAY, I DO NOT BELIEVE THEY CARE FOR THE APARTMENTS IN THE WAY THAT MANY OF THE HOMEOWNERS HERE IN DECATUR CARE FOR THEIR HOMES.

CONCERNS ABOUT PARKING HAVE BEEN MENTIONED AND I JUST WANTED TO DO SOME QUICK MATH TO ILLUSTRATE THE POINT.

THE STREET I'M BUILDING ON DREXEL ONLY ALLOWS PARKING ON ONE SIDE OF THE STREET.

IF A MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING UNIT WITH FOUR UNITS IS BUILT, IT WOULD BE REQUIRED TO HAVE TWO ON LOT PARKING SPACES, ASSUMING IT COULD HAVE TWO COMPACT CARS FIT IN THE FRONTAGE OF THE LOT WHICH I BELIEVE MOST OF THE LOTS ON THAT STREET COULD ACCOMMODATE.

IF ALL THOSE UNITS WERE FILLED BY FAMILIES THAT HAVE TWO CARS IF THEY'RE SAY A TWO ADULT HOUSEHOLDS OR THERE IS A TEENAGER DRIVING IN THE HOUSEHOLD AND THERE ARE TWO CARS PER UNIT, THAT MEANS SIX ADDITIONAL CARS WILL BE PARKING ON THE STREET.

THAT PHYSICALLY CAN'T HAPPEN.

WE WILL OVERFLOW THE SPACE THAT IS ON DREXEL AND HAVE TO FIND OTHER PLACES TO PARK.

I BELIEVE THAT IF ANY MULTI FAMILY DWELLING PROVISION IS APPROVED IT SHOULD INCLUDE AN ON LOT PARKING REQUIREMENT THAT IS CALCULATED SO THAT THE EXPECTED RESULTING STREET PARKING IS THE SAME AS IT WOULD BE FOR A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME.

IF THE LOT IS TOO SMALL TO CREATE ADEQUATE PARKING ON THE LOT UNDER THAT STANDARD, THEN IT'S TOO SMALL FOR THE UNIT.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

>> THANK YOU. ED PHILLIPS.

MARY LESLIE.

>> HI. I'M MARY LESLIE, I LIVE AT 221 GLENDALE AVENUE.

I'VE BEEN THERE SINCE 1978.

THANK YOU ALL FOR VOLUNTEERING YOUR TIME.

[LAUGHTER] PLANNING IS IMPORTANT WHICH IS HOW WE GOT HERE.

SORRY, I GET NERVOUS WHEN I TALK IN FRONT OF SO MANY PEOPLE.

THERE'S TANGIBLE AND INTANGIBLE REASONS WHY I DON'T SUPPORT THIS AND THE TANGIBLE ONES PEOPLE HAVE TALKED ABOUT.

SCHOOLS, TRAFFIC, PARKING.

THE INTANGIBLE ONE IS THAT IN 2014 OUR NEIGHBORHOOD WAS PUT ON THE REGISTER, GEORGIA REGISTER FOR HISTORIC PLACES.

THE CITY GOT A GRANT TO DO THAT.

I JUST GOT TO BREATHE. SORRY.

>> TAKE YOUR TIME. YOU ARE FINE.

>> TRYING TO GO FAST. [LAUGHTER] THE CITY GOT A GRANT SO TO MAKE THAT PROPOSAL AND SO THE CITY VIEWED THAT AS [NOISE] IMPORTANT.

IT WAS PLACED ON THE REGISTER AND IT WAS GOING TO BE ON THE NATIONAL HISTORIC REGISTER BUT I COULDN'T FIND ANYTHING ABOUT THAT.

MAYBE YOU ALL KNOW BETTER THAN I WHAT HAPPENED.

BUT I THINK THE HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE OF THE NEIGHBORHOODS IS IMPORTANT.

YOU LOOK AT SOME NEIGHBORHOODS LIKE ANSLEY PARK, THEY ARE IN DANGER OF LOSING THEIR STATUS AS A HISTORIC DISTRICT BECAUSE OF SO MANY KNOCKDOWNS AND I WOULD HATE TO SEE THAT.

I READ SOMEWHERE THAT, SORRY.

EVERYTHING THAT YOU DO IN A HISTORIC DISTRICT EITHER REINFORCES OR DILUTES ITS HISTORIC AUTHENTICITY AND ONCE THE HISTORIC VALUE IS GONE YOU CAN'T GET IT BACK AND THAT'S A LOSS.

[02:10:03]

WE TALKED ABOUT ABSENTEE LANDLORDS PROBLEMS, BLIGHT MAINTENANCE.

BUT I THINK WE GOT HERE BECAUSE THE CITY HAS BEEN VERY GENEROUS TO DEVELOPERS AND MISSED OPPORTUNITIES TO REQUIRE AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

OH, I FORGOT TO SAY THIS IS IMPORTANT, AFFORDABLE HOUSING I KNOW FIRSTHAND MY SON IS A POLICE OFFICER IN NASHVILLE, SO I KNOW HOW HE AND HIS WIFE CAN'T BEGIN TO AFFORD A HOUSE SO I KNOW HOW IMPORTANT THIS IS BUT I THINK WE'VE MISSED AN OPPORTUNITY AND PUTTING IT ON HOMEOWNERS NOW ITS TOO MUCH TO ASK SO THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. I KNOW THAT WAS DIFFICULT BUT [LAUGHTER] HEARING VOICES LIKE YOURS IS IMPORTANT FOR US AND THIS PROCESS.

THANK YOU FOR DOING THAT.

>> THANK YOU FOR BEING SO NICE.

>> ASHLEY MCCLURE.

>> MIKE CRAIG CRUISE CRAIG.

>> IT'S ME.

HI, MIKE CRAIG.

TWO VD SUPERIOR AVENUE DECATUR.

WE HAVE TWO UNITS ON OUR STREET, A DUPLEX AND A TRIPLEX.

[NOISE] WE'VE ONLY HAD ONE MURDER IN THE PAST 35 YEARS.

[LAUGHTER] I'VE GOT A LOT OF EXPERIENCE.

MOST OF IT'S GOOD.

BUT OCCASIONALLY THINGS GO BAD.

BUT I'M HERE TO NOT TO TALK ABOUT WHETHER IT'S GOOD OR BAD BECAUSE I THINK AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS GOOD.

I THINK THIS APPROACH IS BAD.

THE REASONS ARE, GEORGIA HAS A NO RENT CONTROL LAW. YOU CAN'T CONTROL THE WAY.

YOU CAN HAVE GOOD INTENTIONS, BUT THERE'S NO WAY YOU CAN CONTROL IT.

STREET PARKING.

YOU CAN'T CONTROL THE SIZE OF A CAR OR WHERE THEY PARK.

I THINK I WAS TOLD IF IT GETS BAD, YOU CAN MAKE IT PERMIT PARK.

NOBODY WANTS THAT.

THOSE TWO THINGS ALONE SAY, THIS CAN'T FLY THE WAY IT IS.

THE OTHER OPTIONS ARE THE DECATUR HOUSING, WHICH HAS THE ABILITY TO BUY SOMETHING AND MAINTAIN IT, RENT IT, SELL IT IF THEY WANT TO OR KEEP IT, OR ACTUALLY THEY CAN DO, LIKE THE OTHER GENTLEMAN SAID, MAINTAIN A LEASE ON THE LAND, SELL THE HOUSE.

WHEN THE PERSON WANTS TO MOVE IN TWO YEARS AND MAKE A BIG PROFIT, THEY CAN'T DO IT BECAUSE THEY DON'T OWN THE LAND SO THEY HAVE TO SELL AT A REASONABLE PRICE FOR THE NEXT PERSON.

IF YOU WERE TO TAKE AND SAY, OH, CITY DECATUR HOUSING IS GOING ON, STEROIDS AND FINDING X NUMBER OF APARTMENTS OR HOUSES OR LOTS AND WE'RE GOING TO BUILD DUPLEXES AND QUAD-PLEXUS AND WE'RE GOING TO RUN THEM AND WE'RE GOING TO MAKE SURE THEY'RE REASONABLE RENTS AND OR THEY'RE REASONABLE PRICE WHEN THEY'RE SOLD AND WE CAN CONTROL THAT.

I'D BE ALL FOR IT. BUT JUST TO OPEN UP A CAN OF WORMS AND SAY, EVERYBODY WILL PLAY NICE AND EVERYBODY WILL BE GOOD FRIENDS.

THAT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN AND THE GOOD EXAMPLE, ONE OF THE DUPLEXES ON OUR STREET GOT SOLD TO A COMPANY OUT OF MICHIGAN.

THE COMPANY OUT OF MICHIGAN AND BASICALLY BOUGHT IT BECAUSE THE PERSON WHO OWNED IT WAS DYING AND THEY BOUGHT IT FROM THE KIDS, BUT BASICALLY BOUGHT IT AND THEN ILLEGALLY STARTED REMODELING THE BASEMENT SO THEY CAN MAKE IT A TRIPLEX.

WELL, THE CITY SHUT THEM DOWN AFTER PEOPLE COMPLAINED, BUT THEY'VE STARTED BACK UP.

BUT AGAIN, THIS GROUP IS GOING TO FIX IT UP A LITTLE AND THEN THEY'RE GOING TO ASK FOR TOP DOLLAR.

THEY WON'T ASK FOR SOMETHING A COLLEGE STUDENT CAN AFFORD, AND THEY WANT TO, EVEN THE APARTMENT IN THE BOTTOM PROBABLY WOULD BE OUT OF THEIR RANGE.

YOU CAN'T CONTROL THAT BECAUSE THERE'S NO RENT CONTROL LAW.

YOU CAN'T CONTROL HOW MANY PEOPLE LIVE IN THEM.

BECAUSE YOU RENT A ONE BEDROOM, ONE BATH TO A PERSON AND A COLLEGE STUDENT PROBABLY AND THEN FIVE PEOPLE ARE LIVING THERE.

MY DAUGHTER DID IT, SO I ASSUME EVERYBODY ELSE DOES.

I'M JUST SAYING I CAN'T APPROVE THIS AS THE WAY YOU WANT TO GO FORWARD WITH IT.

BECAUSE I KNOW YOU CAN'T CONTROL IT. YOU CAN MEASURE IT.

YOU CAN SAY, OH, WE MADE 50 OF THESE AND A 20 OF THOSE AND I THINK YOU CAN SAY, OH LOOK, THESE SOLD AND THESE DIDN'T OR THESE ARE RENTED, BUT THAT'S ALL YOU CAN DO IS LOOK AT IT AND YOU GOT TO HAVE A WAY TO SHUT IT DOWN.

WHEN YOU DO OPEN IT, WHEN YOU DO THINK YOU'VE GOT A WAY TO MEASURE IT.

YOU ALSO HAVE TO HAVE TO HAVE THE CONTROLS IN PLACE WHERE YOU CAN SAY, HOW DO I SHUT THIS DOWN IF IT ISN'T WORKING FOR ME AND I HAVEN'T HEARD HOW YOU DO THAT AS WELL.

THOSE ARE MY MAJOR STATEMENTS.

I KNOW THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE DANCED AROUND THEM, BUT THERE'S LAWS AND YOU KNOW YOU CAN'T CONTROL RENT.

[02:15:02]

YOU CAN'T TELL PEOPLE HOW MANY CARS THEY CAN HAVE.

YOU CAN'T TELL SOMEBODY WHO RENTS A PLACE OR BUYS A PLACE, HOW MANY PEOPLE CAN ACTUALLY LIVE WITH THEM? I'VE SEEN ALL THE BAD SIDES, NOT INDICATOR, BUT OTHER PLACES AND THEY CAN HAPPEN HERE AND IT CAN BE EXACT OPPOSITE.

YOU COULD HAVE REALLY NICE BUILDERS, REALLY NICE LANDLORDS, AND THEY COULD SELL THINGS AND RENT THINGS FOR JUST WHAT EVERYBODY NEEDED AND EVERYBODY WOULD BE HAPPY.

BUT THERE'S NOTHING TO MAKE THEM DO THAT AND I DON'T THINK THEY WILL AND LIKE I SAID, I'M WAITING TO SEE ON THIS, I GUESS STILL A DUPLEX NOT TRIPLEX ON OUR STREET TO SEE WHEN THEY FINISH AND PEOPLE MOVE BACK IN EXACTLY WHAT THE PRICES ARE RENTING FOR.

BECAUSE I'LL STOP AND ASK THEM, BECAUSE I'M NOSY.

BY THE WAY, I'M ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE I LIVED HERE FOR 35 YEARS.

I'M THE SMALLEST HOUSE DOWN THE STREET AS SOMEONE MENTIONED TO ME ON A PHONE CALL.

DIDN'T NOT YOU DIDN'T KNOW IF MY HOUSE, BUT THAT WAS WHO YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT.

ANYWAY, I HAVEN'T REMODELED BECAUSE I HAVEN'T NEEDED THE SPACE.

IT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS WHERE PEOPLE REMODEL BECAUSE EITHER THEIR THING NEAT IS FALLING APART AND THEY NEED TO, OR THEY NEED THE SPACE.

BUT EVENTUALLY I'LL HAVE TO REMODEL AND WHEN I REMODELED, I'LL MAKE IT BIGGER.

BUT I WON'T MAKE A MCMANSION AND I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE WRONG THINGS ABOUT THE DECATUR.

THE REASON THINGS ARE AVERAGED 700,000 PRICES IS YOU DON'T HAVE ANY BUILDING RESTRICTIONS THAT KEEP PEOPLE FROM BUILDING 3,500 SQUARE FEET, THREE-STOREY BUILDINGS, AND SELLING THEM FROM 1.1-$1.4 MILLION.

IF YOU WANT THE AVERAGE PRICE OF A HOME TO COME DOWN IN DECATUR PUT SOME LIMITS ON HOW BIG HOUSES CAN BE IN THE FUTURE.

THEN YOU'LL FIND OUT PEOPLE WON'T PAY $1 MILLION FOR SOMETHING THAT'S 2,500 SQUARE FEET.

BUT THEY WILL PAY IT FOR SOMETHING THAT'S 35 OR 4,000 SQUARE FEET.

THAT'S ALL I HAD TO SAY. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH. ROBIN BITMEN.

>> JUST DECIDING TO LEAVE, THEN YOU CAUGHT ME.

THIS IS EXTEMPORANEOUS.

I DIDN'T PLAN TO SPEAK, BUT MY NAME IS ROBIN BITMEN AND I LIVE ON LAMONT.

>> MA'AM, COULD YOU PULL THE MICROPHONE DOWN SO THAT FOLKS CAN HEAR ALL OF THAT AS WELL.

>> YES, I CAN AS WELL. MY NAME'S ROBIN BITMEN.

I LIVE ON LAMONT DRIVE AND I LIVE IN THE FLOODPLAIN [LAUGHTER] AND I'M WONDERING IF ANYBODY'S LOOKED AT THAT.

ADDING WHEN YOU TALKED ABOUT IF THERE'S A STRUCTURE ON HERE AND IN ORDER TO MAKE A MULTI-UNIT STRUCTURE, YOU COULD ADD TWO STRUCTURES AND MAYBE PUT ONE BEHIND EACH OTHER, ONE NEXT TO EACH OTHER.

WELL, ON MY STREET AND ESPECIALLY WHERE I AM AT THE BOTTOM OF THIS STREET.

IF I WANTED TO TRY TO ADD ONE COLUMN, I WOULD HAVE TO GO TO THIS CITY AND I PROBABLY WOULD NOT BE APPROVED.

ADDING MORE STRUCTURES ON MY STREET THAT WOULD CREATE MORE IMPERVIOUS LAND USAGE IS A PROBLEM FOR THOSE OF US AT THE BOTTOM OF THE STREET WHERE ALL THE WATER FLOWS TO AND IN THE BACKYARD.

I DIDN'T HEAR ANYTHING DISCUSSED ABOUT THAT.

BUT IT GOES BACK TO THE ISSUE THAT OTHER PEOPLE BROUGHT UP IS THAT EVERY NEIGHBORHOOD, EVERY LITTLE CIRCLE AREA IS DIFFERENT.

SHE LIVES IN A HISTORIC AREA.

IN OURS THAT'S A REAL PROBLEM.

WE'VE HAD A LOT OF PROBLEMS IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD SO I WOULD BE VERY UPSET IF THEY WERE BUILDING A HUGE STRUCTURE OR TWO STRUCTURES UP THE STREET.

I FEEL SINCE I'VE LIVED HERE ABOUT 31 YEARS AND THE BUILDING IS JUST RUN AWAY CRAZY.

THE AMOUNT OF BUILDING IN DECATUR AND THE NUMBER OF MULTI-USE BUILDINGS THAT HAVE GONE UP, DOWN IN THE CITY, DOWN IN THE CENTER HERE IS JUST MASSIVE AND I DON'T UNDERSTAND.

I AM ALL FOR DIVERSITY.

I'M ALL FOR MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

IT ALL SOUNDS PERFECT.

BUT HOW WE DO THAT, I THINK IS SO IMPORTANT.

I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY ALL THESE APARTMENT BUILDINGS,

[02:20:04]

HUGE APARTMENT BUILDINGS EVERYWHERE, MULTI-USE.

WHY AREN'T THEIR APARTMENTS THAT ARE LEFT FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING? THAT WAS WHY ISN'T THAT A REQUIREMENT? WHEN YOU HAVE THESE, I'M JUST TALKING AS SOMEBODY WHO'S NOT KNOWLEDGEABLE, MAYBE THAT CAN'T BE DONE.

BUT YOU HAVE ALL THESE PEOPLE MAKING A FORTUNE OF MONEY OFF THESE BUILDINGS.

CAN'T THERE BE RULES? I KNOW WHERE I'M FROM IN NEW YORK. THAT'S WHAT THEY DO.

YOU GET THIS APARTMENT BUILDING, BUT YOU HAVE TO HAVE 10 UNITS THAT ARE AFFORDABLE.

THERE ARE JUST RULES.

I'M NOT YELLING AT YOU.

>> NO, YOU DON'T.

>> I'M JUST A PASSIONATE PERSON.

>> YOU ARE NOT CROSSING THE LINE AT ALL.

[LAUGHTER]

>> IT'S A QUESTION I HAVE.

I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE'S AN ANSWER RIGHT NOW.

I JUST WANT TO SAY MY SON IS 35.

HE COULDN'T AFFORD TO LIVE IN DECATUR.

HE WOULD LOVE TO, HE WAS BORN HERE.

WELL, HE WASN'T BORN HERE.

BUT WE MOVED HERE WHEN HE WAS LITTLE AND I LIVE HERE, BECAUSE WE FOUND A HOUSE THAT THERE HAD BEEN A MURDER, SUICIDE TERRIBLE.

[LAUGHTER] BUT IT'S TRUE.

[LAUGHTER] THERE WAS A REAL SALE ON THIS HOUSE [LAUGHTER] BEING FROM NEW YORK IT DIDN'T HAVE AN EFFECT ON US.

[LAUGHTER] SAD, BUT TRUE.

THAT'S HOW WE GOT TO DECATUR.

WE WERE BESIDE OURSELVES HAPPY TO BE ABLE TO LIVE HERE.

I THINK IT'S A PROCESS.

I THINK NOT EVERYBODY WHO LIVES HERE WAS BORN RICH AND PEOPLE HAVE WORKED HARD AND I THINK SOMETHING THAT'S NOT GETTING SAID, WHICH I THINK PEOPLE ARE WORRIED ABOUT AND I THINK IT'S BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION IS THAT WE'RE SCARED ALSO ABOUT OUR INVESTMENT.

WE'VE WORKED DAMN HARD TO BE WHERE WE ARE AND FOR A LOT OF US THAT ARE GETTING OLDER THAT'S OUR RETIREMENT.

WE WILL LEAVE ONE DAY AND THAT MONEY IS GOING TO PAY FOR WHATEVER WE HAVE TO PAY FOR.

I'D LIKE TO STAY HERE AS LONG AS I COULD.

BUT WE'VE INVESTED, I'VE INVESTED A LOT IN MY HOUSE BECAUSE I'M A HOUSE PERSON.

WE'RE SCARED, YEAH, BUT THERE'S A REASON.

IT'S NOT JUST IDLE FEAR OR FEAR OF DIVERSITY OR FEAR OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING, NOT FOR ME, IT ISN'T AND I'M SURE FOR MANY OTHER PEOPLE, AND I THINK WE NEED MORE DATA.

WE NEED TO SEE THE FACTS, WE NEED MORE SHARED WITH US SO WE FEEL SAFER.

ALSO, THE LAST THING I'LL SAY IS JUST A WAY TO HAVE REDRESS.

YOU DO SOMETHING, IF YOU DECIDE TO DO SOMETHING THAT THERE'S A WAY WE GET TO COME BACK OR WE KNOW, WE GET TO COME BACK AND LOOK AT IT ALL AND TALK ABOUT HOW THINGS HAVE GONE AND THIS GETS, IT'S BEEN SAID BEFORE, AND THAT WE HAVE MORE INFORMATION ON WHO'S GOING TO BE OVERSEEING THIS, WHO'S GOING TO OVERSEE THESE BUILDERS? HOW DO WE HAVE ANY ASSURANCES THAT THIS IS NOT GOING TO GO WRONG? THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU FOR INJECTING SOME MUCH NEEDED LEVITY IN THE PRECEDING, [LAUGHTER] ZACH WILCOX?

>> I ALSO LIVE ON LAMONT DRIVE AND WE HAVE A TRIPLEX, FIVE HOUSES TOWARDS CLAREMONT FROM US.

THAT HOUSE IS LISTED ON THE TAX RECORDS AS HAVING 1,800 SQUARE FEET BUT IT HAS THREE APARTMENTS.

HOW COULD THAT POSSIBLY BE? A. B, IT'S ASSESSED AT 40 PERCENT OF WHAT MY HOUSE IS ASSESSED AT.

SOMEONE'S MAKING CONSIDERABLY NICE MONEY, WHOEVER OWNS IT.

THREE DOORS FROM THAT HOUSE AND ALSO TWO OR THREE DOORS FROM ME, A PROPERTY JUST SOLD FOR $720,000 AND THEY TORE IT DOWN.

[02:25:07]

THEY BASICALLY PAID THREE-QUARTERS OF A MILLION DOLLARS FOR A PIECE OF PROPERTY IN THE CITY OF DECATUR.

LET'S JUST ASSUME FOR A MOMENT THAT INSTEAD OF THESE PEOPLE THAT ARE GOING TO BUILD A HOUSE ON THAT LOT, SOMEONE DECIDED TO PUT A TRIPLEX UP THERE.

THAT'S GOING TO COST A MILLION DOLLARS.

YOU'VE GOT $1.75 MILLION INVESTED IN THAT TRIPLEX.

DO YOU REALLY THINK THAT THAT'S GOING TO BE AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN THE CITY OF DECATUR? NOT WITH THE $1.75 MILLION INVESTMENT.

THAT DOESN'T EVEN INCLUDE THE TAXES.

THE CITY OF DECATUR, FOR SOME REASON ASSESSES PROPERTY, WHATEVER THE ASSESSED VALUE IS, THE CITY OF DECATUR CHARGES 50 PERCENT OF THAT.

I DON'T KNOW OF ANOTHER CITY OR COUNTY IN THE STATE OF GEORGIA THAT DOES THAT.

I DON'T GET IT AND MANY PEOPLE HAVE VOICED THE SAME THING I'M SAYING, I'M FOR DIVERSITY, I'M FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING BUT YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET IT THIS WAY.

PEOPLE ARE GOING INDIVIDUALLY, ARE GOING TO MAKE MONEY OF WHATEVER OCCURS.

IF THIS PASSED THE CITY OF DECATUR IS NOT GOING TO BENEFIT, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE DIVERSITY.

YOU TRIED DIVERSITY WITH SENIORS.

I'M A SENIOR.

WELL, AFTER FIVE YEARS THAT WENT THE WAY OF THE PINTO, THE WINDOWS 7, AND THE EDSEL.

[LAUGHTER] IT WAS DIVERSITY AND A GOOD IDEA UNTIL IT DIDN'T WORK FINANCIALLY AND ECONOMICALLY.

I DON'T SEE HOW THIS WILL EITHER. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU. TIM O'KEEFE.

>> THANK YOU FOR LISTENING TO ALL OF US.

I APPRECIATE YOUR WORK HERE TONIGHT.

I'M TIM O'KEEFE. I LIVE IN 612 THIRD AVENUE, THE OCHRES NEIGHBORHOOD.

I'VE BEEN THERE FOR 19 YEARS, AND I WANT TO SPEAK STRONGLY IN FAVOR OF THIS PROPOSAL.

WHEN I MOVED INTO OCHRES 19 YEARS AGO, IT WAS A MUCH DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOOD THAN IT IS TODAY.

IN SOME WAYS, IT'S A LOT BETTER NOW THAN IT WAS BACK THEN.

THERE'S LOT MORE RESTAURANTS, IT'S REALLY INTERESTING.

I LIKE THE OCH-RE'S MUSIC FESTIVAL.

I THINK THAT'S GREAT, BUT WE'VE LOST A LOT TOO.

WE'VE LOST A LOT OF DIVERSITY, BOTH RACIAL DIVERSITY AND SOCIOECONOMIC DIVERSITY AND I BELIEVE THAT THIS PROPOSAL IS NOT GOING TO BE A SILVER BULLET.

IT'S NOT GOING TO SOLVE THE PROBLEMS, BUT IT'S A STEP FORWARD I THINK THAT WILL HELP ADDRESS THE PROBLEMS. HOW WILL IT HELP ADDRESS THE PROBLEMS? A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE SKEPTICAL ABOUT THAT.

I THINK IT'S A SIMPLE MATTER OF SUPPLY AND DEMAND.

MY NEXT DOOR NEIGHBOR, WHEN I FIRST MOVED IN HERE, MARY AND ELTON AND THEIR SON MILTON, THEY HAD A FAIRLY RUN DOWN HOUSE.

THEY'D BEEN THERE A LONG TIME BUT MARY DIED, ELTON HAD TO MOVE OUT, AND THE HOUSE WAS TORN DOWN, AND AN ARLENE DEAN MASTERPIECE WAS PUT UP IN ITS PLACE.

THAT'S OKAY. I LIKE MY NEW NEIGHBORS, BUT IT WAS LIKE ONE BIG HOUSE.

I THINK IT WAS ONLY $650,000.

THAT'D BE NOW, IF SOMETHING WAS BUILT IN THAT SAME PLOT BY ARLENE DEAN, IT WOULD PROBABLY BE A MILLION DOLLARS, I'M SURE.

BUT WHAT THIS PROPOSAL WOULD ALLOW YOU TO DO, IT WOULDN'T BE SUPER CHEAP HOUSING, BUT YOU COULD BUILD A TRIPLEX THERE.

YOU COULD BUILD A QUAD THERE AND THEN IT HAS TO MEET THE SAME REGULATIONS IN TERMS OF THE IMPERVIOUS COVER, IN TERMS OF THE HEIGHT.

SO YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET THE SPRAWLING GIGANTIC THINGS, BUT YOU COULD BUILD SOMETHING THAT WOULD HAVE THE SAME FOOTPRINT, THAT'D BE MULTIPLE UNITS AND SO THE COST PER UNIT WOULD BE LESS.

PEOPLE CAN HAVE SMALLER PLACES AND THEY COULD GET INTO DECATUR.

IT WOULDN'T BE CHEAP, BUT IT WOULD BE SOMETHING.

IT WOULD BE A STEP FORWARD.

IT WOULD MEAN THAT INSTEAD OF HAVING THE SMALLER, OLDER MAYBE SLIGHTLY DECREPIT HOUSES TORN DOWN AND THEN A BIG MCMANSION FOR ONE FAMILY PUT IN THERE, YOU COULD HAVE MULTIPLE PEOPLE MOVE IN, MULTIPLE FAMILY MOVE IN AT AT LEAST A MORE REASONABLE PRICE POINT.

NOT THE TOTALLY RIDICULOUS ONE THAT WE HAVE NOW BECAUSE I COULDN'T AFFORD TO LIVE IN OCHRES NOW IF I HAD TO BUY A NEW HOUSE. NO WAY I COULD.

I THINK THAT THIS PROPOSAL DOES HELP MOVE US FORWARD, BOTH WITH MARKET MECHANISMS BUT ALSO WITH ALLOWING THE GOVERNMENT WHEN WE DO HAVE UNITS THAT THE GOVERNMENT CONTROLS, THAT THEY COULD BUILD THESE TRIPLEXES OR QUADS AND THEN HAVE IT WHERE IT'S RENT CONTROLLED OR SUBSIDIZED.

IT MOVES US FORWARD. I THINK WE NEED TO MOVE FORWARD.

A LOT OF PEOPLE IN HERE HAVE SAID THAT THEY'RE IN FAVOR OF DIVERSITY,

[02:30:01]

THEY'RE IN FAVOR OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING, BUT THEY DON'T LIKE THIS PROPOSAL.

WE REALLY HAVE A CRISIS HERE.

WE HAVE A CRISIS IN THE CITY OF DECATUR, BUT IT'S A LARGER CRISIS IN THE NATION, BUT ALSO IN THE METRO ATLANTA AVENUE.

WE CAN DO OUR LITTLE PIECE TO HELP THAT OUT.

BECAUSE YOU LOOK AT PLACES LIKE CALIFORNIA WHERE IT'S A DISASTER AND THE REASON IT'S A DISASTER WITH THE HOUSING IS BECAUSE OF ALL THESE DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOODS.

A LOT OF THEM VERY RICH NEIGHBORHOODS ALL BEING NIMBY, NOT IN MY BACKYARD.

ALL SAYING WE NEED TO HAVE SINGLE FAMILY HOUSES.

WE DON'T WANT APARTMENT COMPLEX, WE DON'T WANT DUPLEXES OR TRIPLEXES.

THEY WANT TO KEEP THOSE PEOPLE OUT AND THEREFORE, NOTHING NEW IS GETTING BUILT.

IT'S INCREDIBLY ONEROUS AND EXPENSIVE TO BUILD ANYTHING IN CALIFORNIA AND PLACES LIKE THE BAY AREA OR LOS ANGELES, AND IT'S THOSE BARRIERS TO BUILDING THAT HAVE MADE COSTS SKYROCKET.

WE'RE SEEING THE SAME THING HAPPENING IN THE ORLANDO AREA ALTHOUGH LUCKILY IT'S NOT NEARLY AS BAD HERE AS IT IS OUT THERE IN CALIFORNIA RIGHT NOW.

WE NEED TO BUILD MORE AND WE NEED TO BUILD MORE TYPES OF HOUSING, QUADS, TRIPLEXES, DUPLEXES.

WE NEED TO BE MORE DENSE.

IN A PLACE LIKE DECATUR, WHICH IS RIGHT NEXT TO THREE MORTAR STATIONS IN INTOWN ATLANTA WE SHOULD BE BUILDING MORE DENSELY.

I THINK IT'S GOOD FOR THE ENVIRONMENT TOO.

INSTEAD OF HAVING SUBURBAN SPRAWL, WHERE PEOPLE ARE GOING OUT AND DRIVING DOWN GEORGIA 585, THEY CAN LIVE INTOWN CLOSE TO WHERE THEY WORK.

IT'S GOOD FOR THE ENVIRONMENT TOO.

A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE RAISED ISSUES OR CONCERNS ABOUT THE QUALITY OF LIFE, AND WHAT'S GOING TO BE SO TERRIBLE? INSTEAD OF HAVING A MCMANSION NEXT DOOR TO ME, I COULD HAVE A TRIPLEX.

THAT'S FINE. SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE WILL BE RENTERS.

OH NO, THAT'S FINE TOO.

NOTHING WRONG WITH HAVING RENTERS BY ME.

THEY HAVE TO LIVE SOMEWHERE WHY DO WE WANT TO KEEP PEOPLE OUT WHO ARE RENTING? WE SHOULD WELCOME THEM TO DECATUR.

MY SISTER LIVED IN THE BOSTON AREA AND SHE LIVED IN A TOWN WHERE THERE WERE JUST TONS AND TONS OF THESE OLD TRIPLEXES UP AND DOWN THE STREET.

IT WAS BEAUTIFUL. I LOVED IT.

I THINK THAT WE SHOULDN'T BE AFRAID OF CHANGE, THAT WE NEED TO DO OUR PART TO HELP CONTRIBUTE TO SOLVING THIS PROBLEM.

THIS WON'T SOLVE ALL THE PROBLEMS, WE CAN REVISIT IT IF THINGS AREN'T PERFECT, BUT WE SHOULD APPROVE THIS PROPOSAL SO THAT WE CAN START MOVING FORWARD ON THIS CRISIS. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. PHILIP HODGES.

>> THIS IS EXHAUSTING, ISN'T IT? [LAUGHTER] WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SCARY NEW YORKERS COMING IN, BUT THANK YOU, PLANNING COMMISSION, FOR WHAT YOU DO.

THIS AS A THANKLESS JOB, AND I'D LIKE TO THANK THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK FORCE FOR VOLUNTEERING THEIR TIME.

I'M PHILIP HODGES.

I LIVE AT 234 WEST BENSON STREET IN OAKHURST.

WE MOVED HERE IN 2015.

I ENJOYED DECATUR AS A CHILD AND NOW I'M FORTUNATE ENOUGH TO BE ABLE TO ENJOY IT AS AN ADULT.

IT'S A VERY NICE PLACE TO LIVE, AND WE DO APPRECIATE IT.

I WOULD LIKE TO RAISE FOUR POINTS AND THEN HAVE SOME CONCLUDING REMARKS.

I'D LIKE TO EXPLORE WHETHER OR NOT THIS PROPOSAL SHOULD BE VOTED UPON IN A REFERENDUM.

CHANGING ALL OF THE SINGLE-FAMILY HOUSING ZONING FOR THE ENTIRE CITY OF DECATUR IS A BIG DEAL.

I THINK IT'S SO BIG THAT THE VOTERS, THE RESIDENTS, THE PROPERTY OWNERS SHOULD BE PRESENTED THE REFERENDUM TO VOTE ON.

THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK FORCE HAS STUDIED THE ISSUE OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND MADE ITS RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE CITY, AND I'M SURE THIS SMALL GROUP IS WELL-INTENTIONED AND HAS BEEN DILIGENT IN ITS STUDY.

HOWEVER, I WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT EVEN THOUGH THE CITY HAS TRIED TO PUBLICIZE ITS EFFORTS TO PROMOTE AFFORDABLE HOUSING, THE MESSAGE HAS NOT REACHED THE MAJORITY OF RESIDENTS AND THE RECOMMENDATIONS ARE COMING FROM A SMALL GROUP THAT IS BIASED TOWARDS PROMOTING AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I AM SUGGESTING THAT THE CITY AND THE AFFORDABLE TASK FORCE HAVE PRESENTED A BIAS VIEW FROM A SMALL GROUP WHOSE SOLE INTEREST IS IN PROMOTING AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

THEREFORE, THE RECOMMENDATIONS DO NOT INCLUDE BALANCED INPUT FROM THE MAJORITY OF THE RESIDENTS OF DECATUR.

ALSO IF YOU HAVEN'T FIGURED THIS OUT, MOST PEOPLE IN THIS CITY ARE AFRAID TO SPEAK OUT AGAINST THIS IN SEMINAL PROPOSALS, EVEN THAT DOESN'T SEEM TO BE THE CASE TONIGHT.

I CAN ASSURE YOU THERE ARE MANY PEOPLE LIKE ME WHO ARE HESITANT TO VOICE OUR TRUE CONCERNS BECAUSE IT'S JUST NOT POPULAR.

[02:35:02]

THEREFORE, IF YOU TRUST THE VOTERS IN DECATUR TO MAKE SOUND CHOICES, THEN TO FAIRLY CONSIDER THIS PROPOSAL, IT SHOULD BE PUT TO THE VOTERS IN A REFERENDUM.

NUMBER 2, I DON T BELIEVE THAT THE GOAL OF PROVIDING AFFORDABLE HOUSING WILL BE MET BY THIS PROPOSAL.

WHILE I BELIEVE THIS PROPOSAL WILL RESULT IN MORE DENSITY, I DON'T BELIEVE IT SOLVES THE ISSUE OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

WHILE DIVIDING A SINGLE-FAMILY LOT OR HOME INTO TWO, THREE, OR FOUR UNITS MAY REDUCE THE COST OF EACH UNIT, I DO NOT BELIEVE THOSE UNITS WILL MEET THE DEFINITION OF AFFORDABILITY.

I OFFER AS EXAMPLES, ONE, A ONE-THIRD ACRE LOT IN CANDLER PARK RECENTLY HAD TWO HOUSING UNITS BUILT ON IT.

THEY EACH SOLD FOR 1,000,150 EACH.

INSTEAD OF PERHAPS A ONE-AND-A-HALF MILLION DOLLAR HOME, YOU DO HAVE TWO APPROXIMATELY ONE MILLION DOLLAR HOMES, BUT THEY'RE STILL VERY EXPENSIVE AND I WOULD ARGUE NOT AFFORDABLE.

IT'S TRUE IN THAT CASE THAT TWO 1.2 MILLION DOLLAR HOMES WERE BUILT INSTEAD OF ONE, SAY, TWO-MILLION DOLLAR HOME, BUT IT'S STILL NOT AFFORDABLE.

I DON'T BELIEVE THE PROPOSAL BEING CONSIDERED WILL ACCOMPLISH THE STATED GOAL OF PROVIDING AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I'M NOT AN EXPERT IN THESE MATTERS, BUT MY CONCLUSION IS THAT THE ONLY WAY TO CREATE AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS TO HAVE DENSE OR MULTIFAMILY HOUSING THAN IS PROPOSED HERE IN APPROPRIATE AREAS CLOSER TO CITY CENTER OR TRANSIT HUBS BUILT UP AND IN GREATER DENSITY IN APPROPRIATE AREAS, NOT BY BUILDING MORE DENSITY WITHIN ALREADY DENSE SINGLE-FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

AS A SIDE NOTE, AND IT WAS PREVIOUSLY MENTIONED, DECATUR IS ALREADY DENSELY POPULATED AND I THOUGHT WAS THE SECOND MOST POPULATED.

WE HEARD EARLIER, IT'S THE MOST DENSELY POPULATED, BUT WHETHER WE'RE FIRST OR SECOND, WE ARE ALREADY A DENSE POPULATED CITY.

NUMBER 3, THE PROPOSAL'S IMPACTS, I THINK ARE GENERALLY ROSY AND DON'T ALWAYS TELL THE FULL STORY.

WE'VE HEARD SOME OTHER COMMENTS SIMILAR TO THIS TONIGHT.

LET'S TAKE PARKING, FOR EXAMPLE.

THE PROPOSAL INCLUDES A CHANGE TO PARKING REQUIREMENTS.

ONLY ONE PARKING SPACE IS REQUIRED TO BE PROVIDED FOR EACH UNIT, BUT HALF OF THOSE CAN BE ON STREET PARKING.

IN EFFECT, PARKING ONLY HAS TO PROVIDED ON-SITE FOR HALF OF THE NUMBER OF UNITS.

NOTE THAT THERE ARE A LOT OF COMPLICATIONS TO THIS, BUT NOT EVEN GETTING INTO COMPLICATED DETAILS, IN SIMPLE TERMS, THAT WOULD RESULT IN AT LEAST 2-4 TIMES AND POTENTIALLY MANY MORE CARS FOR THE SAME SINGLE-FAMILY LOTS.

ONE LOT, YOU COULD HAVE 2-4 TIMES AS MANY CARS.

I ALSO THINK ASSUMPTIONS THAT RESIDENTS IN SMALLER UNITS WILL HAVE FEWER CARS OR NOT HAVE CHILDREN, THOSE MAY NOT BE ACCURATE.

I THINK THOSE SHOULD BE CHALLENGED.

I'M FAIRLY CERTAIN THAT DEVELOPERS WOULD MAXIMIZE THE SQUARE FOOTAGE ALLOWED FOR LIVING PURPOSES, AND THAT HAS TO BE CONSIDERED TOGETHER WITH PARKING, BUT WHAT I MEAN IS MAXIMIZING THE SQUARE FOOTAGE FOR LIVING WITH THE MINIMUM AMOUNT FOR PARKING.

THAT MEANS THERE WILL BE, IN TOTAL, LESS IMPERMEABLE SPACE IN THE LOTS THAN WE WOULD CURRENTLY HAVE, AND THEREFORE ALSO LESS PERMEABLE SPACE IN TOTAL, PLUS, AS I NOTED, MANY MORE CARS PARKED ON THE STREET.

I ALSO THINK THE RENDERINGS PRESENTED IN THE REPORT ARE NICE AND PRETTY TO FIT WITHIN THE NEIGHBORHOOD, BUT I'M NOT AWARE THAT WE HAVE ARCHITECTURAL STANDARDS TO REQUIRE THAT AND A DEVELOPER COULD BUILD WHATEVER IS CHEAPEST AND MAXIMIZE THE SQUARE FOOTAGE OF LIVING SPACE, AND IT COULD BE VERY UGLY AND NOT FIT WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

THIS COULD BE AN UGLY MCMANSION TIMES FOUR.

IN SUMMARY, I DON'T BELIEVE THE PROPOSAL IS BALANCED OVERALL, AND ESPECIALLY THE PARKING PROPOSAL AND ARCHITECTURAL RENDERINGS ARE NOT REALISTIC.

AS PROPOSED, I BELIEVE THERE'S A SIGNIFICANT RISK THAT THE QUALITY OF LIFE AND CHARACTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOODS WILL BE ADVERSELY AFFECTED.

NUMBER 4, AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS AN ISSUE FAR BEYOND THE BOUNDARIES OF OUR SMALL CITY OF DECATUR.

IT'S A PROBLEM NATIONWIDE.

IT'S AN ISSUE IN METRO ATLANTA, WHICH INCLUDES THE DECATUR, BUT WE WON'T SOLVE THIS PROBLEM ALONE IN DECATUR.

THERE ARE MUCH BIGGER ISSUE.

THERE ARE OTHER ISSUES AT PLAY HERE.

IT'S A BIGGER ISSUE THAN JUST DECATUR.

[02:40:01]

DECATUR IS A DESIRABLE PLACE TO LIVE SO INSTEAD OF RISKING WHAT WE'VE CREATED IN DECATUR, MAYBE WE SHOULD LOOK AT THIS AND THINK ABOUT THE WORK THAT WE'VE DONE HERE IN DECATUR AND THE IMPACT ON SURROUNDING AREAS AND LOOK AT THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING, AND BY WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE IN DECATUR, CAN WE IMPROVE AREAS AROUND US PROVIDING BETTER AFFORDABLE HOUSING SURROUNDING DECATUR? IN CONCLUSION, I'LL SUMMARIZE, AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS BIGGER THAN ONLY DECATUR.

I BELIEVE THE RECOMMENDATIONS ARE GENERALLY ROSY AND DON'T ALWAYS GIVE THE COMPLETE ANALYSIS AND ARE BIASED BY A SMALL GROUP INTERESTED SOLELY IN PROMOTING AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

FOR EXAMPLE, THE PARKING PROPOSAL AND THE LACK OF ARCHITECTURAL STANDARDS, AND AGAIN, I THINK THIS SHOULD BE PUT TO THE VOTERS IN A REFERENDUM IF YOU TRUST THE VOTERS OF DECATUR TO MAKE GOOD DECISIONS.

THERE ARE MANY COMPLICATIONS HERE.

THEY'RE UNDERCURRENTS.

THIS IS A BIG DEAL.

WE'RE PUTTING ASIDE ALL THE DETAILS.

THERE'S ONE THING I KNOW.

MOST OF US HERE HAVE CHOICES IN WHERE WE LIVE, AND IN MY CASE, WE SEARCHED ALL OVER IN TOWN ATLANTA.

WHEN WE DECIDED TO MOVE IN TOWN, WE SEARCHED ALL OVER IN TOWN ATLANTA.

I KNEW DECATUR FROM MY CHILDHOOD.

THOUGHT IT WAS A NICE PLACE SO WE STARTED HERE, LOOKED ALL OVER ATLANTA, BUT WE ENDED UP FINDING WHAT WE WANTED IN A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME HERE IN DECATUR AND WE HAVE ENJOYED IT AND DO APPRECIATE THAT, AND WE'D LIKE TO STAY HERE FOR A LONG TIME.

BUT I THINK EVERYBODY IN THE DECISION-MAKING, THIS COMMISSION, THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK FORCE, THE CITY COMMISSIONERS, I THINK SHOULD ALL STEP BACK AND SAY, WHY DID YOU CHOOSE TO LIVE IN DECATUR? WHY DID YOU CHOOSE, I'M ASSUMING MOST LIKELY A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME? I THINK YOU SHOULD REALLY THINK ABOUT THAT.

WE HEARD EARLIER DECATUR HAS HIGH TAXES.

I THINK WE NEED TO ASK SOME OF THOSE TOUGH QUESTIONS.

THE MONEY COMES FROM THE TAXPAYERS.

HOW MUCH ARE WE THE TAXPAYERS SPENDING ON AFFORDABLE HOUSING? IT MAY BE MONEY WELL SPENT, BUT WE NEED TO ASK THOSE QUESTIONS, AND WE NEED TO KNOW THAT.

PERSONALLY, I WOULD SAY I THINK THE CITY WOULD BE BETTER OFF TO FOCUS MORE ON CORE SERVICES.

LET'S IMPROVE WHAT WE HAVE AND NOT SPEND FRIVOLOUSLY.

DECATUR IS, IN THE LARGER PICTURE, STILL RELATIVELY AFFORDABLE, AND AS WE HEARD EARLIER, NEIGHBORHOODS DO GO THROUGH CYCLES OF UP AND DOWN.

THAT'S IT. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

>> [INAUDIBLE] FOR ME TOO. SORRY.

KATHY HODGES.

>> COME ON DOWN. THE WATER IS FINE.

>> I PROMISE I WILL EDIT SOME OF MY COMMENTS.

WE DIDN'T TOTALLY SHARE EVEN THOUGH WE LIVE IN THE SAME HOUSE.

I'M KATHY HODGES. I LIVE AT 234 WEST BENSON STREET IN THE OAKHURST NEIGHBORHOOD.

WE HAVE LIVED HERE FOR SEVEN YEARS.

>> I THINK IT DID TURN OUT TO ME.

>> SORRY, BUT ENJOY LIVING HERE.

I WANTED TO EXPRESS THAT I HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN THIS PROCESS, SO THIS ISN'T LIKE I SAW THE SIGNS AND UNDECIDED AND VOICE SOME OPINIONS.

I SPENT A LOT OF TIME.

I TALKED TO KRISTIN AT THE POP-UP.

I HAVE BEEN ON THE ZOOM CALLS LISTENING TO THE BUILDERS AND DEVELOPERS, AND THERE WERE ABOUT 60 PEOPLE THAT WERE ON THAT CALL.

NOT A HUGE NUMBER OF PEOPLE, BUT I HAVE DONE MY RESEARCH.

I'VE WATCHED THE VIDEOS, I HAVE READ KRISTIN'S LETTER TO YOU THAT WAS PUT OUT ON THE WEBSITE, AND I WANT TO ADDRESS A COUPLE OF THINGS.

PART OF THAT IS I FEEL LIKE WHILE THE CITY HAS TRIED TO DO A GOOD JOB TO NOTIFY THE PUBLIC ABOUT THIS WHOLE THING.

LOTS OF INFORMATION OUT THERE.

I THINK THAT THE EVERYDAY CITIZEN HERE IN DECATUR IS BUSY.

I THINK YOU'LL FIND HERE THAT A LOT OF THE PEOPLE HERE ARE LIKE ME RETIRED WITH TIME TO COME TO A MEETING ON A TUESDAY NIGHT FOR SEVERAL HOURS, BUT THE MAJORITY OF OUR CITY IS HOME WITH THEIR KIDS IN THEIR HOMES AND THE SAME THING WITH THESE COMMUNITY MEETINGS AND POP-UPS AND INFORMATION.

WHEN I TALKED TO SOME OF THE NEIGHBORS ON MY STREET, OLDER OR YOUNGER, A LOT OF THEM HAD NO IDEA THIS WAS GOING ON.

[02:45:01]

I THINK THAT WHILE THEY TRIED TO VALIANTLY GET THE INFORMATION OUT, WHEN THEY SAY EVERYBODY IS IN FAVOR OF THIS, I THINK THEY'RE MISSING 90 PERCENT OF THE POPULATION.

THEY'RE GETTING THE HOUSING ADVOCATES.

NOT THAT I'M NOT AN ADVOCATE FOR MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING, I AGREE WITH THAT.

I DON'T NECESSARILY AGREE THAT EVERYBODY NEEDS TO LIVE TWO MILES FROM THEIR OFFICE, I THINK THAT FIVE MILES IS NOT UNACCEPTABLE.

I DON'T THINK THAT IT HAS TO BE IN OUR FOUR SQUARE MILES, BUT THAT'S JUST MY OPINION ON THAT.

I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU UNDERSTAND THAT I THINK THAT THE COMMITTEES THAT WORKED ON THIS HAD AN AGENDA AND THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT WERE INVOLVED ARE HOUSING ADVOCATES AND NOT YOUR NORMAL CITIZEN OF DECATUR.

IN READING THE LETTER, THE CITY ATTEMPTS TO ADDRESS THE REVIEW STANDARDS THAT YOU SHOULD CONSIDER.

THE CITY IN ADDRESSING THESE CONTINUALLY SITES THE PRECEDENTS FOR THIS DENSITY BY MENTIONING THE UNITS OF THIS TYPE THAT ALREADY EXIST.

IF YOU LOOK AT HISTORY, THIS ZONING WAS ALLOWED PRIOR TO THE '80S AS A RESPONSE TO ITEM C OF THE STANDARDS THAT ASKS WHETHER THE PROPERTY AFFECTED HAS A REASONABLE ECONOMIC USE AS CURRENTLY ZONED.

BACK AT THAT TIME DECATUR WAS IN SUCH DECLINE THAT HOMEOWNERS COULD NOT SELL THEIR HOUSES.

THIS WAS A WAY TO HELP THOSE PEOPLE TO STILL BE ABLE TO MAKE SOME MONEY OFF OF THEIR HOUSES.

I THINK THAT MOST PEOPLE WOULD SAY THAT THAT FAILED SOMEWHAT IN THAT THEY DID AWAY WITH THAT ZONING BECAUSE OF ALL THE PROBLEMS WITH ABSENTEE LANDLORDS AT THAT TIME.

I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT WE SHOULD USE THIS PRECEDENCE OF HOUSES IN ANSWER TO A LOT OF THESE STATEMENTS IN HERE FOR A COUPLE OF REASONS.

IN ADDITION, THIS EXISTING LOW DENSITY HOUSING WERE IN MOST CASES, SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES THAT WERE CONVERTED.

THEY LOOK LIKE SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES.

THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE.

YOU MIGHT GET SOMEBODY WHO TAKES THE FOOTPRINT OF AN OLD CRAFTSMAN AND DIVIDES IT UP.

BUT I THINK MORE LIKELY THEY WILL TAKE.

I'VE GOT A COUPLE HOUSES ON MY STREET.

I CAN THINK OF THAT PEOPLE HAVE BEEN THERE FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS, AND THE HOUSE IS PROBABLY A TEAR DOWN AND THEY WILL BUILD SOMETHING NEW.

IT WILL NOT HAVE THE CHARACTER OF THE TRIPLEX DOWN THE STREET FROM ME.

THAT FROM THE STREET, IT LOOKS LIKE A HOUSE WITH A GARAGE ADU IN THE BACK.

IT'S BEEN THERE A LONG TIME.

IT HAS PLENTY OF OFF STREET PARKING BECAUSE IT WAS PROBABLY DONE PRIOR TO OUR IMPERVIOUS RULES.

THE CAR DON'T SIT ON THE STREET.

I DON'T THINK YOU CAN COMPARE THAT AS BEING A PRECEDENT FOR WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT DOING HERE.

THE CONCERN ABOUT PARKING, I WOULD ECHO THAT.

I THINK THAT YOU'VE GOT TO LOOK AT THOSE NUMBERS, NUMBER OF UNITS TIMES CARS, AND I BELIEVE IN THIS LETTER THERE WAS AN ARGUMENT ABOUT THAT IT WOULD HELP WITH STORMWATER RUNOFF OR IMPERVIOUS.

THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS I WAS TOLD THAT THEY AREN'T REQUIRING ONE FOR EVERY UNIT TO BE OFF STREET.

WELL, WHAT I THINK IN ACTUALITY WILL HAPPEN IS THAT A BUILDER WILL COME IN AND GO, I CAN COVER 40 PERCENT OF THIS LOT AND I DON'T HAVE TO HAVE A LOT OF PARKING.

I HAVE TO HAVE TWO PARKING SPACES, SO THEY'RE GOING TO MAXIMIZE THE SPACE OF THE BUILDING AND THAT 40 PERCENT BIGGER BUILDING SO THAT THEY CAN MAXIMIZE THE PROFIT ON THAT SPACE, SO YOU WON'T FIX AN IMPERVIOUS PROBLEM.

YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE THE SAME AMOUNT.

IT'S JUST NOT GOING TO BE DRIVEWAY, IT'S GOING TO BE HOUSE, AND THE CHARACTER, IT'S NOT GOING TO LOOK LIKE THE TRIPLEX DOWN THE STREET, IT'S GOING TO LOOK LIKE A LARGE QUADRIPLEX.

MY LAST COMMENT. BY DOING THIS AS A BLANKET ZONING, YOU WILL BE GIVING AWAY MUCH OF CONTROL WE HAVE TODAY.

WHILE YOU MAY FIND A LAND TRUST THAT COULD BUILD AND POTENTIALLY MAKE UNITS THAT ARE AFFORDABLE, THE MARKETS IN PLAY AND FOR PROFITS BUILDERS ARE IN THE BUSINESS OF PROFIT AND WILL MAXIMIZE THAT BY BUILDING THE MOST SQUARE FOOTAGE THEY CAN TO MAKE CONSTRUCTION PROFITABLE.

EXAMPLES OF THIS ARE OUT THERE ALREADY IN OTHER CITIES WHERE THE ZONING TYPE EXISTS, AND BECAUSE OF THE HIGH VALUE OF LAND, THE UNITS BUILT ARE NOT AFFORDABLE, YOU WILL HAVE NO CONTROL ON WHAT THESE UNITS LOOK LIKE, AND I DON'T BELIEVE YOU WILL ACTUALLY DO ANYTHING TO INCREASE MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING, WHICH IS THE STATED GOAL OF YOUR STRATEGIC PLAN THAT THIS IS TRYING TO ADDRESS.

BUT WE WILL DEFINITELY SUCCEED IN CHANGING THE CHARACTER OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, SO I WOULD ASK YOU TO VOTE NO TO THIS PROPOSAL. THANK YOU.

THANK YOU. NATALIE WILLIAMS. HELLO, I'M NATALIE WILLIAMS. I'M A RESIDENT AT 174 LAMONT, SO THERE'S A LOT OF US FOLKS FROM LAMONT HERE.

[02:50:03]

I WANTED TO I THINK JUST ASK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THIS PROPOSAL.

I'M ALSO A HOMEOWNER HERE BUT I'M ALSO A LANDLORD AND SO I'M HEARING A LOT OF CONVERSATION ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING, MISSING MIDDLE, BUT YOU'VE ALREADY HEARD THIS.

INVESTORS ARE GOING TO COME IN.

I DON'T KNOW HOW WE'RE GOING TO MANAGE THE AFFORDABILITY OF HAVING MORE DENSITY IN OUR NEIGHBORHOODS.

IT'S NOT THAT I'M OPPOSED TO IT, WE HAVE SOME IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD.

I'VE TALKED TO A LOT OF FOLKS DURING THE 2030 PLANNING SESSIONS. THERE'S A LOT OF SUPPORT.

I THINK PEOPLE LOVE THE IDEA.

I THINK IT'S JUST MORE ABOUT HOW WOULD WE MANAGE IT AND HOW WOULD WE MAKE IT AFFORDABLE.

AGAIN, JUST AS A LANDLORD, I'VE TRIED TO OWN PROPERTY IN DECATUR AND HAVE RENTAL UNITS.

IT'S JUST REALLY COST-PROHIBITIVE EVEN AS AN INVESTOR TO HAVE AFFORDABLE HOUSING IF YOU'RE GOING TO PAY THAT MUCH MONEY, SO I'M SORRY, I'M GETTING NERVOUS TOO.

QUESTION I HAD IS, WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT ATLANTA, THEY HAD PROPERTIES THAT WERE FOR SALE, BUT PEOPLE HAD TO QUALIFY TO BE ABLE TO SHOW THAT THEY FIT INTO A CERTAIN INCOME BRACKET OR PROFILE.

WHAT THEY WERE TRYING TO PROHIBIT WAS A BUNCH OF INVESTORS COMING IN AND DOING A LAND GRAB AND TAKING AWAY THE AFFORDABILITY, AND THAT WAS ON THE WEST SIDE.

I GUESS THE QUESTION I WOULD ASK IS IF WE WERE TO DO THIS, WOULD WE BE ABLE TO, AS A CITY, HOW THOSE TYPES OF PROGRAMS TO TRULY ENFORCE AFFORDABLE HOUSING SO THAT A HOUSE THAT GOES FOR EVEN IF IT IS A DUPLEX AND ITSELF, I DON'T KNOW, $800,000.

DOES THAT REALLY MAKE IT AFFORDABLE VERSUS IF YOU WERE TO PUT SOME A GUIDELINE AROUND WHOEVER BUYS THIS, THEY HAVE TO BE ABLE TO QUALIFY TO SHOW THAT IT'S AFFORDABLE HOUSING VERSUS JUST MORE PEOPLE COMING IN WITH MORE MONEY.

I DON'T KNOW IF THAT MADE SENSE, BUT AGAIN, IT WAS JUST AN EXAMPLE.

IT'S A REAL EXAMPLE THAT WAS IN ATLANTA WHERE PEOPLE WOULD HAVE TO APPLY TO PURCHASE THAT WOULD FIT INTO A CERTAIN CRITERIA THAT WOULD AGAIN, SUPPORT AFFORDABLE HOUSING SO THAT WAS JUST ONE THING.

AGAIN, I'M NOT IN SUPPORT WITH WHAT WE'RE DOING RIGHT NOW, I WOULD LOVE TO SEE MORE MULTI UNITS, BUT HOW WOULD WE AGAIN, BUILD THOSE INTO A COMMUNITY AND MAKE IT TRULY AFFORDABLE? THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. KATHY GIBSON.

>> WHAT NUMBER ARE YOU ON?

>> FIFTY-TWO.

>> KATHY GIBSON? TWENTY FOUR.

[LAUGHTER] THAT WASN'T THE NAME ON NUMBER 24.

311, EAST LAKE DRIVE? ERIC [INAUDIBLE] 215 WEST BENSON STREET? PLEASE EXCUSE ME FOR NOT GETTING YOUR NAME RIGHT.

>> IT'S ALL RIGHT.

HI, MY NAME IS ERIC.

I'VE LIVED AND WORKED IN THE CITY OF DECATUR FOR THE LAST 27 YEARS.

I'VE HEARD A LOT OF GOOD ARGUMENTS TONIGHT, A LOT OF VALID POINTS THAT I HADN'T THOUGHT ABOUT BEFORE COMING HERE, SO I WANT TO THANK EVERYONE FOR RAISING THEM.

I THINK WE HAVE A REAL OPPORTUNITY HERE TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN WHAT TYPE OF HOUSING WE CAN BUILD.

I THINK THAT AFTER HEARING EVERYONE, I'D ALMOST HAVE TO CHANGE MY OPINION ON WHAT I WAS GOING TO SAY TONIGHT.

INITIALLY, I WAS IN SUPPORT OF THIS ORDINANCE, BUT I'D ALMOST SAY THAT I WOULD WANT TO CHANGE MY OPINION TO SOMETHING TO VOTE AGAINST IT.

BUT WITH COMMENTS, I THINK THAT IF WE WERE TO ALLOW DEVELOPERS TO COME IN AND BUY THESE PROPERTIES AND TEAR DOWN THE EXISTING STRUCTURES, I THINK THAT IT COULD BE SUPPLEMENTED WITH A DESIGN, A PRE-SELECTION OF PRE-APPROVED PLANS FOR WHAT COULD BE BUILT IN THE FUTURE THAT WOULD MESH WITH OUR CURRENT HOUSING SUPPLY AND NEIGHBORHOOD.

I THINK THAT COULD BE PAIRED WITH AMENITED VERSION OF THIS.

[02:55:03]

PERSONALLY I FEEL I'M IN SUPPORT OF ADDING MORE DENSITY.

[NOISE] IN PARTICULAR, GENTLE DENSITY.

I DON'T THINK LARGE APARTMENT COMPLEXES WILL SOLVE OUR AFFORDABILITY CRISIS HERE, OR THE AIM THAT WE'RE TRYING TO ACHIEVE WITH AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I THINK THAT THAT CAN'T ENTIRELY BE PUT ON DEVELOPERS, I FEEL LIKE PART OF THAT NEEDS TO BE INCLUDED WITH HOMEOWNERS ON THAT RESPONSIBILITY FOR ACHIEVING THAT GOAL.

THANK YOU. THAT'S ALL I WANTED TO SAY.

>> THANK YOU. NUMBER 54, CATHY GANNON.

[BACKGROUND]

>> GOD BLESS YOU ALL. [LAUGHTER] CATHY GANNON.

I LIVE AT 335 WEST PONCE, DOWNTOWN DECATUR. THANK YOU.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE.

THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE TONIGHT.

I APPRECIATE THAT YOUR EYES ARE STILL OPEN AND THAT YOU'RE TRYING HARD.

SO MUCH HAS BEEN SAID TONIGHT, I'VE LEARNED A TON, AND I'M NOT GOING TO GIVE YOU MY SPEECH, I'M JUST GOING TO TRY TO TOUCH ON A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT REALLY HIT HOME THAT I WAS THINKING ABOUT, BUT THAT OTHER FOLKS HAVE SAID SO ELOQUENTLY, BECAUSE YOU HAVE A LOT TO PLOW THROUGH IN MAKING SOME DECISION, BUT I HOPE THAT YOU WON'T MAKE IT TONIGHT.

I HOPE YOU WILL TABLE THIS TO HELP US COME TO SOME GOOD OPTION TO ADDRESS AFFORDABILITY AND DIVERSITY INDICATOR.

BECAUSE WHAT WE DID HERE THROUGH ALL THOSE PLANNING PROCESSES THAT PEOPLE DO SUPPORT THAT CONCEPT.

WE HAVE NO DEFINITION OF AFFORDABILITY IN THIS ORDINANCE OR ANY OTHER.

AFFORDABILITY TO ME AND AFFORDABILITY TO THE YOUNG MAN WHO'S A STUDENT, OR VALERIE'S SON, OR ANYBODY ELSE, MEANS TOTALLY DIFFERENT THINGS.

WE NEED TO HAVE A DEFINITION OF AFFORDABILITY AS A PLACE TO START.

THEN LOOK AT PROVIDING THE STRUCTURE IN THIS CODE THAT WILL GUARANTEE BOTH AFFORDABILITY AS WELL AS SOME DIVERSITY.

WE HAVE IN THE CODE ALL THE PARAMETERS OF GOOD ZONING.

I DID ZONING AND LAND USE FOR ABOUT 20 YEARS IN A PREVIOUS CAPACITY.

ALL THOSE LOT SIZES, AND COVERAGES, AND ALL THOSE REQUIREMENTS, ETC., BUT NONE OF THOSE, AS MANY OF THE SPEAKERS HAVE INDICATED, NONE OF THEM WILL GUARANTEE THAT THAT EQUALS AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

IT SIMPLY WON'T DO THAT.

THAT IS WHERE WE HAVE TO SPEND SOME TIME TRYING TO LOOK AT THE ISSUES THAT HAVE BEEN RAISED BUT WE DON'T HAVE THE ANSWERS FOR, THE PREVIOUS USE OF THESE MIDDLE OPTIONS.

LOOK AT THOSE REASONS WHY THEY WENT AWAY AND ADDRESS IT IN THE CODE.

WE REALLY MISSED THE BOAT ON AFFORDABLE HOUSING DOWNTOWN, WHERE I LIVE, LOTS AND LOTS OF NEW UNITS, VIRTUALLY NONE ARE AFFORDABLE, NONE.

THOUSANDS OF UNITS, NONE ARE AFFORDABLE.

BECAUSE WE MISSED THE BOAT.

WE DIDN'T FIGURE OUT HOW TO REQUIRE, MANDATE, NOT NECESSARILY RENT CONTROLS, BUT OWNERSHIP ISSUES, SO THAT WE COULD KEEP SOME ON THE AFFORDABLE MARKET.

YOU GET A DENSITY BONUS IF YOU ADD A FEW EXTRA UNITS, AND THEY SELL THOSE UNITS WITHIN SIX MONTHS TO A YEAR, AND BOOM, THE DENSITY IS THERE, BUT THE AFFORDABILITY IS GONE.

BUT THERE'S WAYS TO DO IT.

LEGACY AND THE LAND BANK IS LEARNING HOW TO DO THAT.

WE NEED TO LOOK AT THEM FOR IDEAS TO INCLUDE IN THESE CODES TO ASSURE THAT AFFORDABILITY STAYS WITH THE UNITS.

WHAT ELSE? I'M NOT GOING TO READ ALL THIS STUFF.

[LAUGHTER] UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES.

MANY OF THE QUESTIONS THAT PEOPLE RAISED TONIGHT WOULD COME UNDER THAT CATEGORY OF UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES.

THESE ARE OLDER NEIGHBORHOODS.

THEY WERE DEVELOPED AT A DIFFERENT TIME.

JUST COMING IN AND REDEVELOPING THE SAME PROPERTY, YOU'RE GOING TO LOSE YOUR TREE CANOPY AND VARIOUS OTHER FEATURES OF THAT AREA OF YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD.

ANYBODY WHO WALKED DOWN THE STREET AND SEES WHEN A NEW HOUSE GOES IN, BIG TREE COMES DOWN BECAUSE IT WAS IN THE PARKING PAD OR WHATEVER, YOU NOTICE THAT AND THAT TAKES AWAY THE LOOK AND FEEL OF THAT LITTLE PART OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

YOU SEE IT ALL OVER ATLANTA.

REYNOLDSTOWN IS NOT EXACTLY THE SAME KIND OF ZONING,

[03:00:02]

BUT IT WAS A ZONING DESIGN FOR DENSITY TO INCREASE THAT DENSITY, AND THEY'RE TAKING DOWN WONDERFUL LITTLE HOUSES THAT ARE STILL PERFECTLY GOOD HOUSES.

PERHAPS COULD BE STARTER HOMES, WHICH IS ANOTHER AFFORDABLE OPTION, AND THEY PUT TWO HOUSES IN THAT SAME UNIT AND THEY SELL THEM AS THOUGH THEY'RE SINGLE-FAMILY.

IF YOU HAVE A $700,000 NEXT TO EACH $700,000, AND WHAMO, YOU LOST AFFORDABILITY.

THE PRICES ARE GOING UP UNLESS THERE IS AN OWNERSHIP GUARANTEE FOR KEEPING IT AFFORDABLE.

SO WE REALLY NEED TO HAVE THOSE IDEAS.

BACK IN THOSE MEETINGS WHEN PEOPLE WERE TALKING ABOUT SUPPORTING THE CONCEPTS OF AFFORDABILITY, AND A LOT OF WHAT THEY WERE SAYING WAS BASICALLY, "WE DON'T HAVE THE EXPERTISE, WE DON'T HAVE THE EXPERIENCE, THE KNOWLEDGE FOR HOW TO DO THIS, WE NEED TO COUNT ON YOU FOLKS." SO THIS IS A BIG ASK, BUT I'M ASKING AND I THINK A LOT OF OTHER PEOPLE HERE ARE ASKING, NOT NECESSARILY JUST TO SAY NO, BUT TO TAKE ALL THIS INFORMATION THAT YOU HAVE GOTTEN TONIGHT AND USE IT IN A WAY THAT CAN CREATE A CODE THAT WILL GUARANTEE AFFORDABILITY.

WE'VE GOT A LOT OF GOOD RESEARCH ON WHY IT'S NEEDED.

NOW WE NEED TO EXTEND THAT RESEARCH, AND SOME OF THE DATA WAS EVEN GIVEN OUT TONIGHT ON HOW TO MAKE IT HAPPEN.

BECAUSE WHAT WE HAVE NOW DOES NOT EQUAL AFFORDABILITY, AND IT DOES NOT EQUAL DIVERSITY.

I'VE ASKED YOU TO TAKE SOME TIME, WORK ON THIS, FIND WAYS PEOPLE TO GIVE YOU INPUT AND HELP WITH IT, SO THAT WHAT DOES GET RECOMMENDED TO THE COMMISSION IS SOMETHING THAT COULD ACTUALLY WORK AND ACHIEVE THE GOALS THAT WE'VE ALL TALKED ABOUT WANTING.

THANK YOU AGAIN SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME, AND FOR PUTTING UP WITH ALL OF OUR WONDERFUL COMMENTS. GOOD EVENING. [LAUGHTER]

>> THANK YOU. SUE LEONARD.

>> IT WAS ACTUALLY MY NEIGHBOR AND I'M GOING TO SPEAK.

>> WHAT IS YOUR NAME?

>> MY NAME IS MARY KOWALSKI.

I LIVE AT 119 BARRY STREET.

I'M HERE TO SPEAK MAYBE A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT FROM EVERYBODY ELSE.

I LIVE WITH THREE QUADPLEXES OVER BY MY HOUSE.

ACTUALLY ONE OF MY NEIGHBORS FOR 35 YEARS HAS BEEN A QUADPLEX.

THE BACK OF THE QUADPLEXES BACKS UP TO ME.

ONE OF THE THINGS I THINK YOU GUYS OR THE YOUNG WOMAN WHO GAVE THE PRESENTATION IS HARDLY NAIVE ABOUT PARKING.

BARRY STREET, IF YOU'RE NOT FAMILIAR WITH IT, IS OVER BY THE TRAIN DEPOT.

IT'S IN A UNIQUE PLACE.

IF TRANSIT WAS GOING TO BE THE THING, IT'S 10-MINUTE WALK TO THE DECATUR MARTA STATION, 10-MINUTE WALK TO AVONDALE.

IT'S IN A REALLY GOOD PLACE FOR WALKING TO TRANSIT.

THE QUADPLEX THAT'S AT THE CORNER OF 141 BARRY, THAT'S THE CORNER OF BARRY AND PATE, THAT'S UP TOWARDS THE PATE STREET, THAT'S UP TOWARDS COMMERCE, THEY HAVE FOUR OFF STREET PARKING PLACES.

WHEN I MOVED IN THE BACK OF THE QUADPLEX WHICH FACES 410 EAST HOWARD, IT WAS A VEGETABLE GARDEN IN THE BACKYARD.

IT WAS ALL QUASI INDUSTRIAL.

WE HAD SPENCER'S TIRE, WE HAD A BODY SHOP, MASTER REPAIR.

THE FREIGHT ROOM WAS VERY ECLECTIC.

THE ICE HOUSE WAS JUST EMPTY.

THE PARKING WAS REALLY AMORPHOUS OF THERE.

THEN IN THE LATE '90S SOMETIME, THE PATH CAME THROUGH AND ALL OF THE PARKING GOT FORMALIZED.

THESE ARE INVESTOR PROPERTIES.

THEY'RE NOT OWNER-OCCUPIED.

THE GUY WHO OWNED 410 EAST HOWARD, HIS SOLUTION TO THIS PARKING PROBLEM, BECAUSE HE HAD THESE TENANTS, WAS TO GRAVEL HIS BACKYARD.

THE VEGETABLE GARDEN WENT AWAY AND IT WAS GRAVEL AND IT CAUSED A TREMENDOUS RUNOFF PROBLEM ON MY PROPERTY.

WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE ZONING DOESN'T WORK IS THEN IT GOES TO CODE ENFORCEMENT.

THE GUY, WHOEVER WAS DOING CODE ENFORCEMENT AT THAT TIME CAME OVER AND SAID, WELL, CAN'T BE THAT MUCH MORE WATER.

WELL, WAS.

ANYWAY. I'M NOT REALLY HERE TO REHASH THAT, BUT THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN PEOPLE NEED MORE PARKING.

SUNDAY NIGHT I LOOKED BEHIND 410 EAST HOWARD AND THERE WERE FIVE CARS PARKED BEHIND IT.

I'VE SEEN AS MANY AS SIX.

AND THERE WERE TWO PARKED IT 416 EAST HOWARD.

YOU HAVE AT LEAST 10 UNITS OVER THERE AND THERE WAS AT LEAST 10 PARKING SPACES.

I THINK YOU'RE BEING NAIVE IF YOU THINK THAT PEOPLE ARE GOING TO JUST BIKE OR TAKE TRANSIT.

WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE IS THE QUADPLEX IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD,

[03:05:03]

THEY'RE GOING TO PARK ON THAT LOT IF THEY HAVE FOUR CARS ON IT.

EITHER THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE A MUDDY MESS OR THEY'RE GOING TO GRAVEL THINGS THAT SHOULDN'T BE GRAVELED AND THEN IT'S GOING TO GO TO CODE ENFORCEMENT.

I WAS AT A CITY COMMISSION MEETING BACK IN JUNE AND I DON'T REMEMBER WHERE IT WAS, BUT THEY WERE DEALING WITH A DILAPIDATED HOUSE AND GRAPHS THAT WOULDN'T BE MOWED.

THE NEIGHBORS THAT GOT UP AND TALKS IT, IT WAS TAKING THEM 15 YEARS TO GET CODE ENFORCEMENT TO DO ANYTHING.

WE NEED TO MAKE SURE IF YOU'RE GOING TO DO THIS THAT YOU PUT SOME TEETH IN THE ORDINANCE THAT PEOPLE HAVE SOME REDRESS.

IF YOU WANT PEOPLE TO LIVE IN HARMONY, YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT WHEN THERE IS A PROBLEM LIKE INCREASED RUNOFF THAT THE PERSON WHO'S IS THE RECIPIENT OF ALL THAT RUNOFF HAS SOME RECOURSE BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW WHEN THEY WERE DOING THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING STUDY AND THEY CAME UP WITH THE PARKING, DID THEY GO COUNT PARKING SPACES WHERE THESE STRUCTURES STILL EXIST IN THE CITY? BECAUSE LIKE I SAID, 141 BARRY HAS FOUR OFF STREET.

ALWAYS HAS 410 EAST HOWARD.

YOU CAN PROBABLY FIT SIX BACK THERE.

DID THEY COUNT THESE WHEN THEY CAME UP WITH THIS IDEA OF TWO ON-SITE, TWO OFFSITE.

NOT EVERY HOUSE ON BARRY STREET HAS A GARAGE OR A DRIVEWAY.

WE HAVE A LOT OF ON STREET PARKING.

YOU NEED TO BE CAREFUL WITH THIS BECAUSE IT'S NOT NECESSARILY A BAD THING.

WE HAVEN'T ANY MURDERS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT THAT THE OTHER PEOPLE WERE SAYING.

SOME OF THESE FOLKS THAT HAVE BEEN MY NEIGHBORS OVER THE LAST 35 YEARS HAVE BEEN GOOD NEIGHBORS.

SOME OF THEM NOT SO MUCH, BUT IT'S UP AND DOWN.

WHEN BAD THINGS HAPPEN AND WE COME BEFORE THE CITY COMMISSION TO TALK ABOUT THAT, THEY SAY, WELL, THAT'S A CODE ENFORCEMENT PROBLEM OR IT SOUNDS LIKE THAT'S A POLICE PROBLEM IF THE PARKING IS A MESS.

THE POLICE DON'T COME AND CODE ENFORCEMENT IS SLOW.

WE PAY A LOT OF TAXES SO GET THE ORDINANCE RIGHT.

IF YOU'RE GOING TO DO IT, GET IT RIGHT.

DON'T SAY, WELL, WE CAN CHANGE IT IN TWO YEARS BECAUSE IT'S GOING TO BE SLOW MOVING TO GET ANYTHING CHANGE.

YOU NEED TO GET THIS RIGHT FROM THE GET-GO. ANYWAY, THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. I'M GOING TO READ THE ADDRESS BECAUSE I REALLY DON'T WANT TO MESS UP THIS NAME, 251 CAMBRIDGE AVENUE.

IT LOOKS LIKE KARTIK D'ODOR.

BRIAN MCGEE.

>> GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS BRIAN MCGEE.

I'M A HOMEOWNER AT 128 BARRY STREET.

I ALSO AM HERE REPRESENTING A CONSTITUENCY THAT PROBABLY ISN'T HERE.

I HAVE THREE CHILDREN IN THE CITY OF DECATUR SCHOOLS, TWO IN COLLEGE HEIGHTS, ONE WINONA PARK.

LIKE SOMEONE SAID EARLIER, A LOT OF US AREN'T HERE TODAY.

NOT HERE THIS LATE FOR OBVIOUS REASONS.

I'VE BEEN A RESIDENT OF DECATUR FOR ABOUT FIVE OR SIX YEARS NOW.

WELL, I CAME HERE TO REALLY GIVE A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE.

I'M NOT GOING TO REHASH THE OBVIOUS POINTS THAT HAVE BEEN TALKED ABOUT BEFORE.

DECATUR AS SOMEONE SAID BEFORE, A COUPLE OF PEOPLE HAVE SAID, DECATUR IS ONLY ABOUT 4.6 SQUARE MILES.

THE CITY HAS DONE A GREAT JOB IN BUILDING A PLACE THAT PEOPLE WANT TO LIVE IN SO EVERYONE'S TRYING TO COME HERE, AND THAT'S FINE, AND THIS IS AN OPINION OF A LOT OF MY NEIGHBORS WHO WE HAVE CHILDREN IN SCHOOL AND NOT HERE.

IT'S GETTING TOO CONGESTED RIGHT NOW, ESPECIALLY IN A SCHOOL SYSTEM.

MY WIFE IS LOOKING ON ZOOM RIGHT NOW, PUTTING OUR 11-MONTH OLD TO SLEEP.

[03:10:03]

SHE BROUGHT UP SOME POINTS TO COUNTER WITH SOME OF THE OTHER PEOPLE HAVE SAID, FOR INSTANCE, WHEN SHE WAS IN COLLEGE, SHE HAD TO LIVE 10 MILES AWAY FROM WHERE SHE WENT TO SCHOOL.

IT'S REALLY OKAY.

THIS IS HYPER EXPENSIVE HERE I LIVE IN ONE OF THESE MUCH MALIGNED MCMANSIONS HERE, NOT BECAUSE I WANTED ONE, BUT THAT'S THE ONLY THING THAT WE COULD FIND HERE.

I UNDERSTAND THAT EVERYONE CAN NOT AFFORD TO MOVE HERE AND SQUEEZE INTO THE CITY OF DECATUR.

HONESTLY, A LOT OF US THINK THAT'S IT OKAY, THESE ARE MARKET FORCES.

THIS IS NOT SOMETHING THAT THE CITY DECATUR CAN SOLVE ON ITS OWN.

I ACTUALLY HAVE TO GO TO THE CITY OF ATLANTA TO GO TO PARKS WHERE I HAVE MORE SPACE AND MORE ROOM. IT'S ACTUALLY BACKWARDS.

THERE'S NOT ENOUGH SPACE HERE IN ATLANTA TO ENJOY THE RECREATIONAL ACTIVITIES THAT I'D LIKE TO DO WITH MY TWO SONS.

SO I'M ALL FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I ACTUALLY, GREW UP IN I LIKE TO CALL THE EQUIVALENT OF DECAYED OR CHICAGO, EVANSTON, WHICH IS HOME OF NORTHWESTERN.

DECATUR REMINDS ME A LOT ABOUT EVANSTON, BUT I WAS BORN WITH A SINGLE-PARENT TEENAGE MOM.

WE MOVED TO EVANSTON. WE HAD AN APARTMENT.

WE COULDN'T AFFORD TO BUY A HOUSE THERE.

YOU KNOW WHAT, IT'S OKAY.

I'M SORRY FOR EVERYONE WHO THINK DIFFERENTLY OF ME BUT EVERYONE CANNOT AFFORD TO SQUEEZE IN THIS 4.6 SQUARE MILE CITY.

IT'S BECOMING UNLIVABLE, ESPECIALLY FOR KIDS.

IT'S VERY CONGESTED.

YOU HAVE A LOT OF CONSTITUENTS WHO FEEL LIKE MYSELF WHO JUST CAN'T BE HERE.

I HAD TO JUST MISS BEDTIME TODAY.

THAT'S OKAY BECAUSE I THINK MY PERSPECTIVE AND THE PERSPECTIVE OF, I'D SAY, 80 PERCENT OF MY NEIGHBORS WITHIN ONE OF THE THREE BLOCK RADIUS FEEL THE SAME WAY; THAT WE CAN'T HAVE MORE PEOPLE, WE CAN HAVE MORE PARKING.

IT'S DANGEROUS FOR OUR KIDS TO PLAY OUTSIDE UNLESS THEY'RE IN THE YARD.

IT'S DANGEROUS FOR THEM TO RIDE A BIKE.

I HAVE TO GO TO THE CITY OF ATLANTA [NOISE] TO FIND A PLACE TO TEACH MY BOYS HOW TO RIDE A BIKE BECAUSE THERE'S TOO MUCH TRAFFIC, THERE'S TOO MANY CARS.

I JUST WANTED TO SAY AS A PERSON OF COLOR, I ALSO BELIEVE IN DIVERSITY.

BUT YOU KNOW WHAT, YOU'RE ONLY ONE CITY.

THERE ARE PLENTY OTHER LIVING OPTIONS HERE.

AGAIN, LOT OF MY NEIGHBORS OF ALL RACES, OF ALL INCOME TYPES, THIS IS HOW PRETTY MUCH ALL OF US FEEL.

JUST IN CLOSING, ONE OTHER PERSON SAID THIS, I REALLY WANT TO EMPHASIZE: PEOPLE SEE YOU HOLD THE HOUSE OR WHATEVER.

IT'S LIKE THEY'RE JUST RICH PEOPLE.

THEY JUST WANT, NOT IN MY BACKYARD.

NO WE'RE NOT RICH.

WE WORK. I WORK A LOT.

I HAVE TO WORK WHEN I LEAVE HERE TONIGHT.

WE WORKED HARD.

WE MADE SOME GOOD MOVES.

WE GOT LUCKY.

I'VE BEEN BLESSED AND WE CONTINUE TO WORK SO WE CAN STAY HERE.

WE'RE NOT ALL RICH. WE'RE NOT JUST OTHER RICH PEOPLE, NOT IN MY BACKYARD.

NOW, WE CAME HERE, PAID A LOT OF MONEY TO MOVE HERE FOR A CERTAIN STANDARD OF LIVING.

AS A BLACK PERSON, I FELT VERY, VERY WELCOME HERE, AND THEY'VE MADE MY CHILDREN FEEL VERY, VERY WELCOME HERE.

I AM CONCERNED ABOUT THE LEVEL OF DIVERSITY IN THE SCHOOL SYSTEM, I AM.

BUT I'M ALSO CONCERNED THAT THE CLASSROOMS WENT ON A PARK AT ABOUT 25, 26 KIDS PER CLASS.

IT'S TOO MUCH. ALL OF YOU ARE SMART ENOUGH TO KNOW THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE GOING TO SQUEEZE IN HERE FOR THE SCHOOL SYSTEM.

I WOULD DO IT TOO IF I HAD A CHANCE.

I'M ALL FOR CONTROLLED GROWTH, I'M ALL FOR DIVERSITY, I'M ALL FOR AFFORDABILITY.

BUT WE'RE ALREADY THE MOST CONGESTED CITY IN THE STATE OF GEORGIA.

WE NEED TO FIND SOME OPTIONS.

AGAIN, PLEASE KEEP IN MIND OF ALL OF US PARENTS THAT AREN'T HERE.

[03:15:02]

I RESPECT THE SENIORS, I RESPECT TO THE YOUNGER MILLENNIALS HERE, BUT IT'S A LOT OF US HERE IN THIS CITY.

WE HAVE THIS OPINION, SO PLEASE KEEP THAT IN MIND WITH YOUR DECISION.

THEN CLOSING, PLEASE I REALLY AGREE WITH THE ONE GENTLEMAN WHO SAID, IF YOU TRUST THE VOTERS OF DECATUR, PUT IT TO REFERENDUM.

IF WE LOSE IN THE VOTE THEN I'LL HAVE TO ACCEPT IT.

THAT'S IT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. HAVE A GOOD EVENING.

>> DENISE BOVVER, YES, PLEASE. [NOISE]

>> FIVE-MINUTES. I AM NOT A RESIDENT OF THE CITY DECATUR, BUT I OWN PROPERTY HERE OR I'M PART OF AN INVESTMENT GROUP THAT OWNS A QUAD AT 139 EAST HILL STREET.

I'M HERE TO TALK BRIEFLY ABOUT THE LACK OF OR THE DISAPPEARING MIDDLE.

I'VE TALKED WITH KRISTIN AND GONE TO A COUPLE OF OTHER MEETINGS.

I DON'T HAVE THE FIGURES IN MY HEAD, BUT IT WAS WRITTEN EARLIER IN HER SLID; HOW MUCH SMALL MULTIFAMILY HOUSING THE CITY OF DECATUR HAS LOST IN THE PAST 20 YEARS.

IT HAS BEEN DISTURBING TO ME FOR QUITE SOME TIME TO SEE SMALL PROPERTIES SLOWLY GET IN DISREPAIR.

YOU COULD TELL THEY WERE HAVING PROBLEMS WITH TENANTS, FEWER PEOPLE IN THE PARKING LOT.

THEN THE NEXT THING YOU KNOW, IT'S GONE, LEVELED AND TOWNHOUSES POP UP.

NOW, THAT HAS BEEN REPEATED OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

THAT'S SCARY TO ME BECAUSE WE OWN A SMALL PROPERTY AND WE TRY OUR BEST TO GET THE BEST TENANTS THAT WE CAN.

BAD TENANTS ARE POISON FOR ANYONE RENTING PROPERTY BUT THAT HASN'T BEEN A PROBLEM LATELY.

EVEN WITH THE MARKET BEING WHAT IT IS, GETTING GOOD TENANTS HAS BECOME MORE DIFFICULT.

I TALKED WITH KRISTIN AND SHE SAID THEY'RE CURRENTLY CATALOGING HOW MANY MULTIFAMILY UNITS, SMALL ONES THAT YOU HAVE IN THE CITY OF DECATUR.

WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO SAY NOW IS YOU NEED TO CONTACT US, GET INVOLVED WITH US BECAUSE WE'RE LOSING.

THOSE SMALL PROPERTY OWNERS ARE LOSING.

IF WE CAN'T KEEP OUR PROPERTIES UP, WE WON'T GET GOOD TENANTS AND IF WE HAVE BAD TENANTS, IT REFLECTS ON THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY.

I'M A PERSON WHO WANTS TO AND WE'LL HAVE A UNIT EMPTY BEFORE I WILL JUST GRAB SOMEONE AND SAY YOU HAVE THE MONEY, COME ON.

LANDLORDS WHO RESORT TO THAT END UP LOSING IN THE LONG RUN BECAUSE BAD TENANTS WILL BREED BAD TENANTS.

YOUR GOOD TENANTS WILL LEAVE.

AND THEN IT STARTS TO CYCLE.

THEN IT HAPPENS WHAT I SAID AT THE BEGINNING.

YOU END UP IN FORECLOSURE AND YOU GET KNOCKED DOWN AND YOU BECOME TOWNHOUSES.

AS YOU GUYS ARE LOOKING AT INCREASING THE MISSING MIDDLE, I WOULD ASK YOU TO TAKE SOME TIME TO THINK ABOUT THE TWO DUPLEXES AND QUADS THAT ARE HERE NOW, SMALL APARTMENT COMPLEXES TO SEE IF THERE'S ANYTHING THAT YOU CAN DO TO ENSURE THAT THEY DON'T BECOME PART OF THIS MISSING MIDDLE, BECAUSE THAT'S REALLY WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

THE DEVELOPERS WOULD LOVE TO SEE THIS PLACE WHERE WE ARE KNOCKED DOWN AND PUT UP 15 OR 20 TOWNHOUSES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU. PAMELA PRIVET.

>> I LIVE ON 111 MOCKINGBIRD LANE INDICATOR AND I HAVE BEEN HERE SINCE '86.

I AGREE WITH THE PAST WOMAN THAT JUST SPOKE,

[03:20:06]

THAT WE HAVE GOT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE REGULATIONS IN PLACE SO THAT THINGS WILL BE AFFORDABLE.

IT'S GOT TO BE FROM THE GET-GO THAT I THINK, I'M NOT SURE ABOUT ALL THE REGULATIONS, BUT I THINK TO AFFORD, FOR BUILDERS, TO MAKE IT MORE LUCRATIVE FOR THEM TO BUILD.

THEN DON'T THINK THEY HAVE TO KEEP IT WHAT 30 YEARS, AND AT A CERTAIN, AND KEEP IT AFFORDABLE BEFORE IT CAN CHANGE, BUT THAT NEEDS TO BE REALLY SPELLED OUT, AND ALSO ENFORCEMENT OF CODES BECAUSE LOOK IN THE CITY OF ATLANTA, THEY HAD ALL THESE HUD VIOLATIONS.

NOBODY ENFORCED THEM.

I HAVE THE SAME THING ON MY STREET, OLIVER MOCKINGBIRD LANE.

THERE'S A HOUSE DOWN THE STREET THAT'S BEEN VACANT SINCE THE LATE '90S.

THE ROOF IS ABOUT TO FALL IN AND [NOISE] ALL THE CITY DOES IS SHE PAYS HER TAXES AND TOLD HER THE GUTTERS WERE FALLING OFF TO PULL THE GUTTERS DOWN, SWEEP HER ROOF AND MANY KIDS COULD GO IN THAT HOUSE.

I MEAN, SO WE'VE GOT A PROBLEM WITH SAFETY IN NEIGHBORHOODS, EVEN IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT I LIVE IN, AND TO HAVE SOMETHING WHERE YOU DON'T HAVE REGULATION THAT WILL HAVE TO HAVE TEETH TO IT.

THAT I MEAN, I LOVE.

WE HAVE SOME OLD DUPLEXES AND STUFF ON LAMONT, AND WHAT'S IT BY DALE THAT ARE ALREADY THERE, AND THEY'RE KEPT UP, NO PROBLEMS. THEY'RE OVER THERE BY THE POLE OFF OF SCOTT.

THERE'S ALSO, THEY LOOK LIKE NICE HOUSES AND THEY'RE APARTMENTS, AND THE SAME THING ON MERRILL.

IT SEEMS TO WORK, BUT THE PROBLEM IS, IF YOU DON'T HAVE AN ENFORCEMENT GROUP, THAT IF A LANDLORD, MAINLY OF A COMMUNITY, GOES TO YOU AND SAYS THIS IS A PROBLEM, THAT SOMEBODY'S GOT TO ACT ON IT, BECAUSE IT IS NOT WORKING.

IT'S NOT WORKING ON MY STREET.

IF YOU GET THE MONEY, YOU DON'T CARE [LAUGHTER], BUT I MEAN, I ALSO KEPT MY OLD HOUSE [NOISE] AND MOVE DOWN THE STREET, BECAUSE I'M A SINGLE PERSON AND I WAS LOOKING AT IT FOR TO TAKE CARE OF ME WHEN I CAN'T TAKE CARE OF MYSELF.

YOU'VE GOT TO HAVE LANDLORDS EITHER IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR LIVING NEXT DOOR BECAUSE I TAKE PRIDE IN MY PROPERTY.

I'VE SEEN PROPERTIES THAT ARE OWNED BY SOMEBODY ELSE AND THEY DON'T CUT THE GRASS, AND IT LOOKS AWFUL.

I SAID I'M NOT GOING TO BE SOMEBODY BECAUSE I LIVE HERE.

I WALK BY THAT HOUSE 2 AND 3 TIMES A DAY TO MAKE SURE THAT IT'S KEPT UP.

YOU GOT TO GET AWAY FROM THESE CORPORATE OWN PEOPLE, BECAUSE I HAVE TALKED TO THE REAL ESTATE AGENT, IT'S IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD, AND NOBODY SEEMS TO WANT TO ADDRESS THAT BECAUSE IT'S ALL OVER THE COUNTRY, AND THAT'S WHAT COMES IN.

LIKE SOMEBODY HAD SAID, THAT YOU GO THROUGH SCREENING PROCESSES FOR THESE PEOPLE COMING IN SO THAT TO KEEP THESE CORPORATE PEOPLE OUT BECAUSE THEY DON'T CARE.

ALL THEY WANT IS MONEY.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT OUR NEIGHBORHOODS, BUT I THINK THAT THE DUPLEXES AND UP TO THREE, IF THEY'RE DONE WHERE THEY BLENDED IN, AND THERE IS ACCOUNTABILITY FOR KEEPING THE PROPERTY UP AND ENFORCING IF THERE'S A PEOPLE COMPLAIN BECAUSE THAT'S NOT HAPPENING.

YOU'VE GOT TO GUARANTEE THAT IT WOULD THE END WILL BE AFFORDABLE, AND IT WILL STAY AFFORDABLE, BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T, THIS IS NOT GOING TO WORK.

I CAME HERE AND I WAS ALL FOR THIS, BUT WHEN I HEARD THE FIRST LADY GET UP AND TALK ABOUT ABSENTEE LANDLORDS, AND THEN THEY COME IN AND HAVE BNBS.

IF YOU DON'T HAVE REGULATIONS IN PLACE, I MEAN, IT'S JUST GOING TO TURN THE WHOLE COMMUNITY SOUR.

BUT I JUST FEEL VERY STRONGLY THAT WE HAVE GOT TO HAVE LANDLORDS IN THE COMMUNITY WHERE THE PROPERTY IS,

[03:25:05]

SO THAT THERE'LL BE EMBARRASSED BECAUSE THEY WILL HAVE TO KEEP IT UP.

I AGREE 100 PERCENT THAT PEOPLE THAT WORK HERE LIKE TEACHERS AND FIRE PEOPLE THAT THEY CAN FIND A PLACE TO LIVE THAT'S AFFORDABLE.

BECAUSE IT MEANS A LOT FOR A TEACHER TO WORK IN THE SCHOOLS AND THEN SHE CAN'T EVEN AFFORD TO STAY HERE.

I AGREE, EVERY TIME I WALKED DOWNTOWN AND I SEE ALL THE HIGH-RISES, AND I FEEL LIKE GETTING SOME SPRAY PAINT AND PUTTING ON IT, WHERE IS AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

THERE SHOULD BE A PERCENT OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING ON EVERYTHING THAT GOES UP.

I'M SORRY. I JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND IT.

WE DON'T NEED ALL THAT CRAP, BUT I'M SURE THAT'S CORPORATE.

BUT THERE SHOULD BE ON HERE.

I SEE NOTHING.

YOU JUST FEEL LIKE, LIKE SHE SAID FROM NEW YORK, THEY HAD TO HAVE A PERCENT.

WE NEED THE SAME THING HERE.

IT JUST MAKES YOUR SKIN AND YOUR BLOOD PRESSURE JUST BOIL.

THAT ALL WE'RE DOING IS JUST PERPETUATING WHERE EVERYTHING IS SO EXPENSIVE.

I AGREE THAT PARKING, IT WAS GOING TO BE A PROBLEM BECAUSE LIKE ON LAMONT AND BY DALE, IT SEEMS LIKE IT WORKS OVER THERE.

BUT AGAIN, I'LL LOOK AT THOSE AREAS BECAUSE THEY BLEND IN WITH THE NEIGHBORHOODS.

THEN I SAID SOMETHING TO CHRISTA AND I SAID, WELL, WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN, WE NEED TO ALSO ADDRESS THESE MEGA HOUSES.

SHE SAYS, WELL, WE GOT TO START SOMEWHERE, WHICH I AGREE WE DO, BUT THAT'S THE NEXT THING.

IF YOU DON'T HAVE BUILDING CODES IN PLACE FOR THE SQUARE FOOTAGE THAT GOES UP ON THESE LOTS, AND I HEAR THAT WHAT THE BASEMENTS ARE NOT EVEN COUNTED IN THE SQUARE FOOTAGE, WE'RE JUST PERPETUATING STUFF THAT'S NOT AFFORDABLE.

I MEAN, IT DOESN'T GO WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND IT'S JUST PRICING.

I COULDN'T LIVE IN THIS NEIGHBORHOOD IF I HADN'T BOUGHT IN '86.

I'M JUST VERY FORTUNATE THAT I DID A LOT OF PLANNING TO PAY OFF MY OLD HOUSE SO THAT I WOULD HAVE SOMETHING FAR TO KEEP TAKE CARE OF ME LATER JUST SO I COULD STAY IN THIS NEIGHBORHOOD.

I MEAN, IT TAKES PLANNING, BUT OTHERWISE I COULDN'T LIVE HERE, AND I'VE ALWAYS COMMUTED.

THIS IS THE FIRST TIME I HAVE ACTUALLY DONE THINGS IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD SINCE I RETIRED.

I WORK ONE DAY A WEEK NOW, AND I'VE ALWAYS DRIVEN ACROSS TOWN TO PERIMETER, AND NEVER HAD A SENSE OF COMMUNITY.

I AM TRYING MY HARDEST TO SEND EMAILS AND EVERYTHING I CAN TO GET ACTIVE IN THIS COMMUNITY, BECAUSE IF WE DON'T GET ACTIVE, IT'S GOING TO GO TO HELL IN A HAND BASKET.

I AGREE. I JUST REALLY THINK THAT NEW YORK HAS THE RIGHT APPROACH, THAT THERE'S GOT TO BE A PERCENT OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING, EVERYTHING THAT GOES UP.

BUT ANYWAY, I THINK, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME, AND THAT YOU ALL HAVE A HORRIBLE JOB, BUT I THINK YOU'VE GOT A LOT OF HOMEWORK TO DO TO COME BACK AND ANSWER SOME QUESTIONS THAT WERE BROUGHT UP, BUT WE DO NEED AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

BUT AGAIN, IT'S GOT TO BE DEFINED, AND YOU'VE GOT TO MAKE SURE THAT THESE BUILDERS, THAT THEY EITHER COME IN THAT YOU MAKE A SWEET DEAL WITH THEM THAT THEY CANNOT SELL IT FOR SO LONG.

THAT IT KEEPS IT AFFORDABLE.

BUT ANYWAY, I AGREE WE NEED AFFORDABLE HOUSING. THANK YOU.

>> HOW MANY MORE SPEAKERS BEFORE THE ITEM NUMBER 2 IS COMING UP? [LAUGHTER].

>> WELL, WE STILL HAVE PARTICIPANTS ON THE ZOOM.

>> WE'VE GOT NINE ON THE SEATS, WE HAVE PEOPLE ON ZOOM, AND WE HAVE TO LET THEM SPEAK BEFORE WE GET TO THE NEXT ITEM.

>> IS IT POSSIBLE FOR ITEM NUMBER 2 TO BE POSTPONED?

>> NOT UNDER THE RULES THAT WE HAVE TO OPERATE FOR UNDER NOW BECAUSE WE WERE ADVERTISING IT FOR HEARING TONIGHT.

>> UNDERSTOOD. WE'RE UNLIKE THIS AGENDA THAT YOU ARE ADDRESSING NOW, THAT HAS THREE MORE HEARINGS IN FRONT OF THE CITY COMMISSION.

OUR AGENDA ONLY HAS NEXT [INAUDIBLE]

>> I UNDERSTAND, BUT WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT DEVIATING FROM OUR AGENDA.

[03:30:01]

ROCHELLE PATTON.

JILL PETERSON.

>> I DON'T KNOW IF IT DEVIATING, BUT WE DIDN'T SET GROUND RULES THAT WE WEREN'T TO REPEAT THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN SAID.

THEN IF THERE'S ALTERNATIVE VIEWS FOR [INAUDIBLE]

>> I UNDERSTAND, BUT WE CAN NOT LET PEOPLE SPEAK.

ALL WE CAN DO IS ASK THEM TO FOLLOW OUR INSTRUCTIONS.

ANDERS WELLS.

>> I HAVE A UNIQUE PERSPECTIVE. HI EVERYBODY.

>> SPEAK INTO THE MICROPHONE [OVERLAPPING].

>> THANK YOU ALL FOR LISTENING TO ALL OF US AND ALL PERSPECTIVES.

I LIVE IN A DUPLEX AND I RUN OUT HALF OF IT.

I'M ACTUALLY THE PEOPLE YOU'RE ASPIRING TO HAVE.

WHEN A LADY THAT WAS HERE THAT ON THE QUAD FLEX WITH THEIR INVESTMENT PARTNERS CAME AND TALKED ABOUT THE DISAPPEARING MIDDLE, THAT SPLITS MY BIG CONCERN.

I THINK THAT'S THE BIGGEST OPPORTUNITY BECAUSE I HAVE SOME NOTES, I'LL GO TO THOSE.

BUT MY NAME IS ANDERS WELLS, I LIVE AT 105 PATTILLO WAY.

I ACTUALLY CAME HERE TODAY BECAUSE ACTUALLY HAD ALREADY TALKED TO YOU GUYS WHEN YOU WERE DOING SOME OF THE SURVEYS.

WHEN I SAW THIS, THE ONLINE VITRIOL AND LUCKILY PEOPLE THAT SHOULD APPEAR WERE NOT SO AWFUL, BUT THERE'S STILL A LOT OF FEAR ABOUT THESE IDEAS.

I THINK THESE PEOPLE DON'T KNOW WHAT TO EXPECT.

I THOUGHT JUST BY COMING IN AND SAYING, WELL, THIS IS WHAT MY LIVED EXPERIENCES, IT WILL GIVE YOU GUYS SOME THOUGHT.

BUT YOU GUYS SOME THINGS THAT ARE SPECIFIC TO LIKE LIVING AND OWNING A PROPERTY LIKE THIS.

BUT ALSO FOR PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY TO UNDERSTAND THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS THAT CAN HAPPEN HERE AND IT'S NOT JUST A GIANT MCMANSION PLEX THAT I THINK WHY PEOPLE ARE ENVISIONING.

HOLD ON A SECOND. LET ME THINK ABOUT WHERE TO START.

I GUESS WHERE I'LL START IS I NEVER WANTED TO LIVE IN DECATUR, BUT MY WIFE REALLY DID.

I WORK IN A WAREHOUSE.

I WAS A WAREHOUSE SUPERVISOR, AND WORKED THROUGH EXPANSION PROJECTS FOR A DISTRIBUTION COMPANY WHEN I BOUGHT MY HOUSE IN DECATUR.

MY WIFE IS A NURSE.

SHE WAS A NURSING STUDENT IN THE ATLANTA AREA AND LIVED DECATUR WHEN SHE WAS A STUDENT.

SHE LIVED ON DREXEL AVENUE IN SOME OF THOSE BROKEN-UP OLD HOUSES THAT ARE APARTMENTS.

SHE HAS FAMILY THAT LIVE ON GLENNWOODS, SO SHE WANTED TO BE NEAR HER FAMILY.

I WAS LIKE, OKAY, WELL, I THINK WE CAN MAKE IT WORK BECAUSE I KNOW WHAT PEOPLE HAVE DONE THIS.

YOU BUY A DUPLEX, YOU LIVE IN PART OF IT, YOU RENT OUT PART OF IT, THEY PAY THE MORTGAGE, YOU PAY THE TAXES, AND WE CAN MAKE THAT WORK, CAN AFFORD IT.

WE JUST HAPPEN TO BE LUCKY ENOUGH THAT WHEN THESE PROPERTIES CAME UP FOR SALE, AND IT WAS NOT VERY EXPENSIVE WHEN WE BOUGHT IT IN 2014 COMPARED WITH THE MARKET.

EVEN NOW IT'S NOT. THAT'S ANOTHER THING THAT'S INTERESTING IS BY THESE PROPERTIES BEING BUSINESSES, ESSENTIALLY IF PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO MAKE MONEY, IT ACTUALLY DEPRESSES THE VALUE OF THE PROPERTY IN A WAY.

BECAUSE IF YOU ARE COMING HERE TO MAKE MONEY, LIKE PEOPLE ARE SAYING, IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

ACTUALLY A LOT OF TIMES IT WON'T MAKE SENSE BECAUSE YOU CAN'T BUY THE $1.5 MILLION PROPERTY PLUS DEVELOPMENT AND RENT IT OUT AND MAKE MONEY.

BUT I THINK WHAT YOU CAN DO IS, IS EXISTING PROPERTIES THAT ARE STILL HERE RIGHT NOW.

MAKE IT MORE APPEALING FOR PEOPLE TO ACTUALLY BUY THEM AND LIVE IN THEM OR BUY THEM, RENT THEM OUT WITHOUT DEVELOPING THEM.

I FOUND IT VERY HARD WHEN I BOUGHT MY HOUSE, TO ACTUALLY BUY MY HOUSE. IT WAS A WHOLE SAGA.

ONE OF THE ISSUES IS BECAUSE THERE'S NO ZONING THAT PERMITTED MY HOUSE, PEOPLE DIDN'T WANT TO MAKE GIVE ME LOAN BECAUSE THEY SAID, WELL, WHAT IF IT BURNS DOWN, YOU CAN'T REBUILD IT.

I'D ACTUALLY TALK TO YOU GUYS AND CODE ENFORCEMENT TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU GUYS SAY YES, WE WOULD GIVE YOU A VARIANCE BECAUSE WE'RE NOT EVIL.

BUT THAT WAS ACTUALLY A QUESTION.

THE OTHER ONE THAT WAS INTERESTING IS WHEN I ACTUALLY HAD TRIED TO GET AN APPRAISAL ON THE HOUSE TO BUY.

ONE OF THE QUESTIONS IS, WHAT'S THE BEST USE OF THE PROPERTY? THE ANSWER WE GOT WAS BUY THE HOUSE NEXT DOOR, THAT'S NOT FOR SALE.

TAKE THIS HOUSE, TEAR THEM BOTH DOWN AND BUILD A MANSION ON IT.

OF COURSE, THAT HAD TO GET CHALLENGED AND IT WAS COMPLICATED, BUT THAT'S THE MENTALITY THAT'S AROUND.

IS THAT THESE PROPERTIES NEED TO GO.

THEY'RE OLD, THEY'RE BAD, THEY'RE BETTER USED BY TEARING THEM DOWN AND BUILDING SOMETHING ELSE.

THERE'S NOT ANY INCENTIVES TO PRESERVE THESE PROPERTIES AS THEY ARE.

THE TRUTH ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING THAT I SEE AND I THINK STUDIED AND KNOWN.

MOST AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS OLD HOUSING.

STARTER HOMES WERE NICE HOMES THAT WERE NEW HOMES AT ONE POINT.

THEN MY HOUSE IS BUILT IN THE 1940S AS A DUPLEX,

[03:35:03]

IT'S NOT A CONVERTED HOUSE.

IT'S BEEN A DUPLEX FOREVER.

IT'S ALWAYS BEEN AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

THEY'VE GOT 100 SQUIRE FEET ON EACH LEVEL.

WE'VE HAD A DRIVEWAY WITH SPACES FOR TWO CARS ON IT.

WE HAVE TWO UNITS, SO ACTUALLY MAYBE A LITTLE MORE PARKING.

THEN WE'VE TALKED ABOUT AN ORDINANCE TONIGHT, I THINK BECAUSE I HAVE ONE SPOT FOR EACH UNIT AND IT'S REALLY PROBABLY NOT ENOUGH IF WE HAD LESS THAN THAT.

I DO THINK PROBABLY YOU NEED TO HAVE ONE MORE PARKING THAN WE'VE TALKED ABOUT.

MY STREET HAS A LOT OF OTHER DUPLEXES ON IT, ALSO SINGLE-FAMILY RENTALS.

THE GENTLEMAN THAT TALKED ABOUT TRAFFIC AND KIDS AND THINGS LIKE THAT AND IT'S NOT OKAY AND IT'S DANGEROUS.

I THINK THAT'S VERY NEIGHBORHOOD SPECIFIC BECAUSE NO ONE IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD TALKS ABOUT THAT.

I THINK IT DEPENDS ON THE NEIGHBORHOOD YOU'RE IN, WHAT'S BEEN GOING ON.

I THINK A LOT OF THE OVERCROWDING OF CHILDREN'S HAPPENED IN THESE NEIGHBORHOODS WHERE THERE WERE CHEAPER HOUSES TO TEAR DOWN.

THAT HAS BEEN THE CLUSTERING OF THOSE THINGS.

I WOULD JUST TALK TO AS MANY PEOPLE AS YOU CAN.

LOCALLY, YOU CAN EVEN TALK TO A LOT OF PEOPLE TONIGHT.

BUT I THINK THERE'S A LOT DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVES THERE ON THOSE THINGS.

BUT THE TENANTS THAT WE HAVE AND MYSELF, ABOUT ME AND MY WIFE, YOU KNOW THAT I WORK IN WAREHOUSE LOGISTICS, SHE'S A NURSE.

TENANTS WE'VE HAD HAVE NOT BEEN YOU'D CALL IT AFFORDABLE HOUSING TENANTS, BUT THEY'RE PEOPLE THAT COULDN'T LIVE IN DECATUR OTHERWISE.

WE HAD A PROFESSOR AT EMORY WHO HAS WORKED WITH THE ANIMAL BEHAVIOR LAB AND HER HUSBAND WAS LIKE SOME TECH WORKER.

I DON'T EXACTLY KNOW WHAT HE DID, BUT HE WORKED FROM HOME BEFORE THAT WAS COOL AND PROGRAMMED.

THEN WE HAD SOMEONE THAT WAS A DIVORCEE THAT WANTED TO STAY INDICATOR TO BE NEAR FAMILY, SO ONE PERSON LIVING IN THE HOUSE.

THEN WE HAD THE PEOPLE THAT WE'VE DOWNSTAIRS NOW, ONE OF WHOM WAS A SCHOOL TEACHER AND ONE OF WHOM IS A COMMUNICATIONS PROFESSIONAL.

WHEN PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT LIKE, WE WANT PEOPLE THAT ARE REAL JOBS LIKE COPS AND THINGS LIKE THIS IS THE HOUSING THAT THEY AND WE CAN HAVE.

WHEN PEOPLE SAY, WHO LIVE THERE, WHAT'S GOING TO LIVE THERE.

WELL, MAYBE THE NEW CONSTRUCTION THAT I DON'T KNOW ANYONE WANT TO BUILD ANYWAYS, BECAUSE IT WON'T MAKE SENSE AS A BUSINESS UNLESS YOU RUN IT FOR $3,000 A MONTH OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, IN WHICH CASE, I DON'T KNOW ANYONE THAT WANTS TO PAY THAT AND LIVE IN A DUPLEX OR A QUADPLEX.

I THINK YOU'RE LOOKING AT PRIMARILY LIKE LET'S PRESERVE WHAT WE'VE GOT BECAUSE IT'S DISAPPEARING.

I DON'T THINK PEOPLE WANT TO BUILD A LOT MORE DUPLEXES OR TRIPLEXES OR QUADPLEXES.

BUT IF WE'RE ALLOWED TO BUILD THEM, IT WILL MAKE IT EASIER FOR US TO GET LOANS AND MAKE IT SO PEOPLE WILL CONSIDER LIKE, THIS IS AN OPTION.

I DON'T KNOW THAT WE SHOULD JUST SAY, JUST BUILD THEM HOWEVER YOU WANT.

BECAUSE I THINK PEOPLE HAVE SOME GOOD POINTS ABOUT, WE NEED TO INCENTIVIZE PEOPLE LIKE ME THAT LIVE HERE, LIKE OWNER-OCCUPIED PEOPLE NEED SOME INCENTIVES, OR LIKE THE LADY I WAS SAYING, PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN THE CITY OF DECATUR MAYBE COULD BE INCENTIVIZED TO DO THIS.

BECAUSE THERE MIGHT BE WAYS, AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THOSE ARE.

BUT TO TRY TO ATTRACT THE BEHAVIOR WE WANT, WHICH IS NOT CORPORATIONS COMING IN AND BUYING UP LAND AND [NOISE] BUILDING UNAFFORDABLE MONSTERS THAT ARE GOING TO CAUSE RUNOFF PROBLEMS BECAUSE THEY'RE POSTED STAMPING THE LAW.

I DON'T KNOW. THINK ABOUT THE INCENTIVES IS LIKE IF YOU WANT CERTAIN PEOPLE TO OWN THESE PROPERTIES, CERTAIN PEOPLE TO LIVE IN THESE PROPERTIES.

THINK ABOUT WHAT THOSE INCENTIVES MIGHT BE. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER.

I'M NOT SAYING LIKE, GIVE ME A TAX BREAK BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THAT'S REALLY THE ANSWER, AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S LEGAL AND WHAT'S APPROPRIATE.

BUT IF WE CAN INCENTIVIZE NOT TEARING DOWN WHAT WE'VE GOT.

WHEN IT GETS IN DISREPAIR BECAUSE MY HOUSE WAS IN DISREPAIR WHEN I GOT IT, LITERALLY THE KITCHEN FLOOR WAS ROTTED OUT.

I'VE HAD TO COMPLETELY GUT AND REPLACE BOTH THE KITCHENS OVER THE FIRST THREE YEARS OF MY OWNERSHIP OF THE PROPERTY.

BUT I SAW SOMETHING THERE AND I BOUGHT IT, BUT IT WAS REALLY HARD TO DO.

I HAD TO JUMP THROUGH A LOT OF HOOPS WHEN I BOUGHT THE PROPERTY.

I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH OF THAT IS JUST RELATED TO CODE OR ZONING, JUST THAT IT'S HARD TO BUY A DUPLEX AND LIVE THERE.

NOT EVERYTHING IS ARRANGED AND SAYING AS IN YOU GUYS CONTROL.

BUT TO THE DEGREE YOU CAN THINK ABOUT THAT, I THINK THAT WOULD BE GOOD.

I THINK THAT'S BASICALLY IT.

MY BIG POINT WAS WE NEED TO PRESERVE WHAT WE'VE GOT BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BUILD OF THIS PROPERTY, BUT WE HAVE AFFORDABLE HOUSING NOW.

A LOT OF TIMES YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW IT.

THEY WALK BY AND THEY DON'T SEE IT.

LIKE THE LADY THAT WAS HERE TALKING ABOUT BUILDING A HOUSE IN DREXEL AVENUE.

DREXEL AVENUE IS FULL RENTAL PROPERTIES, BUT YOU WOULDN'T KNOW JUST WALKING DOWN THE STREET, THERE'S ONE OBVIOUS QUADPLEX WHEN THERE'S A LOT OF OTHER PROPERTIES ARE JUST BROKEN-UP HOUSES AND SO THE STUFF IS HERE BUT IT IS GETTING SYSTEMATICALLY TORN DOWN.

YOU SEE IT ALL THE TIME. ALL THE PLACES THAT MY WIFE HAS LIVED EXCEPT FOR THAT PLACE ON DREXEL ARE NO LONGER RENTALS.

ONE OF WHOM WAS A DUPLEX IN MONONA PARK THAT HAD MOLD PROBLEMS. RATHER THAN TRY TO FIX THAT,

[03:40:02]

THEY'VE GOT TORN DOWN AND OTHER ONE WAS LIKE A LITTLE CARRIAGE PROPERTY THAT GOT TORN DOWN WAS ALSO WENT ON TO PARK WHEN [NOISE] I SOLD THE HOUSE.

WHATEVER CAN BE DONE TO KEEP THE STUFF THAT WE'VE GOT.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT IS, BUT I THINK THAT WOULD BE MAYBE MORE FRUITFUL THAN TRYING TO GET PEOPLE TO BUILD DUPLEXES AND TRIPLEXES BELLAPLEXES NEW BECAUSE I THINK PEOPLE ARE GOING TO WANT TO BUILD TOWNHOUSES.

WE KNOW THAT BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE DOING [LAUGHTER].

WE WANT TO INCENTIVIZE [NOISE] PEOPLE.

WITH A LOT OF THESE PEOPLE THAT TALKED EARLY ON ABOUT, I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD SPEND A LOT OF MONEY ON THIS STUFF BECAUSE I LIVE RIGHT NEXT DOOR TO THESE FAMOUS TOWNHOUSES THAT WERE AFFORDABLE HOUSING, THAT ARE NOW REGULAR TOWNHOUSES.

IT'S LIKE THESE PROJECTS WHERE WE SPEND MONEY ARE INHERENTLY WE'RE GOING AGAINST THE MARKET.

YOU'RE GOING TO FIGHT WITH THEM.

THE MARKET IS GOING TO FIND A WAY TO WEASEL AROUND AND WHEN.

INSTEAD OF TRYING TO FORCE THINGS, I THINK YOU NEED TO DO WHAT YOU CAN TO TILT STUFF.

TILT THE REGULATIONS INCENTIVIZE THINGS AND WAYS THAT DON'T COST THE SEE DECATUR LOTS OF MONEY BECAUSE THERE ARE THINGS WE CAN DO LIKE SUBSIDIZED HOUSING AND STUFF LIKE THAT.

BUT I THINK THERE'S ONLY SO [NOISE] MUCH MONEY TO GO AROUND AND PEOPLE ALWAYS ASK ME, WHY ARE YOU SPENDING MONEY ON THAT AND NOT MONEY ON THIS? IF WE CAN USE ZONING AND CODE ENFORCEMENT AND THINGS LIKE THAT TO ENCOURAGE A BEHAVIOR YOU WANT, I THINK THAT THAT'LL BE WHAT YOU GUYS ARE TRYING TO DO.

I KNOW WHAT PEOPLE ARE SAYING. THIS IS HORRIBLE OR PEOPLE SAY JUST TABLE IT, I DON'T, YOU GUYS CAN MAKE THEIR OWN DECISIONS.

BUT I THINK THAT WOULD BE WHAT I'D FOCUS ON IS HOW CAN WE TILT THE REGULATIONS TO GET WHAT WE WANT.

I THINK YOUR BEST OPPORTUNITY IS TO KEEP WHAT YOU GOT.

IT'S NOT THE MISSING MIDDLE, IT'S THE DISAPPEARING MIDDLE. I LOVE WHAT SHE SAID.

SHE'S TOTALLY RIGHT. SHE'S BEEN DOING THIS LONGER THAN I HAVE.

I LIVED HERE SEVEN YEARS, SO SHE WOULD KNOW.

BUT ANYWAYS, THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR TIME AND I DEFINITELY APPRECIATE ALL THE PERSPECTIVES FROM EVERYONE ELSE.

IT'S COME TO SPEAK AND I APPRECIATE YOU GUYS ARE STILL HERE TRYING TO GO STRONG.

I KNOW IT'S NOT EASY BUT THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. [NOISE] ANDERS WELLS.

>> THAT WAS HIM.

>> THAT WAS HIM? [OVERLAPPING] I'M SORRY, I DIDN'T CHECK YOUR NAME OFF LIKE I NORMALLY DO WHEN PEOPLE START TALKING, SORRY. ALLAN CLARK.

>> ALLAN CLARK 726 SOUTH CANDLER STREET.

I HAVE SOME WORDS PREPARED.

I HAD IT ALL TIMED OUT, BUT WHAT CUT TO THE CHASE BECAUSE IT'S BEEN A LONG EVENING.

BUT I WANTED TO SAY THAT WE BOUGHT A HOUSE IN 2006 AND WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON IT EVER SINCE.

IT WAS A WRECK WHEN WE FIRST BOUGHT IT, THERE WAS IVY GROWING UP THE SIDES, THE WORN OUT CARPETS AND REALLY UGLY BATHROOMS AND WE BASICALLY REDONE THE ENTIRE HOUSE.

I'VE SLEPT IN EVERY ROOM.

WE DID THAT BECAUSE THAT WAS WHAT WAS AFFORDABLE TO US AT THE TIME.

THE MAIN [NOISE] THING THAT I WANT TO SAY ABOUT THIS PROPOSAL IS OBVIOUSLY THINGS THAT OTHER PEOPLE HAVE TALKED ABOUT, GROWTH, PEOPLE, NEW CARS, CHILDREN FLOODING THE SCHOOL SYSTEM.

[NOISE] I GUESS WHAT I'M [NOISE] INTERESTED TO KNOW IS, HOW MANY MORE PEOPLE WOULD A PROPOSAL LIKE THIS BRING? WHAT DOES THAT DO TO THE CITY SCHOOLS OF DECATUR? THE THING THAT I HAVEN'T REALLY THOUGHT THROUGH AND I'M INTERESTED TO KNOW IS WHAT DOES THIS DO TO THE FIVE HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOODS OF THE CITY OF DECATUR.

WHAT DOES IT DO TO THE MAK AREA, WHICH IS BEAUTIFUL HOMES UP AND DOWN ADAMS, UP AND DOWN KING'S HIGHWAY? WHAT DOES IT DO TO THE HOME ZONE ON PONS, WHAT DOES IT DO THE OLD DECATUR NEIGHBORHOOD? ARE THESE QUADRUPLEX DUPLEXES [NOISE] ALLOWED IN THERE? I THINK THAT THE AMOUNT OF RESEARCH AND THE AMOUNT OF WORK AND THE AMOUNT OF TIME AND THOUGHT THAT HAS GONE INTO THIS HAS NOT BEEN ENOUGH AS FAR AS THE RAMIFICATIONS OF HOW IT TRULY IMPACTS THE CITY AND THE FUTURE OF THE CITY.

I THINK THAT LONG TERM, THIS IS NOT SOMETHING THAT THE VAST MAJORITY OF TAX PAYING PEOPLE IN THE CITY OF DECATUR ALL WANTS.

I'LL CLOSE MY ARGUMENTS AND JUST SAY THAT I URGE YOU TO NOT SUPPORT THIS MEASURE ON ANY TERMS. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. OUR CAST, ITALY. JACOB BUCHANAN.

>> HELLO, EVERYONE. MY NAME IS JACOB BUCHANAN.

[03:45:02]

I CURRENTLY RESIDE AT DECATUR SQUARE CONDOMINIUMS NEAR GUN LAKE PARK.

I HAVE LIVED IN DECATUR FOR ABOUT 10 YEARS.

I'VE BOUNCED AROUND CURRENTLY I'M IN DECATUR SQUARE CONDOMINIUMS, BUT I'VE ALSO LIVED IN A TOWNHOUSE ON FORTRAN DRIVE.

[NOISE] I'VE ALSO LIVED IN THE QUADRUPLED.

[NOISE] NOW COME HERE TO SAY THAT I'M IN HUGE SUPPORT OF BOTH OF THE AMENDMENTS THAT YOU HAVE PROPOSED.

I FEEL LIKE DISABLING EXCLUSIVE SINGLE-FAMILY ZONE [NOISE] WOULD BE A HUGE BENEFIT TO BRINGING IN DIVERSITY IN TERMS OF THE PEOPLE YOU WOULD GET.

HISTORICALLY, SINGLE-FAMILY ZONING HAS BEEN USED AS A TOOL FOR SEGREGATION, AND CURRENTLY RIGHT NOW IS BEING USED TO DRIVE UP PROPERTY PRICES.

SINGLE FAMILY ZONING IS A PROBLEM THAT IS EXCLUSIVE TO THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

THERE IS A PROBLEM THAT IS NOT THAT COMMON IN OTHER COUNTRIES.

I THINK IT PLAYS A HUGE PART IN TERMS OF WHY WE'RE HAVING THIS AFFORDABILITY CRISIS.

[NOISE] NOT JUST INDICATOR BUT ACROSS THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

IN ADDITION TO THAT, [NOISE] I FEEL LIKE FROM MY OWN PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, LIVING IN A QUADRUPLEX GAVE ME A SENSE OF A COMMUNITY WITHIN A COMMUNITY.

I LIVED IN QUADRUPLEX AND TWO OF THE UNITS WERE AIRBNB SHORT-TERM RENTALS AND TWO OF THEM WERE A LONG-TERM RENTALS.

NOW I SPENT TIME LIVING THERE [NOISE] AND ONE OF THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL UNITS AND LONG-TERM RENTAL UNITS.

I REALLY ENJOYED MY EXPERIENCE BEING THERE.

I FELT LIKE I REALLY DO CONTRIBUTE TO THE DIVERSITY IN TERMS OF WHAT PEOPLE WERE [NOISE] IN DECATUR.

I FEEL LIKE IF THESE PROPOSALS ARE USED TO ACTUALLY PUT FORTH DIVERSITY THEN ALLOWING QUADRUPLEXES, TRI-PLEXUS AND DUPLEXES TO BE BUILT, BE GREATLY BENEFICIAL.

IN ADDITION, I ALSO WANT TO COMMENT ON THE PARKING REQUIREMENT MINIMUMS. CURRENTLY FOR SINGLE-FAMILY ATTACHED UNITS, THERE IS A MINIMUM OF ONE PARKING UNIT.

FOR DUPLEXES TRI-PLEXUS AND QUADRUPLEXES, THERE'S A 50 PERCENT PARKING REQUIREMENT.

I WOULD REQUEST THAT THERE'LL BE NO PARKING MINIMUMS. CITIES ARE BUILT FOR PEOPLE, THEY ARE NOT BUILT FOR CARS.

IT WAS INTERESTING, I WAS [NOISE] LISTENING TO THE PRESENTATION THAT WAS GIVEN AT THE START OF THIS MEETING.

ONE OF THE CITIES YOU REFERENCED AS AN EXAMPLE FOR TRYING TO BE MORE AFFORDABLE AS FAR AS HOUSING WAS MINNEAPOLIS.

MINNEAPOLIS NOT ONLY HAS ELIMINATED, AS YOU GUYS PROBABLY KNOW, EXCLUSIVE SINGLE FAMILY ZONING, BUT THEY HAVE ALSO [NOISE] ELIMINATED ALL PARKING MINIMUMS IN RESIDENTIAL AREAS.

I KNOW THE CITY OF DECATUR HAS ELIMINATED PARKING MINIMUMS IN COMMERCIAL AREAS SINCE 2015 AND I FEEL THEY SHOULD ALSO ELIMINATE PARKING MINIMUMS IN RESIDENTIAL AREAS.

AGAIN, CITIES ARE BUILT FOR PEOPLE [LAUGHTER] AND THEY ARE NOT BUILT FOR CARS.

THAT IS ALL I HAVE TO SAY AND THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> THANK YOU. MARCY MASCARA.

>> GOOD EVENING. I'M MARCY MASCARA.

I LIVE AT 201 WESTCHESTER DRIVE.

WESTCHESTER DRIVE IS ALSO WHERE CITY OF DECATUR SCHOOLS HAS THREE HOUSES.

THOSE ARE ALMOST DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET FROM MY HOUSE.

I LOOKED AT THOSE AS EXAMPLES OF WHAT AN OPPORTUNITY THIS CHANGE MAKES FOR OUR COMMUNITY.

I WANT TO SAY FOR THE RECORD THAT I'M FULLY IN SUPPORT OF THIS AND I'LL EXPLAIN WHY AND I THINK MORE PEOPLE WOULD BE IF THEY UNDERSTOOD AND PERHAPS WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO HERE IS EXPLAINED IN BETTER TERMS FOR WHAT THE OPPORTUNITY COULD BE.

FOR EXAMPLE WHEN YOU HAVE A SINGLE-FAMILY RANCH STYLE HOUSE, YOUR ONLY OPTION TO CREATE ADDITIONAL INCOME FOR YOURSELF AND YOUR FAMILY AND PERHAPS YOUR SONS AND DAUGHTERS, IS THAT YOU ADD AN ADU ON THE PROPERTY WHICH IS RESTRICTED BY PERMEABLE SURFACES.

OR YOU CAN GO UP, YOU CAN ADD A SECOND STORY WHICH HAPPENED ON MY HOUSE THAT I BOUGHT RECENTLY, BUT THE TRANSFORMATION HAPPENED OVER 10 YEARS AGO.

YOU CAN GO UP WITH A HOUSE.

IF YOU ARE CURRENTLY A HOMEOWNER, WHICH MANY OF THE PEOPLE THAT ARE OPPOSED TO THIS CHANGE ARE HAVING SAID THEY BOUGHT THEIR HOUSES IN THE '80S AND '90S.

[03:50:03]

I ASSUME THAT YOU HAVE SOME EQUITY BILL IN THAT HOUSE.

I THINK THE NUMBERS THAT HAVE BEEN THROWN OUT THERE ARE NOT BY QUALIFY GENERAL CONTRACTORS OR FOLKS THAT PROVIDE MORTGAGE LENDING SERVICES NEITHER AM I.

BUT I THINK THAT IF THE CITY WERE TO PUT TOGETHER SOME EXAMPLES OF WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE FINANCIALLY FOR SOME FOLKS, WHERE IT'S PRESENTING AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THEM TO GO UP ON THEIR HOUSE AND THEY CAN RECOUP THAT INVESTMENT OVER TIME.

MAYBE THEY MIGHT NOT SEE THAT INVESTMENT IN THEIR LIFETIME, BUT THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO TURN THAT OVER TO THEIR CHILDREN, CREATE GENERATIONAL WEALTH FOR THEMSELVES AND THEIR FAMILY IS ONE OPPORTUNITY.

INSTEAD OF LOOKING AT THIS AS ALWAYS A DEVELOPER COMING IN AND TAKING OVER AND DOING WHAT THEY WANT WITH THE PROPERTY.

IT'S AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THE COMMUNITY TO TAKE A ZONING LAW AND WORK IT IN THEIR FAVOR.

I THINK THAT THEY NEED TO BE ARMED WITH SOME RESOURCES TO HELP THEM MAKE DECISIONS ABOUT HOW THEY CAN BENEFIT FROM THIS CHANGE INSTEAD OF SEEING IT AS SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE NOT A PART OF THEIR COMMUNITY, NOT GENERATED FROM THEIR COMMUNITY.

IN THIS WAY THEY CAN CONTROL WHO IS RENTING FROM THEM.

WHAT I ENVISIONED ARE PEOPLE RENTING FROM THEM, ARE THE FOLKS THAT WORK IN THE CITY OF DECATUR SANITATION DEPARTMENT OR CITY OF DECATUR SCHOOLS ARE SECURITY SERVICES OR FOLKS THAT SERVE IN OUR RESTAURANTS.

WHAT I WOULD ASK IS, WE KNOW THAT OUR COMMUNITY IS GOING TO EXPERIENCE GROWTH.

I THINK THE NUMBER WAS 10,000 OVER THE NEXT 10 YEARS, WHICH IS A CRAZY NUMBER.

THAT MEANS THAT A LOT OF THE PEOPLE THAT ARE HERE TODAY WILL BE POTENTIALLY OUTNUMBERED BY THE TURNOVER OF INCOMING RESIDENTS.

WHERE DO THOSE PEOPLE LIVE? WELL, WE HOPE THAT THEY COME LIVE IN CITY OF DECATUR.

WE HOPE THAT THEY LIVE CLOSE TO OUR COMMUNITY SO THEY CAN BE FULLY INTEGRATED IN OUR COMMUNITY, THEY DON'T HAVE TO COMMUTE GREAT DISTANCES.

THEY CAN BENEFIT FROM HAVING AN AFFORDABLE HOUSE.

THE NUMBERS WOULD SHOW THAT YOU CAN OFFER A $2,000 TWO OR THREE BEDROOM UPPER LEVEL ON A RANCH HOME FOR PRICE POINT THAT WOULD REFLECT A SECOND MORTGAGE OR REFINANCING MORTGAGE ON YOUR HOUSE.

I'M NOT A QUALIFIED MORTGAGE LENDER OR GENERAL CONTRACTOR.

I WOULD JUST OFFER THAT PERHAPS SOME BUSINESS MODELS THAT ILLUSTRATE THE POINTS IN SOME IMAGES OF WHAT THIS COULD LOOK LIKE TO OUR COMMUNITY MEMBERS AND PERHAPS USING THOSE THREE HOUSES THAT ARE ON WESTCHESTER DRIVE, CITY OF DECATUR SCHOOL OWNS THEM, SHOWCASING WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE AS AN INVESTMENT OPPORTUNITY FOR THE CITY AS HOW THAT COULD BE A BASE MODEL FOR THE COMMUNITY.

I FINALLY LIKE TO SAY THAT I KNOW IT IS OVER 60 PEOPLE PRESENTING TODAY, BUT THAT DOES NOT REPRESENT THAT POTENTIALLY 18,000.

I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY REGISTERED VOTERS OR PEOPLE OF VOTING AGE ARE CONSERVATIVE CITY TO DECATUR, BUT THEY CERTAINLY CAN'T SPEAK HERE TONIGHT, ALL OF US.

I FEEL THIS ENTIRE PRESENTATION HAS DEFINITELY SWAYED ONE DIRECTION.

BUT I THINK THAT PERHAPS IF PEOPLE HAD MORE INFORMATION THAT THEY WOULD FEEL DIFFERENTLY ABOUT THIS. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. PAUL HOMOLIAN.

>> MY NAME IS PAUL HOMOLIAN.

I LIVE IN 535 E PONCE DE LEON AVENUE.

I'VE BEEN WORKING IN AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND STRATEGY FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING GLOBALLY FOR THE LAST 28 YEARS [NOISE].

I JUST WANTED TO HAVE A COUPLE OF POINTS THAT WERE MADE LITTLE BIT EARLIER BUT I WANT TO MAKE IT A LITTLE BIT MORE CLEARLY, THAT IS I SUPPORT THIS PROPOSAL FOR THREE REASONS.

ONE, THE PROPOSAL IS A KEY SOLUTION TO THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING CRISIS IN OUR COUNTRY.

THIS PROPOSAL CORRECTS HISTORIC SYSTEMIC RACISM AND THIS PROPOSAL WILL ALLOW AGING RESONANCE LIKE MYSELF TO REMAIN INDICATOR [NOISE].

AS YOU-ALL KNOW, WE HAVE AN AFFORDABLE HOUSING CRISIS IN OUR COUNTRY AND IT'S PRIMARILY RELATED TO SUPPLY.

IT'S A COMPLEX ISSUE THAT REQUIRES COMPLEX SOLUTIONS.

THIS IS ONE OF THE KEY THINGS THAT'S BEEN IDENTIFIED BY MULTIPLE HOUSING INSTITUTES WHETHER IT'S URBAN LAND INSTITUTE OR OTHER PEOPLE THAT OPENING UP SINGLE-FAMILY HOUSING ZONING IS PROBABLY ONE OF THE KEY ELEMENTS FOR ADDRESSING THE SUPPLY ISSUE IN THIS COUNTRY SO I APPLAUD THE HOUSING COMMISSION AND YOU GUYS FOR TAKING THIS UP AND ASK THAT YOU DO OUR PART AS THE CITY CATER TO INCREASE HOUSING SUPPLY.

IT'S NOT THE ONLY SOLUTION, BUT IT'S PART OF THE SOLUTION.

THE SECOND IS SINGLE FAMILY ZONING WAS DEVELOPED IN THE EARLY PART OF THE 20TH CENTURY PRIMARILY AS EXCLUSIONARY HOUSING ZONE.

[03:55:02]

WE'VE DANCED AROUND THAT ISSUE.

I WOULD REFER YOU TO THE BOOK BY RICHARD ROTHSTEIN CALLED THE COLOR OF LAW.

IF YOU HAVE NOT READ THAT, I WOULD COMMEND THAT TO YOU AS CITIZENS, THE COLOR OF LAW.

THAT BOOK BASICALLY ARTICULATES HOW THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, STATE GOVERNMENTS, AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS USED SINGLE-FAMILY DETACHED HOUSING ZONING TO CREATE SEGREGATION OF PEOPLE THAT WE DIDN'T WANT TO LIVE CLOSE TO US.

I'M SUGGESTING THAT YOU ARE ACTUALLY MAKING A DECISION BY AGREEING TO DO THIS AS YOU'RE ACTUALLY DISMANTLING HISTORIC SYSTEMIC RACISM IN OUR COUNTRY.

I COULD GO ON AND EXPLAIN ALL THAT, BUT I'LL LET YOU JUST READ THAT BOOK AND HE MAKES A VERY GOOD ARGUMENT.

LASTLY WHAT I WOULD JUST SAY IS I'M A PERSON WHO WAS TRYING TO DOWNSIZE.

I LIVE IN A FIVE BEDROOM HOME.

I CANNOT AFFORD THE TAXES I WAS VERY TIRED AND I'M ACTIVELY LOOKING FOR A MULTI-FAMILY TO MOVE INTO BECAUSE I CAN TAKE MY EQUITY MOVE INTO THAT.

THE RENT WILL HELP COVER THE COST OF THE HOUSES.

IT'S JUST ONE LITTLE EXAMPLE LIKE A LOT OF THESE OTHERS EXAMPLES, BUT THE FIRST TWO I THINK ARE THE BIGGEST ISSUES.

I JUST THOUGHT IT WOULD HELP TO FRAME IT IN THE LARGER PICTURE OF OUR COUNTRY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU. THEN THE LAST PERSON ON THE LIST, JOHN RIDLEY.

>> HI. MY NAME IS JOHN RIDLEY.

I LIVE AT 205 ADAMS STREET.

[NOISE] I'VE BEEN THERE 40 YEARS, SO I'VE BEEN HERE A LONG TIME [NOISE].

I HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO SERVE A SENTENCE ON THE CITY COMMISSION A LONG TIME AGO, SO I HAVE SOME FAMILIARITY WITH SOME OF THESE ISSUES [LAUGHTER].

THE FIRST THING I WANT TO SAY IS THAT I DON'T WANT TO REPEAT ANY OF THE FACTS THAT CAME FROM MANY KNOWLEDGEABLE PEOPLE AND I ALSO I'M VERY EXCITED TO SEE PUBLIC PARTICIPATION WHICH I THINK IS WONDERFUL FOR US TO HAVE.

WHAT I DO WANT TO SAY IS THAT; AND I DON'T MEAN TO OFFEND YOU BECAUSE I DON'T THINK ANY OF YOU MEAN IT THIS WAY, BUT THE RANK HYPOCRISY OF THIS GOVERNMENT IS BREATHTAKING.

ABSOLUTELY BREATHTAKING.

IN '19 AND 2016 THE VOTERS WENT TO THE POLLS AND 83 PERCENT OF THEM SAID THAT THEY WANTED PEOPLE IN AN EFFORT, ONE OF THE REASONS WAS BECAUSE THEY FELT SENIORS DESERVED A BREAK.

THEY DID WHAT MANY JURISDICTIONS IN GEORGIA DID AND SAID WE'RE GOING TO DO A SENIOR'S TAX EXEMPTION.

WELL, IN THE MIDDLE OF A PANDEMIC SUDDENLY THIS EFFORT TOWARD DIVERSITY AND RETAINING SENIORS IN THE COMMUNITY WAS SIDETRACKED NOT BY THE VOTERS, BUT BY SOME PEOPLE WHO WERE DISAGREED WITH THE OPINION AND ADHERE TO THE RAY NAGIN MOTTO.

WELL, I COULDN'T CALL THIS ONE THAT WAY, BUT I WILL CALL THE SENIOR EXEMPTION ONE RAY NAGIN MOMENT BECAUSE YOU NEVER MISS AN OPPORTUNITY WHEN A CRISIS COMES ALONG TO GET THINGS DONE THAT YOU COULDN'T EVER GET DONE OTHERWISE.

WE WATCHED OUR SENIOR EXEMPTION EVEN THOUGH 83 PERCENT OF THE VOTERS WAS MAGICALLY TAKEN AWAY.

WE WERE NOT EVEN GIVEN AN OPPORTUNITY AS VOTERS TO SAY WE UNDERSTAND THE SCHOOL CAN'T AFFORD THIS, SO WE'LL DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT.

THAT WAS NOT THE OPTION.

THE OPTION WAS TAKE THIS OR NOTHING.

BY THE WAY AND THIS IS MY REAL POINT TO Y'ALL.

YOU'RE ENTERTAINING THIS IS CREATING INCREDIBLE INSTABILITY IN THE ECONOMICS OF DICTATOR.

HOW MANY RETIREMENT PLANNERS OR BUDGET ARE GOING TO TELL YOU; SOMEBODY WHO'S MY AGE, WHO'S 67, LAST YEAR YOUR SCHOOL TAXES WERE ZERO.

THIS YEAR THERE ARE $6,023 AND 40 CENTS AND WHEN YOU GET REAPPRAISED NEXT YEAR, THEY MAY BE AS MUCH AS $10,000 NOW, I LIVE ON SOCIAL SECURITY AND SOME OTHER FIXED INVESTMENTS,

[04:00:04]

SO I LIVE ON A FIXED INCOME.

I'M NO LONGER PART OF THE WORKFORCE.

I CAN'T GO SELL MORE WORK, GET MORE CLIENTS; THAT'S WHERE I'M.

I'D LIKE TO STAY IN THE COMMUNITY THAT I'VE BEEN IN FOR 40 YEARS AND I DID AN OPEN RECORDS REQUEST TO THE CITY.

FOR ALL THE RECEIPTS THAT I HAVE PAID IN TAXES TO THIS GOVERNMENT OVER THE LAST 40 YEARS AND I HAVEN'T FINISHED ADDING IT ALL UP BECAUSE I DON'T THINK I ACTUALLY SENT ME ALL OF THEM, BUT IT'S SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 1/4 AND 1/3 OF A MILLION DOLLARS.

I THINK I'VE BEEN CONTRIBUTING TO THE COMMUNITY IN WHICH I FEEL GOOD ABOUT AND I HAVE NO PROBLEM ACCEPTING THE SENIOR TAX EXEMPTION WHICH WAS TAKEN AWAY, BUT WHAT YOU'RE DOING BY ENTERTAINING THIS IS CREATING MORE ECONOMIC INSTABILITY.

NOT ONLY TO OVER 40 PERCENT OF THE PEOPLE AT THE DECATUR NOT ANTICIPATE BEING HERE AT RETIREMENT AGE BECAUSE THEY KNOW THEY CAN'T AFFORD IT, BUT NOW YOU'RE INTRODUCING AN ELEMENT OF INSTABILITY INTO THE STABILITY OF OUR BASE.

WHAT DRIVES THIS COMMUNITY IS OUR PROPERTY BECAUSE YOU'RE IN OUR SCHOOL SYSTEM.

UN STABILIZED THAT AND LET ME TELL YOU WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

EVERY REAL ESTATE AGENT AND THIS TOWN IS GOING TO START TALKING ABOUT IT.

WHEN THE DOWNWARD CYCLE STARTS, YOU FIGURE OUT A WAY TO STOP IT.

WE CAN BARELY AFFORD THE SCHOOLS WE HAVE, WE CANNOT TOLERATE ANYMORE DENSITY.

WHERE THESE 10,000 PEOPLE THAT CLAIM THAT ARE GOING TO SHOW UP ARE GOING TO GO IS BEYOND ME AND I DON'T NEED TO TELL YOU DECATUR HAS ALREADY THE HIGHEST DENSITY MUNICIPALITY IN THE STATE ACCORDING TO THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITY AFFAIRS.

THE INFRASTRUCTURE WAS NEVER DESIGNED TO SUPPORT THAT.

WE ALL KNOW THAT YOU CANNOT PUT FIVE POUNDS OF FLOUR IN A TWO POUND SACK, IT DOESN'T WORK AND THERE ARE CONSEQUENCES.

I APPRECIATE HAVING THE PUBLIC HEARINGS WHICH WE WOULD NOT AFFORDED THE OPPORTUNITY WHEN OUR SENIOR EXEMPTION WAS TAKEN AWAY FROM US.

WE WEREN'T EVEN AFFORDED A PUBLIC HEARING.

JUST BACKROOM DEALS AND OH HERE, TAKE THIS OR NOTHING.

WELL, LET ME TELL YOU WHAT WILL HAPPEN IF YOU GUYS SCREW AROUND WITH THIS THING.

YOU'RE GOING TO TRULY DESTABILIZE THE ECONOMIC ENVIRONMENT OF DECATUR.

NOT ONLY WHEN IT'S AFFECT THE PROPERTIES, IT'S GOING TO AFFECT THE SCHOOLS AS WELL.

APARTMENTS DON'T PAY FOR THEMSELVES WHEN IT COMES TO A SCHOOLCHILD.

THAT'S A FACT, NOT AN OPINION.

THE MORE PEOPLE YOU BRING INTO THIS PLACE, THE WORST THE FINANCIAL SITUATION HAS BECOME AND IT'S ALREADY AT THE TEETER TOTTER POINT.

WHEN YOU HAVE TO ELIMINATE, GO AGAINST 83 PERCENT OF WHAT THE VOTERS WANT TO TAKE AWAY A FEW MILLION DOLLARS WORTH OF AN EXEMPTION BECAUSE YOU CAN'T AFFORD IT.

THAT SAYS TO ME THAT YOU'RE IN A WORLD OF HURT.

WE OWE A LOT OF MONEY.

WE HAVEN'T AT 50 PERCENT ASSESSMENT, WHICH IS 10 PERCENT MORE THAN EVERYBODY ELSE.

WE SIMPLY ARE TRYING TO DO SOMETHING WE CAN'T AFFORD.

WE'RE ALL ADULTS AND WE OUGHT TO UNDERSTAND THAT EVEN AS NICE AS SOME OF THE THINGS THAT PEOPLE SAY, THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT WE CAN AFFORD AND THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT WE CANNOT.

THIS IS A LUXURY TO DESTROY THE PROPERTY VALUES IN DECATUR IN PURSUIT OF AN ELUSIVE GOAL, WHICH IS OF NOTABLE GOAL AND A WORTHY ONE IS FOLLY AND YOU WILL LEAD THE CITY FURTHER INTO TROUBLE.

I PREDICT THAT WE ARE FACING INSOLVENCY.

WHAT YOU'RE SEEING IS PEOPLE STARTING TO WAKE UP AND REALIZE WHAT'S GOING ON? ALL THESE APARTMENTS ARE NOT PAYING FOR THEMSELVES.

THEY'RE OVERCROWDING THE SCHOOLS, THE TAXES KEEP GOING UP AND NOW YOU WANT TO ERODE THE TAX BASE BY SCREWING AROUND WITH THE STABILITY OF ZONING VALUES? I THINK THAT'S QUITE SOMETHING.

BUT THE HYPOCRISY OF ONE SIDE OF THE GOVERNMENT CLAIMING THAT THEY ARE INTERESTED IN DIVERSITY AND THE OTHER SIDE OF THE GOVERNMENT CLAIMING THEN WANTING TO GO OUT AND ELIMINATE THINGS LIKE SENIOR TAX EXEMPTIONS IS INCREDIBLE.

MY FINAL POINT, WHICH NONE OF YOU CAN DO ANYTHING ABOUT, BUT I'M GOING TO SAY IT ANYWAY.

WHEN THE 19TH AMENDMENT WAS PASSED, DECATUR HAD AN ELECTED MAYOR.

[04:05:03]

WE HAD LEADERSHIP.

THE ELECTED MAYOR WAS ELIMINATED AS A REACTION TO THE 19TH AMENDMENT AND WOMEN'S SUFFRAGE BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T WANT A BUNCH OF WOMEN TAKEN OVER THE CITY AND DECATUR TO RUN THINGS.

THEY WERE SCARED OF THAT. NOW WE HAVE TWO PARTS OF DECATUR, THERE ARE A HORSE BY COMMITTEE.

WE HAVE A HORSE BY COMMITTEE ON THE COMMISSION SIDE AND WE HAVE ONE ON THE SCHOOL BOARD SIDE, WHICH BY THE WAY IS ONE GOVERNMENT NOT TWO.

WHICH MOST MEMBERS OF THE SCHOOL BOARD DON'T QUITE UNDERSTAND EITHER.

WHAT I'M TRYING TO TELL YOU IS, WHEN YOU START THIS CONVERSATION, YOU'VE GOT TO REMEMBER, PEOPLE ARE LISTENING.

OUR VALUES AND OUR MARK HOME VALUES ARE PROBABLY THE SINGLE LARGEST ASSET THAT ANY OF US HAVE.

WHEN YOU START GOING AFTER SOMEBODY'S, MAJOR THEIR HOME AND THEY'RE MADE THROUGH INVESTMENT IN LIFE, THEIR HOUSE.

YOU'RE GOING FIND OUT THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE MORE THAN THIS, THEY'RE GOING TO SHOW UP.

I THINK YOU'RE DOING THIS AT GREAT PERIL TO BOTH YOURSELF AND A NONE OF YOU ARE ELECTED TO THESE POSITIONS.

BUT I CAN GUARANTEE YOU THAT NO ELECTED MAYOR OF DECATUR WOULD HAVE EVER ALLOWED THE SENIOR TAX EXEMPTION TO BE STOLEN IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT AND THEY WOULD NOT ENTERTAIN AND DESTABILIZING THE ECONOMIC BASE OF DECATUR AND IT'S DIGEST FOR GENERAL GOVERNMENT OBLIGATION FOR COMMUNITY WELFARE HERE.

I'M WONDERFUL TO SEE THAT YOU'RE ACTUALLY TRYING TO GET INVOLVED IN IT.

BUT YOU GOT TO SCHOOL BOARD WHO THINKS THEY'RE IN THE PLANNING BUSINESS TOO.

WE'VE GOT TWO PEOPLE WHO BOTH THINK THEY'RE IN THE SAME BUSINESS.

THEY THINK THEY'RE IN THE TAX BUSINESS BECAUSE THEY'RE OUTDOING A TAX STUDY.

WE GOT TWO GOVERNMENTS WHO WERE BOTH HAVE COMPETING INTERESTS, WHO ARE BOTH CLAIMED JURISDICTION OVER THE SAME GROUP OF FOLKS.

NOW WE END UP WITH A MORE DESTABILIZATION WITH THIS PROPOSAL.

I THINK IT'S FOOL'S GOLD, IT'S FOLLY AND ONCE THE DOWNWARD TREND STARTS, WHEN THE REAL ESTATE COMMUNITY WHO SAYS DECATUR IS NOT A GOOD INVESTMENT BECAUSE IT'S TOO UNSTABLE POLITICALLY, THE EXEMPTION RUNS OUT AGAIN IN TWO YEARS.

WHO CAN BUDGET RETIREMENT PLAN WITH A TWO-YEAR WINDOW? THAT'S CRAZY. I'M GLAD YOU'RE HAVING THE HEARINGS.

I'M GLAD THAT'S A CONVERSATION.

I UNDERSTAND THAT PEOPLE WOULD LIKE THE WORLD TO BE A FAIR PLACE IN A BETTER PLACE, AND THAT'S ALL WONDERFUL.

BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS, WE'VE GOT TO PAY THE BILLS AND WHAT PAYS THE BILLS IS THE PROPERTY VALUES.

YOU DO STABILIZE THE PROPERTY VALUES AND WE'RE ALL IN TROUBLE.

I KNOW WHERE I'M GOING.

I'M GOING TO SELL OUT EVEN AFTER 40 YEARS.

BECAUSE LIKE MOST OF MY NEIGHBORS ALREADY HAVE, WHO CAME ABOUT THE SAME TIME THAT I DID.

I THINK YOU'RE VERY BRAVE TO ENTERTAIN THE IDEA OF DESTABILIZING THE ECONOMY OF DECATUR.

I THINK IT'S ON PURSUIT OF A NOBLE GOAL.

I HOPE IT DOESN'T COME BACK TO BITE YOU.

THE LOS WENT OUT. GET OFF.

IF YOU TRY THIS, I CAN GUARANTEE YOU THE CITY OF DECATUR WILL BE IN LITIGATION FOR THE REST OF OUR LIVES.

THERE'S A LOT OF CASH OUT THERE.

THERE'S A LOT OF MONEY OUT THERE.

I KNOW I PROBABLY HAVE A COUPLE OF MILLION DOLLARS WORTH OF REAL ESTATE HERE AND THAT'S JUST ME.

YOU REALLY NEED TO SIT DOWN AND HAVE A TALK ABOUT, DO YOU REALLY WANT TO DESTABILIZE THE ECONOMY HERE? DO YOU REALLY WANT TO SEND THIS MESSAGE TO THE REAL ESTATE COMMUNITY THAT THE DECATUR IS NOT A SAFE PLACE TO INVEST? BECAUSE YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY'RE GETTING READY TO DO NEXT? YOU MIGHT WANT TO THINK ABOUT THAT BECAUSE ONCE IT STARTS, I DON'T THINK ANY OF YOU CAN STOP.

>> THAT WAS THE LAST PERSON WHO SIGNED UP IN PERSON? [OVERLAPPING].

>> I TAKE AN HOUR AND A HALF AGO, SOME OF THE SAME FIRST NAME SPOKE.

>> I'M SORRY.

>> I WAS GETTING AT EARLIER IN THE MEETING UNTIL I GO FROM THIRD AVENUE.

SOMEONE WHO WAS ALSO A BILL.

THEY DIDN'T NEED TO SPEAK. I SHOULDN'T BE ON THERE.

I CHECKED A AND THE FIRST ONE.

>> GO AHEAD.

>> GREAT.

THANKS A LOT. IT'S BEEN A REALLY LONG NIGHT SO I'LL TRY TO KEEP THIS BRIEF.

[04:10:01]

I'M BILL AIGO. I'M A HOMEOWNER IN OCAST.

I'M ALSO SOMEONE WHO STRONGLY SUPPORTS AFFORDABLE HOUSING, SOCIOECONOMIC INCLUSION, AND RACIAL EQUITY.

I DO NOT, HOWEVER, SUPPORT INEFFECTIVE POLICY AND THINK THAT'S WHAT THESE AMENDMENTS ARE.

I'M NOT OPPOSED TO DENSER HOUSING, PRIME APHASIA, BUT I'M OPPOSED TO FURTHER UP ZONING BECAUSE IT WILL HAVE OR NOT HAVE THE INTENDED EFFECTS AND ULTIMATELY EXACERBATE AFFORDABILITY CHALLENGES.

THERE ARE MULTIPLE STUDIES THAT DEMONSTRATE THIS.

I AGREE WITH LA TENANTS UNION THAT UPZONING "ADVOCATES FOR A DEREGULATORY TRICKLE-DOWN FRAMEWORK FOR HOUSING POLICY THAT DOES MORE HARM THAN GOOD".

THESE AMENDMENTS ARE PRO-DEVELOPER AND WILL HAVE SEVERE NEGATIVE EFFECTS ON TENANTS.

THEY WILL ALLOW ABSENTEE DEVELOPERS TO PROFIT OFF OUR COMMUNITY.

THE MOST EGREGIOUS ISSUE WITH THEM IS THAT THEY WILL DENY MANY THE DREAM OF HOMEOWNERSHIP, ONE OF THE GREATEST CREATORS OF FINANCIAL SECURITY AND SOCIAL STABILITY.

THE ABILITY OF DEVELOPERS TO PUT MULTIPLE UNITS ON A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME LOT WILL INCREASE LAND VALUES.

BECAUSE THE LAND COST PER HOUSING UNIT WILL BE LOWERED BY DISTRIBUTING THE COST OF THE LOT ACROSS MULTIPLE UNITS, THE FINANCIAL RETURNS TO INVESTORS AND DEVELOPERS WILL RISE.

SUCH PROFITS WILL ATTRACT ADDITIONAL INVESTORS, DEMAND FOR REZONED, LOTS WILL INCREASE AND LAND VALUES WILL GO UP.

CHRISTOPHER HERBERT, THE MANAGING DIRECTOR OF THE HARVARD JOINT CENTER FOR HOUSING STUDIES SAID, "AS SOON AS YOU TELL ME I CAN PUT TWO UNITS THERE, IT'S GOING TO AFFECT THE PRICE OF THE LAND SINCE IT BECOMES MORE VALUABLE." INCREASING LAND VALUES WILL BE DISASTROUS AND PREVENT EVEN MORE PEOPLE FROM BUYING HOMES INDICATOR.

IF WE'VE LEARNED ANYTHING ABOUT THE HOUSING MARKET IN THE LAST TWO YEARS, IT'S THAT INDIVIDUALS ARE NO MATCH FOR CORPORATIONS WHEN BUYING A HOME.

THE ECONOMIC VALUE OF THE LAND TO INVESTORS WILL BE HIGHER THAN THE PRICE INDIVIDUAL CITIZENS WILL BE ABLE TO AFFORD.

FORCING WOULD BE HOMEOWNERS INTO RENTING AND TRANSFERRING OWNERSHIP OF THE LAND IN OUR COMMUNITY FROM CITIZENS TO ABSENTEE INVESTORS AND CORPORATIONS.

ACCORDING TO BUILDIUM, A PROPERTY MANAGEMENT SOFTWARE COMPANY, SO FOLKS WOULD BENEFIT FROM A NET INCREASE IN TENANCY.

UP ZONING LEADS TO HOUSING, "CONSOLIDATION STOKED BY LARGE HOUSING CORPORATIONS HOLDING A MONOPOLY ON NEW UNITS." IT'S OWNERSHIP ACCRUES TO WEALTHY INVESTORS AND DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS WHO CARE ONLY ABOUT THE FINANCIAL RETURN THEY GENERATE, WILL FIND THAT THE RENTERS IN OUR COMMUNITY ARE MORE HOUSING INSECURE AND THAT THERE ARE MORE OF THEM.

FAMILIES WHO OWN HOMES HAVE MORE CLEAR VISIBILITY INTO THEIR EXPENSES THAN THOSE WHO RENT SINCE LANDLORDS CAN RAISE PRICES AT ANY TIME, OFF ENFORCING TENANTS OUT OF THEIR HOMES.

WITH RISING LAND PRICES, MORE AND MORE PEOPLE WILL FIND THEMSELVES IN TENANCY SITUATIONS.

STUDIES BY URBAN PLANNING EXPERTS AND ECONOMISTS AT MIT FOUND THAT "UP ZONING INCREASED PRICES OF EXISTING HOUSING UNITS." THESE STUDIES SET OUT TO DEMONSTRATE THAT UP-ZONING WOULD IMPROVE AFFORDABILITY.

THE RESEARCHERS ARE DISAPPOINTED TO FIND THAT THE DATA DID NOT SUPPORT THAT CONCLUSION, THAT IT HAD THE OPPOSITE EFFECT.

WHAT'S WORSE, THESE AMENDMENTS WILL PRIMARILY AFFECT NEIGHBORHOODS THAT ARE AT LEAST ON A RELATIVE BASIS, MORE AFFORDABLE TODAY.

BECAUSE MANY OF THE DEVELOPMENTS WILL TEAR DOWN EXISTING HOUSES, CORPORATE INVESTORS WILL FOCUS THEIR EFFORTS ON PROPERTIES WITH THE LOWEST-VALUED IMPROVEMENTS.

THIS IS ESPECIALLY PROBLEMATIC FOR LOW AND MIDDLE-INCOME RESIDENTS WHO WILL SEE THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS GENTRIFIED AND THEIR RENTS RISE.

MANY WILL BE KICKED OUT OF THEIR HOMES THAT THEY'RE RENTING SO THAT DEVELOPERS CAN REDEVELOP THEM, CREATING NEAR-TERM DISPLACEMENT AND HOMELESSNESS.

THIS BURDEN WILL FALL ON PEOPLE OF COLOR IN OUR COMMUNITY EXPLICITLY.

ACCORDING TO A STUDY BY CHURCHES UNITED FOR FAIR HOUSING, "NEIGHBORHOODS ALSO SAW DRASTIC DECREASES IN THEIR BLACK AND LATINO POPULATIONS IN THE DECADE THAT THE ZONING CHANGES WERE PASSED.

IN ONE NEIGHBORHOOD STUDIED UP-ZONING LEAD TO A NET DECREASE IN THE LATINO POPULATION OF 15,000, WHILE THE NEIGHBORHOOD GREW BY 5,000 TOTAL RESIDENTS, THERE WAS A MASS EXODUS." IN ANOTHER STUDY BY URBAN PLANNING EXPERTS AND ECONOMIST AT THE LONDON SCHOOL OF ECONOMICS, THEY FOUND THAT, "BLANKET CHANGES IN ZONING ARE UNLIKELY TO IMPROVE AFFORDABILITY FOR LOWER-INCOME HOUSEHOLDS AND PROSPEROUS AREAS.

THEY WOULD, HOWEVER, INCREASE GENTRIFICATION WITHIN METROPOLITAN AREAS.

IT WOULD NOT APPRECIABLY DECREASE INCOME INEQUALITY." FINAL STUDY AND THIS IS A LOT.

IN ONE BY THE FEDERAL RESERVE ECONOMISTS WROTE THAT EVEN IF A CITY WERE ABLE TO EASE SOME SUPPLY CONSTRAINTS TO ACHIEVE A MARGINAL INCREASE IN ITS HOUSING STOCK, THE CITY WILL NOT EXPERIENCE A MEANINGFUL REDUCTION IN RENTAL BURDENS.

THESE AMENDMENTS ARE VERY WELL-INTENTIONED, BUT THEY'RE BASED ON OVERLY SIMPLISTIC IDEAS ABOUT HOW MARKETS FUNCTION.

THEY STOP IT RUDIMENTARY SUPPLY AND DEMAND, AND THEY LACK A NUANCED UNDERSTANDING OF ASSET PRICING.

THEY'LL ACCELERATE GENTRIFICATION LEAD TO HOUSING INSTABILITY FURTHERING OUR COMMUNITIES MARCH TOWARD A HOMOGENOUS, WEALTHY, WHITE, AND MIDDLE-AGED COMMUNITY.

I URGE YOU TO CONSIDER ALTERNATIVE, MORE THOUGHTFUL METHODS FOR ACHIEVING OUR GOALS.

THANK YOU ALL FOR VOLUNTEERING ALL YOUR TIME, ESPECIALLY TONIGHT.

>> THANK YOU. I CROSSED IT OUT BECAUSE HE'S CORRECT.

SOMEBODY MUST HAVE SAID THAT HE DIDN'T WANT TO SPEAK AND I DIDN'T KNOW IT WASN'T HIM.

[04:15:04]

IS THERE ANYONE ELSE PRESENT WHO HASN'T HAD A CHANCE TO SPEAK WHO WOULD LIKE TO?

>> I'M GOING TO BE VERY BRIEF, MR. CHAIRMAN. I'M ALAN MOY.

I ALSO APPRECIATE WHAT YOU ALL ARE DOING BECAUSE I SPENT 19 YEARS ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION BETWEEN 1980 AND 2000.

I'VE BEEN THERE. WE DREW THE ORDINANCE THAT APPARENTLY DID AWAY WITH DUPLEXES.

I WAS THE CHAIR WHEN THAT HAPPENED.

THE ORDINANCE THAT WAS REPLACED BY THE UDL WE DREW.

>> SIR, I CAN'T REMEMBER. DID YOU SHARE YOUR ADDRESS?

>> 809 WEST PONCE DE LEON.

>> THE ONE POINT I WANT TO MAKE TONIGHT IS THAT WHAT I'VE HEARD IS PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT TWO DIFFERENT ISSUES.

I DON T THINK YOU ALL HAVE BUT ONE ISSUE TO DEAL WITH.

THE ISSUE OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND DIVERSE HOUSING THAT'S NOT ANYTHING THAT WE ARGUE ABOUT.

WE ALL AGREE ON THAT.

WHAT YOU ALL HAVE TO DECIDE IS WHETHER THIS PARTICULAR ORDINANCE ACCOMPLISHES THAT.

IT'S REALLY SIMPLE.

IN MY EXPERIENCE, THIS PROPOSAL WILL CREATE MORE OF THE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES THAT CATHY GANNON WAS TALKING ABOUT, THEN IT WILL SOLVE.

IT PLANS FOR NOTHING.

I CAN TELL YOU THAT IN THE 80S AND 90S, WHEN I WAS ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION, WE WERE TRYING TO GROW, TO CATER INTO WHAT HAS NOW BECOME.

WHEN DICTATOR GOT TO THE POINT IN THE MID-90S WHEN IT WAS THE HOT COMMUNITY IN THE CITY, IT BECAME THE HONEYPOT FOR ALL OF THE DEVELOPERS.

WHAT THIS PROPOSAL WILL DO, BUT MOST OF THE DEVELOPMENT NOW IS IN DOWNTOWN TO CATER BECAUSE ALL THE LAND IS GONE.

BUT WHAT YOU'RE DOING IS YOU'RE OPENING UP 65 PERCENT OF THE CITY OF THE KADER, TELLING DEVELOPERS, COME ON BACK, ALL YOU GOT TO DO IS BUY A HOUSE AND TEAR IT DOWN, LIKE YOU'VE HEARD ABOUT ALREADY TONIGHT.

TEAR IT DOWN AND THEN YOU CAN BUILD.

WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO TO CONTROL THAT? YOU'RE GIVING PROPERTY RIGHTS, ESSENTIALLY BY AMENDING THE ZONING ORDINANCE.

I'M NOT GOING TO STAY UP HERE VERY LONG.

I'LL BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO OFFER YOU SOME SUGGESTIONS ABOUT HOW YOU CAN DEAL WITH THIS.

THEY'VE ALREADY BEEN SUGGESTED.

BUT I THINK THAT YOU COULD MODIFY THE PUD ORDINANCE TO CREATE A CITY COMMISSION REVIEW ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS THAT MIGHT SOLVE A LOT OF THE NIMBY FEARS THAT YOU'VE BEEN HEARING TONIGHT.

THAT WOULD GIVE YOU SOME CONTROL OVER ALL OF THOSE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES THAT HAD BEEN TALKED ABOUT: THE DEVELOPERS, THE MONEY, THE SIZE OF THESE UNITS, WHETHER THE UNIT IS GOING TO BE A RENTAL OR A CONDOMINIUM, IS THE LOT GOING TO HAVE TO BE TO HAVE A TRIPLEX OR A QUADPLEX.

IF YOU HAD A HEARING, AND THE REGULATIONS THAT WERE FOR THE PARTICULAR DISTRICT WERE THE REGULATIONS THAT WERE PRESENTED TO YOU IN AN APPLICATION THAT YOU APPROVED, THEN I WOULDN'T HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH IT.

IF YOU ALL THOUGHT IT WAS RIGHT, IT'S FINE.

BUT TRUSTING THE DEVELOPERS TO COME IN HERE AND DO WHAT'S RIGHT THAT'S FOOLHARDY.

>> THANK YOU. YES.

>> HI. I WASN'T PLANNING TO SPEAK TODAY, BUT MY NAME IS JUDE HOMES.

I GREW UP AT 202 KINGS HIGHWAY AND LIVE WITH MY MOM.

I'M 24 YEARS OLD AND I CANNOT AFFORD TO LIVE INDICATOR IF I WERE RENTING AT FULL PRICE.

I'M NOT ABLE TO AFFORD TO LIVE INDICATOR IF I WANTED TO BUY.

I AGREE WITH THE THOUGHT PROCESS BEHIND THIS PROPOSAL.

[04:20:03]

BUT AFTER HEARING A LOT OF THE ARGUMENTS TODAY, I'M NOT SURE I CAN SUPPORT IT.

I'M A BIG SUPPORTER OF PEOPLE OWNING HOMES.

I DON T THINK RENTING HOMES IS NECESSARILY THE BEST THING TO DO AND I FEEL ALLOWING PEOPLE TO CONVERT THEIR HOMES TO DUPLEXES, TRIPLEXES, AND QUADPLEXES WOULD INCREASE THE NUMBER OF RENTERS AND NOT INCREASE THE NUMBER OF OWNERS.

I ALSO THINK THAT DOING THIS OVER THE ENTIRE CITY OF THE DECATUR WOULD.

I THINK IT'S TOO BROAD.

I THINK THAT WE NEED TO INCREASE THE AMOUNT OF AFFORDABILITY IN THE TOWN CENTER AND START THERE, START IN SMALLER AREAS.

I KNOW A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN AGAINST TOWN HOMES.

I'M ACTUALLY IN SUPPORT OF TOWN HOMES BECAUSE THEY INCREASE OWNERSHIP AND TOWN HOMES CAN BE RUN BY CONDO ASSOCIATIONS AND CONDO ASSOCIATIONS OFTENTIMES HAVE RULES AGAINST HOW MANY UNITS CAN BE RENTED OUT.

I THINK WE NEED TO, INSTEAD OF DOING THIS, INCREASE THE NUMBER OF TOWN HOMES AND CONDOS IN THE CENTER TO INCREASE THE SUPPLY, BUT I ALSO UNDERSTAND [NOISE] THAT DECATUR A VERY SMALL PART OF THE ATLANTA METROPOLITAN AREA.

SOME OF THE NUMBERS I'VE SEEN SAY THAT THE ATLANTA METROPOLITAN AREA IS GOING TO DOUBLE IN SIZE IN THE NEXT FIVE OR 10 YEARS.

THEY GOT SOME CRAZY NUMBERS OUT THERE.

THIS ISN'T GOING TO SOLVE THE PROBLEM IN DECATUR.

BUT I THINK WE HAVE A VERY UNIQUE OPPORTUNITY TO LEAD THE WAY IN PROVIDING AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I JUST DON'T THINK THAT THIS IS NECESSARILY THE BEST WAY TO DO IT.

LIKE I SAID, TOWN HOMES AND CONDOMINIUMS ARE WHAT I WOULD SUPPORT. THANK YOU.

>> IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO HASN'T SPOKEN ALREADY? DO WE HAVE ANY IDEA HOW MANY PEOPLE ONLINE MIGHT WANT TO SPEAK? BECAUSE WE'VE BEEN AT THIS FOR FOUR-AND-A-HALF HOURS ALREADY.

>> I THINK WE NEED TO ASK THOSE THAT ARE PARTICIPATING ONLINE THROUGH THE ZOOM TO TURN ON THEIR VIDEO, RAISE THEIR HAND.

>> CLOSE IT. [LAUGHTER]

>> ALL RIGHT.

LET US KNOW IF THEY HAVE THAT OR THEY COULD USE THE VIRTUAL HAND.

>> WE WILL DO THAT WITH THE CAVEAT AFTER FOUR HOURS OF TESTIMONY.

UNLESS IT'S REALLY UNIQUE, MORE TALKING IS NOT GOING TO MOVE THE NEEDLE.

I'M JUST GOING TO BE TRANSPARENT.

WE CAN'T SIT HERE AND JUST LISTEN FOR UNLIMITED HOURS ON END.

>> WE HAVE CLOSE TO 20 PEOPLE.

ANYONE RAISING THEIR HAND OR WAVING THEIR HAND? THAT'S A NO.

>> [NOISE] KRISTIN, DO YOU HAVE ANY FOLLOW-UP OR MARKS THAT YOU'D LIKE TO MAKE?

>> YES. THANK YOU EVERYONE FOR THE COMMENTS AND ALL THE THOUGHTFUL FEEDBACK.

JUST A COUPLE OF THINGS.

A LOT OF PEOPLE SAID WE NEED TO WORK ON AFFORDABILITY DOWNTOWN.

THAT WAS ONE OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS OF THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK FORCE REPORT, INCLUSIONARY ZONING.

EVERYONE WAS SAYING IT REALLY WORKED IN NEW YORK. WE SHOULD DO IT HERE.

WE ARE DOING IT HERE, SO THAT'S GREAT.

IT'S 10 PERCENT AFFORDABLE UNITS DOWNTOWN.

PEOPLE TALKED ABOUT TRYING TO ADDRESS AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND HAVING EXPERTS LOOK AT THIS, HAVING A REAL CONCERTED COMMUNITY EFFORT.

THEY REALLY WANT AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

HOW DO WE MAKE THAT HAPPEN? IT'S BEEN FOUR YEARS NOW SINCE I STARTED WORKING WITH THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK FORCE ON THAT REPORT.

IT'S BEEN IN FOUR YEARS, OF REALLY LOOKING AT HOW WE MOVE THE NEEDLE ON AFFORDABILITY IN DECATUR.

THIS WAS ONE OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS.

I THINK THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE SAID WE NEED TO GET PEOPLE TOGETHER, FOCUS ON THIS, HAVE A TASK FORCE, HAVE RECOMMENDATIONS.

THAT'S WHAT WE'VE DONE AND THAT'S WHERE WE ARE AND THAT'S WHY I'M HERE TODAY BECAUSE THIS IS A RECOMMENDATION.

I TALKED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE TRAJECTORY THAT WAS BROUGHT UP A COUPLE OF TIMES ABOUT TEAR DOWNS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

RIGHT NOW, WE ONLY HAVE THE OPTION TO TEAR DOWN AND BUILD A HUGE SINGLE-FAMILY HOME.

IT PUTS US MORE IN THE SAME TRAJECTORY WE'VE BEEN IN.

THIS POLICY THAT'S WRITTEN GIVES THE ABILITY IF THERE'S A TEAR DOWN TO DO MULTIPLE UNITS, WHICH IS A BETTER USE OF LAND AND AT THE MARKET RATE CAN CREATE

[04:25:01]

UNITS THAT ARE NOT THE SAME PRICE OF HUGE MARKET RATE HOME.

INSTEAD OF BEING LIKE A $1.2 MILLION HOME, YOU MIGHT HAVE FOUR $350,000 UNITS.

THESE CAN BE FOR SALE.

I KNOW THE FIRST SALE HAS BEEN BROUGHT UP A LOT, BUT YOU CAN CONDOIZE THEM AND SELL THEM.

YOU COULD OWN TWO AND RENT OUT TWO.

IT GIVES A LOT OF FLEXIBILITY OF SOMEONE WHO HAS A DUPLEX, OWNS HALF AND RENTS THE OTHER HALF.

THAT COULD GIVE FLEXIBILITY FOR PEOPLE, WHICH IS ALSO WHAT THIS IS ABOUT.

A LOT OF PEOPLE WANTED A GUARANTEE ON AFFORDABILITY, AND THAT'S WHERE THE LAND TRUST COMES IN.

BECAUSE I JUST TALKED ABOUT THE MARKET RATE WHERE YOU CAN HAVE OWNER OR RENTAL, YOU CAN HAVE A PRICE POINT THAT YOU DON'T REALLY SEE IN DECATUR AT ALL ANYMORE FOR NEW UNITS, BUT THE LAND TRUST IS A WAY, LIKE PEOPLE SAID, FOR THINGS NOT TO ROLL BACK TO MARKET RATE.

THAT IS PART OF THE WHOLE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK FORCE REPORT THAT WORKS TOGETHER WITH THIS RECOMMENDATION.

BECAUSE UNITS CREATED BY THE DECATUR LAND TRUST WITH THE INITIAL [NOISE] UPFRONT COST TO HAVE THE LAND AND TO PARTNER WITH SOMEONE TO BUILD OR TO RENOVATE THE INSIDE, KEEPS IT AFFORDABLE AND PERPETUITY.

THAT'S THE 99 YEAR GROUND LEASE THAT SOMEONE MENTIONED, AND IT'S RENEWABLE FOR ANOTHER 99 YEARS.

WE CAN CONTROL THE RENT ON THOSE BECAUSE THE LAND TRUST IS ACTUALLY THE LANDLORD, SO THEY SET THE RENT, SO CAN ALSO KEEP THE RENTS AFFORDABLE.

THIS CREATES AN OPPORTUNITY FOR MORE UNITS AND WE ACTUALLY HAVE OPPORTUNITIES OUT THERE RIGHT NOW.

SOMEONE MENTIONED THE SCHOOL PROPERTIES, THE FOUR HOMES THAT ARE OWNED BY THE SCHOOL AND INSTEAD OF FOUR HOMES THAT COULD BECOME EIGHT OR 12 DEPENDING ON HOW THE HOMES LEND THEMSELVES, BUT YOU HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY RIGHT THERE TO PROVIDE HOUSING, AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO AND WHEN PEOPLE SAY THEY WANT AFFORDABLE HOUSING, THIS IS HOW WE [LAUGHTER] ALWAYS TRY TO GET THERE.

THIS IS ONE WAY WE MOVE THE NEEDLE ON AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

PEOPLE TALKED A LITTLE ABOUT PARKING.

I HAD A MAP THAT I SHOWED THE LAST TIME I DID THIS PRESENTATION FOR THE PLANNING COMMISSION OF WHERE ACCIDENTS HAPPEN IN DECATUR.

IN THE STREETS WHERE WE MOVE OUR TRAFFIC THROUGH THE FASTEST ARE WHERE WE SEE THE MOST ACCIDENTS.

ON STREET PARKING IS TRAFFIC CALMING.

SOMEONE ASKED IF PEOPLE WENT AROUND AND COUNTED SPACES.

I DID COUNT SPACES, BUT I COUNTED ON STREET AVAILABLE SPACES.

MANY TIMES A DAY THROUGHOUT A YEAR OR SO AS I'VE BEEN WORKING ON THIS, TO SEE HOW CROWDED OUR STREETS ARE, IS THIS A PROBLEM? CAN I RECOMMEND THIS ON STREET PARKING? I FOUND THAT MOST OF OUR STREETS UNLESS SOMEONE IS HAVING A BIG PARTY, THERE'S A LOT OF STREET PARKING AVAILABLE.

[LAUGHTER] THAT'S THE REASON THAT THAT IS IN THERE.

PROPERTY VALUES, I KNOW THIS IS A HUGE CONCERN FOR PEOPLE.

THERE'S BEEN NO STUDY THAT SAYS THAT PROPERTY VALUES GO DOWN FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING OR MULTI-UNIT HOUSING AND AS ONE PERSON POINTED OUT, IT'S CORRECT THAT SOMETIMES THEY GO UP AND WHETHER OR NOT THE PROPERTY VALUE IS GOING UP ARE RELATED JUST BECAUSE THAT AREA IS ALREADY SO [NOISE] DESIRABLE OR BECAUSE OF ZONING, THAT'S THE QUESTION STILL OUT THERE, BUT IT CAN, IN SOME CASES RAISE THE PROPERTY VALUE, ALTHOUGH IT'S BEEN SHOWN ALSO TO SLIGHTLY DECREASE RENT IN MINNEAPOLIS.

LET'S SEE. PRESERVATION. I THINK THERE'S SOMEONE FROM ADAM STREET THEY TALKED ABOUT PRESERVATION.

I HAD TO TALK TO OUR PRESERVATIONIST TODAY IN THE CITY OF DECATUR AND BEING ABLE TO CREATE UNITS INSIDE A HOUSE IS ONE WAY TO PRESERVE IT.

[NOISE] SHE SAID OVER HISTORY, THAT'S WHY WE HAVE A LOT OF THESE OLDER HOUSES.

YOU SEE SOME ON SYCAMORE THAT ARE OLDER HOMES THAT ARE CONVERTED ON THE INSIDE BECAUSE IT HAS TRADITIONALLY BEEN A WAY TO PRESERVE HOUSING.

I WANT TO ADDRESS JUST A COUPLE OF MORE THINGS. SORRY. I KNOW IT'S REALLY LATE.

SOMEONE WAS LIKE, WE SAID, THAT WE'VE DONE A LOT FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN DECATUR.

I JUST WANT TO POINT OUT THAT THE HOUSING AUTHORITY HAS REALLY BEEN THE ONLY VEHICLE FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND THEIR WAIT-LIST IS 12,000 PEOPLE.

NOW, THEY ARE MOSTLY IN THE 0-80 PERCENT OF AMI, WHICH IS AREA MEDIAN INCOME.

WHEREAS THE MISSING MIDDLE, IT'S MIDDLE-SIZE AND MIDDLE INCOME.

THAT'S LOOKING MORE LIKE THE 60-100 PERCENT OF AMI.

THAT'S MORE OF OUR TEACHERS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

LET'S SEE. ONE MORE THING I WANTED TO POINT OUT.

SOMEONE ASKED ABOUT LUCRATIVE DEVELOPMENT AND WHAT PEOPLE HAVE ACTUALLY TALKED TO YOU ABOUT IF DEVELOPMENT IS LUCRATIVE ENOUGH AND THERE HAVE BEEN THREE SO FAR.

ONE OF THEM HAD A LOT AND WANTED TO BUILD A DUPLEX TWO UNITS, BUT WANTED TO PUT TWO LARGE GARAGES ON THERE TOO.

[NOISE] THEY WANTED TO SELL THEM FOR BETWEEN 700,000-800,000 A PIECE AND I SAID THAT THIS POLICY WON'T ALLOW THAT BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO BE SMALLER AND YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO HAVE THE TWO GARAGES ON.

THAT'S AN EXAMPLE OF SOMEONE WHO WANTED A MORE LUCRATIVE, EXPENSIVE OPTION THAT THIS POLICY ACTUALLY WOULDN'T ADDRESS.

YOU'D HAVE TO HAVE SOMEONE COME INTO WANTS TO BUILD SOMETHING SMALLER THAN THAT, AND WITHOUT THE TWO GARAGES.

THEN ANOTHER PERSON THAT I SPOKE TO WANTED TO PUT THREE DIFFERENT LOTS, WANTED TO PUT I BELIEVE IT WAS 30-40 UNITS ON THOSE AND I SAID, WELL, THIS WOULD ONLY ALLOW, A QUADPLEX IS FOUR, SO YOU'RE LOOKING AT 16 UNITS.

IT WOULDN'T CREATE THIS HUGE, LUCRATIVE ENVIRONMENT EITHER.

[04:30:03]

THOSE WERE SOME OF THOSE THAT PEOPLE HAD BROUGHT UP.

NOAH HOUSING, OLDER HOUSING STOCK THAT WE HAVE, THAT IS SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED.

BUT I THINK THAT'S OUTSIDE OF THIS ISSUE.

WE'RE TRYING TO ADDRESS OLDER HOUSING THAT IS OUT THERE.

EITHER THE LAND TRUST COULD EVENTUALLY, IF IT RAISES ENOUGH MONEY, TRY TO BUY SOME OF THAT STOCK OR WE CAN TRY TO USE OUR REPAIR PROGRAM TO ASSIST RENTERS TO KEEP IT AFFORDABLE.

BUT THESE ARE TWO OTHER RECOMMENDATIONS THAT ARE ACTUALLY IN THE TASK FORCE, REPORT 2 ALONG WITH THE RECOMMENDATION THAT WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT TONIGHT, TO LOOK AT HOW WE RETAIN THAT NOAH HOUSING, WHICH IS VERY DIFFICULT TO DO.

BUT THERE ARE WAYS BETWEEN THE LAND TRUST AND POTENTIALLY A REPAIR PROGRAM.

ALSO THE LAST THING I WANTED TO SAY IS POLICIES THAT COULD ACCOMPANY THIS BECAUSE PEOPLE TALKED ABOUT SOME FEARS AROUND SHORT-TERM RENTALS.

THAT IS THE POLICY THAT COULD GO ALONGSIDE THIS.

THE SIZE OF HOMES, WE HEAR SOMETIMES FROM THE COMMUNITY ABOUT LOOKING AT SIZING OF HOMES, AGAIN, MAXIMUM SIZES OR SOMETHING THAT PORTLAND DID WITH THIS RECOMMENDATION FOR THE MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING, WAS THEY SHRUNK THE SIZES OF THEIR HOMES THEN ALLOWED DENSITY BONUSES, AND ALSO OWNER OCCUPANCY.

THERE ARE DIFFERENT POLICIES THAT DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO BE BAKED INTO THIS RECOMMENDATION BUT CAN MOVE ALONGSIDE OF WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT AS THIS PROCESS GOES FORWARD.

BUT THOSE ARE THE MAIN THINGS I WANTED TO POINT OUT.

UNLESS THERE ARE FURTHER QUESTIONS FROM ANYONE.

>> WE DID HERE CONCERNS THAT WERE VALID.

FOR EXAMPLE THERE WERE CONCERNS ABOUT SHORT-TERM RENTALS.

IS THERE ANY PROHIBITION AGAINST THAT IN THE PROPOSAL?

>> AS I JUST MENTIONED, I THINK WE CAN MOVE SOME OTHER POLICIES ALONGSIDE THIS PROPOSAL.

SHORT-TERM RENTAL BE A SEPARATE POLICY.

IT'S NOT NECESSARILY PART OF THIS RECOMMENDATION, BUT IT'S SOMETHING THAT IF IT'S A RECOMMENDATION, WE COULD BRING TO THE CITY COMMISSION AS PART OF THE WHOLE DISCUSSION.

THERE ARE DIFFERENT CITIES AROUND GEORGIA RIGHT NOW DOING CERTAIN THINGS FOR SHORT-TERM RENTALS.

THAT'S DEFINITELY A POSSIBILITY.

>> THEN YOU YOU YOU TALKED ABOUT HALF OF THE UNITS THAT COME OUT OF THIS BEING ABLE TO BE RENTED.

IS THERE IS THERE A CAP ON HOW MANY OF THESE OR WHAT PROPORTION OF THESE CAN BE OFFERED FOR RENT?

>> LIKE I SAID IN MY PRESENTATION, WE'RE EXPECTING A VERY GENTLE DENSITY OF ABOUT EIGHT TO 10 PER YEAR.

IT DEPENDS ON WHAT PEOPLE WANT TO DO WITH THEM.

IF IT'S A LAND TRUST PROJECT, THE LAND TRUST IS REALLY VESTED IN HOME OWNERSHIP, PERMANENTLY AFFORDABLE HOME OWNERSHIP.

INSTEAD OF HAVING ONE HOUSE, THEY MIGHT HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE FOUR UNITS THAT ARE NEW.

OR THEY COULD CONVERT A HOUSE THAT'S OUT THERE OR JUST PRESERVE AN OLDER HOME INSTEAD OF HAVING IT TORN DOWN.

THAT'S ANOTHER FEATURE OF THE LAND TRUST.

AS FAR AS THE MARKET RATE, THERE COULD BE SOME CONTROLS PUT IN PLACE, BUT I'M NOT SURE THAT WE ARE AT THE POINT RIGHT NOW TO LIMIT THE NUMBER OF RENTALS, BUT THAT COULD BE A POLICY THAT WENT ALONGSIDE THIS AS WELL.

I JUST DON'T THINK IT WOULD BE BAKED INTO THESE RECOMMENDATIONS, SO IT'D BE A SEPARATE POLICY THAT MOVES ALONGSIDE OF THAT.

>> DOES ANYONE ELSE HAVE QUESTIONS?

>> I'VE GOT ONE REAL QUICK QUESTION, KRISTIN.

RIGHT NOW, THE WAY THAT IT'S DRAFTED, THERE ARE NO SPECIAL USE CONTROLS.

IN OTHER WORDS, LIKE EVEN THOUGH RESIDENTIAL ZONING IS ALLOWED IN THE DOWNTOWN DISTRICT.

WHEN A PROJECT COMES BEFORE US, IT'S FORCED TO GO GET A SPECIAL USE PERMIT TO COME BEFORE US.

IT TRIGGERS THE VARIOUS THINGS THAT I'VE HEARD HALF A DOZEN PEOPLE TALK ABOUT, WHAT CONTROLS WOULD THERE BE THAT EACH OF THESE COULD BE REVIEWED ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS? NONE OF THAT IS CURRENTLY IN THE CURRENT PROPOSAL.

>> THAT'S CORRECT.

>> OKAY. THAT'S WHY I WAS NOT. THAT'S WHAT I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE GLARE.

>> I HAVE SOME QUESTIONS.

>> PLEASE GO AHEAD.

>> NUMBER 1, HOW WOULD THE ADUS BE HANDLED WITH DUPLEXES, TRIPLEXES AND QUADPLEXES? THE WAY I READ THE ORDINANCE AND IT'S WORDED PER PRINCIPLE DWELLING UNIT.

IF YOU HAVE IF YOU HAVE A QUADPLEX, COULD YOU ALSO HAVE AN ADU?

>> I THINK THAT THAT NEEDS TO BE SPECIFICALLY WRITTEN INTO THE PROPOSED CODE BECAUSE IT'S UNCLEAR THE WAY THE CODE IS WRITTEN AND WHAT IS PROPOSED.

>> ONE ADU?

>> ONE ADU, YES.

ALSO, SINCE THE WALK-UP FLAT BUILDING TYPE ALLOWS DWELLING UNITS TO BE VERTICALLY OR HORIZONTALLY INTEGRATED, MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT A TOWNHOUSE CONFIGURATION WOULD BE ALLOWED. IS THAT TRUE?

[04:35:06]

>> WELL, IT'S NOT REALLY DESIGNED TO ALLOW A TOWNHOUSE PER SE BECAUSE MOST OF THE LOTS, THE WAY THEY ARE, YOU WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO HAVE FOUR TOWN HOMES JUST WITH THE SETBACKS AND THE SIZE CONSTRAINTS SIDE-BY-SIDE.

IT'S MORE SO WRITTEN FOR THE LOTS THAT ARE LONG AND NARROW.

INSTEAD OF HAVING AN OVER-UNDER, YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO HAVE ONE BEHIND ANOTHER.

YOU HAVE ONE UNIT THAT FACES THE STREET AND THEN MAYBE THE OTHER THREE FACES SIDE STREET OR A DRIVEWAY OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

BUT IT'S REALLY TO GIVE MORE FLEXIBILITY TO HELP THESE FIT INTO A NEIGHBORHOOD.

FOR EXAMPLE, THE ONE I MENTIONED AT 600 COMMERCE, THAT IS RIGHT NOW IS LIKE AN OVER-UNDER SITUATION WHICH DOESN'T REALLY FIT THERE.

MAYBE IT WOULD LOOK A LITTLE BIT BETTER IF IT'S JUST ONE LEVEL.

IT'S JUST TO GIVE SOME FLEXIBILITY.

>> I'M CONCERNED THAT THAT THAT MIGHT BE WHAT A DEVELOPER WANTS TO DO.

I THINK WE NEED TO PUT SOME PROTECTIONS IN THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN TO MAKE SURE THAT WE GET WHAT WE WANT AND NOT CONCERNED ABOUT TOWNHOUSE DEVELOPMENT.

>> I THINK YOU COULD PUT TWO DUPLEX UNITS SIDE-BY-SIDE SIMILAR TO WHAT A TOWNHOUSE WOULD LOOK LIKE.

BUT THE WIDTH OF THE LOTS.

>> EVEN YOUR EXAMPLE FOR A CORNER LOT, THOSE ARE TOWNHOUSES ON A CORNER, BUT I CAN SEE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING ON A NORMAL SINGLE-FAMILY LOT YOU WOULDN'T HAVE [NOISE].

BUT I'M STILL CONCERNED ABOUT.

I'M JUST TRYING TO ANTICIPATE.

I DO THINK DEVELOPERS WILL TAKE THIS AND TRY AND MAXIMIZE.

I'M JUST TRYING TO POKE HOLES.

I DO SUPPORT IT, BUT I'M TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DON'T GET UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES.

>> YEAH. I THINK ONE THING I JUST WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT TODAY, YOU SAID THAT ABOUT DEVELOPERS IS THAT IT'S STILL GOING TO BE LESS EXPENSIVE OVERALL TO BUILD A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME.

THIS IS GOING TO BE MORE MISSION-DRIVEN DEVELOPERS.

I THINK THAT WANTS TO DO THIS BECAUSE IF YOU'RE DOING A LARGE SINGLE-FAMILY HOME AND SELLING THAT VERSUS SPENDING MORE MONEY TO PUT IN FOUR KITCHENS AND ALL OF THAT, IT'S MORE EXPENSIVE TO DO THAT TYPE OF WORK AS WELL.

>> SOME OF THIS IS HAPPENING IN THE AREAS IN ATLANTA THAT ARE ZONED R5.

THEY'VE DUPLEX ZONING AND THEY ALLOW ZERO LOT LINE, BUT THEY ALLOW THE ADUS AND THEY ALLOW GUEST HOUSES.

THERE'S THERE'S SOME STRETCHING OF THE INTERPRETATION OF THE ORDINANCE GOING ON THAT I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE VERY TIGHT WITH OUR LANGUAGE SO THAT THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN HERE.

THAT IS SPECIFICALLY AN EDGE WOULD.

THERE ARE SOME PROPOSALS THERE THAT WE COULD LOOK AT TO HELP US TIGHTEN LANGUAGE.

>> ONE THING ON THAT, SO IF YOU TURN TO PAGE ONE OF THE CHANGES THAT'S THE MARKED UP VERSION.

ON PAGE ONE, IT'S TALKING ABOUT STACKED FLATS AND HOW THAT BUILDING TYPE ACCOMMODATES DWELLING UNITS THAT ARE VERTICALLY AND HORIZONTALLY INTEGRATED.

THE KEY THING BEING, THERE'S NO WALL.

THAT WAS THE WAY TO PREVENT TOWN HOMES FROM BEING DEVELOPED, OR THAT INTERPRETATION TO BE TWISTED.

WITH THE WALK-UP, WHICH IS THE THREE TO FOUR UNITS, RIGHT NOW, IT'S BEING PROPOSED AS WRITTEN AND, OR VERTICALLY AND, OR HORIZONTALLY.

MAYBE TO ADDRESS YOUR CONCERN IS THAT WE WOULD ELIMINATE THE OR, BUT THERE MIGHT BE SOME UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES, KRISTIN, THAT I'M NOT THINKING OF.

>> IT'S THE VERTICAL ORIENTATION THAT ALLOWS THE TOWN HOME, NOT THE HORIZONTAL?

>> WELL, IT WOULD BE HORIZONTAL.

>> HORIZONTALLY INTEGRATED?

>> YEAH. HORIZONTALLY INTEGRATED LIKE A TOWN HOME? THIS WAY, IT WOULD REQUIRE THAT MIX IF WE WERE TO ELIMINATE THE WALL.

BUT THAT'S JUST SOMETHING FOR YOU TO THINK OF.

>> THEN THESE ARE JUST MY COMMENTS.

THERE WERE A LOT OF REALLY GOOD QUESTIONS THAT CAME UP, ESPECIALLY FROM THE FIRST SPEAKER.

BUT ALSO I'M INTERESTED IN CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR THE TRIPLEX AND QUADPLEX.

I JUST THINK THAT THOSE TWO TYPES MIGHT NEED A LITTLE MORE REVIEW.

THOSE ARE JUST MY THOUGHTS.

>> I AGREE WITH YOU WITH

[04:40:03]

THE FULL EXPECTATION THAT EVERY TIME I USE PERMIT APPLICATIONS COMES IN FOR A TRIPLEX OR QUADRUPLEX.

EVERYBODY IS GOING TO SHOW UP SCREAMING ABOUT IT.

[OVERLAPPING].

>> I'M NOT CONCERNED ABOUT LAND DAILIES GOING DOWN, I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THEM INCREASING.

BECAUSE YOU CAN DEVELOP A MULTIFAMILY UNIT INSTEAD OF A SINGLE-FAMILY UNITS.

YOU CAN GET FOUR UNITS.

I'M CONCERNED THAT THEY WOULD NOT BE AFFORDABLE.

I'M CONCERNED ABOUT JUST INCENTIVES FOR TEAR DOWNS OF HOMES THAT ARE THE MORE AFFORDABLE HOMES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR IN THE CITY OF DECATUR.

>> I THINK THESE CONCERNS ALL.

A LOT OF THESE CAN BE ADDRESSED WITH OTHER POLICIES ALONGSIDE AS WELL.

I THINK THAT'S SUGGESTED WE COULD TAKE BACK TO WORK ON.

>> ONE THING I FORGOT TO ASK, THERE'S ALSO NOTHING THAT LIMITS OR DELINEATES MINIMUMS SIZE REQUIREMENTS, CORRECT?

>> THEY WILL HAVE TO FIT INTO THE SAME FOOTPRINT OF A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME?

>> SURE. BUT I CAN TAKE A 2000 SQUARE FOOT HOUSE AND STICK FOR 450 SQUARE FOOT MINIS IN THERE THEORETICALLY.

>> THERE'S NOTHING IN HERE THAT SAYS YOU CAN ONLY HAVE 1,500 SQUARE FOOT UNIT AND THE OTHERS CAN ALL BE BIGGEST.

THERE'S NO LIKE SIZE-WISE REQUIREMENTS INSIDE.

>> WE MAY WANT SOME MICRO UNITS CLASSIFIED.

WE'VE BUILT 500 SQUARE FOOT UNITS THAT HAVE MURPHY BEDS AND NEW DEVELOPMENTS.

>> IF I MAY ADDRESS THAT.

PRESENTLY, MULTIFAMILY DWELLINGS THAT ARE BEING DEVELOPED HAVE TO HAVE A MINIMUM OF 500 SQUARE FEET.

ALL OTHER DWELLING UNITS, THEY HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE BUILDING CODE, THE BUILDING CODE SET STANDARDS OF MINIMUM FLOOR AREA FOR BEDROOM LIVING SPACES, ET CETERA.

THAT'S SOMETHING TO KEEP IN MIND.

>> DID ANYBODY ELSE? GO AHEAD GREG.

>> THE PARTS THAT SPEAK TO THE ON-STREET PARKING THAT IS ALLOWED MENTIONED COMPACT CARS.

THIS WAS BROUGHT UP BY AN EARLIER COMMENT.

WHAT MECHANISM ENFORCES COMPACT CARS BEING THE ONES TO UTILIZE THE ON-STREET PARKING?

>> WELL, A COMPACT CAR DESIGNATION IS 15 FEET.

FOR EVERY 15 FEET OF FRONTAGE, ONE CAR WOULD BE ALLOWED.

NOW, LIKE SOMEONE BROUGHT UP, WE DON'T KNOW, MAYBE SOMEONE WILL HAVE TWO HUGE OVER-SIZED CARS AND 15 FEET ISN'T ENOUGH.

THAT WAS WHAT IS IN THE RECOMMENDATION.

IT CAN BE INCREASED TO A MIDSIZE CAR MEASUREMENT IF THAT'S BETTER.

BUT WE THOUGHT GOING IN WITH A COMPACT CAR AND IF YOU HAVE 30 FEET OF FRONTAGE IN FRONT OF YOUR HOUSE, A LOT OF CARS WILL FIT IN THAT 30 FEET OF FRONTAGE IF YOU HAVE TWO CARS THERE.

THAT WOULD BE FOR A QUADRUPLEX.

I WANT TO POINT OUT TOO IN THAT DISCUSSION THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO PUT CARS ON THE STREET, IT'S AN OPTION.

SOMEONE THAT WAS DOING THIS MIGHT WANT TO PUT ALL THE PARKING ON THE SITE.

BUT PARKING IS A KILLER FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING, THE COST OF IT AND ALL OF THAT AND SHRINKING OF THE SIZES.

THAT'S LIKE PARKING AND AFFORDABLE HOUSING DON'T MESH VERY WELL.

THAT'S WHY PART OF THE RECOMMENDATION OF PUTTING THEM ON THE STREET ASIDE FROM THE FACT THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T WANT THE CITY TO PUT ANY TYPE OF PARKING REGULATION ON AS YOU HEARD TONIGHT.

IT'S A COMPROMISE BETWEEN HAVING ALL OF IT ON-SITE OR NOT REQUIRING ANY OF IT TO BE ON-SITE.

IT'S HALFWAY COMPROMISE AND USING THE COMPACT CAR AS THAT 15 FOOT PER CAR GUIDELINE.

>> HAS THERE BEEN ANY THOUGHT ABOUT THE CONCERN OF CORPORATE INVESTORS BEING THE MAIN DRIVERS OF THIS TYPE OF HOUSING AND WAYS TO? BECAUSE I CAN'T SEE A SITUATION WHERE AS IS HAPPENING IN COMMUNITIES ACROSS METROPOLITAN ATLANTA AND THE UNITED STATES WHERE YOU HAVE CORPORATE GROUPS THAT BUY HOUSING AND THEN THEY BASICALLY RENT IT. [OVERLAPPING]

>> YEAH. I HAVE A SLIDE ON THAT.

KRISTIN, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN PULL UP THE SLIDES.

YEAH, THAT ONE RIGHT THERE. THANK YOU.

THAT'S THE METRO ATLANTA AREA AND THE DARK SPOTS THERE ARE THE AREAS THAT HAVE HIGH CORPORATE OWNERSHIP.

[04:45:01]

I DID RESEARCH THIS TOPIC THAT DECATUR IS ONE OF THE LIGHT COLORED ONES.

IN GREATER DECATUR INCLUDING THE SOUTH END OF DECATUR AND 30030 [NOISE] WE'VE HAD ABOUT 10 PERCENT INVESTOR PURCHASES IN THE LAST FEW YEARS, WHERE ATLANTA IS AT ABOUT 33 PERCENT RIGHT NOW.

OUR LEVEL IS BELOW WHERE ATLANTA WAS BEFORE THE BIG CORPORATE INVESTORS SURGE.

I'M NOT SAYING THAT WE SHOULDN'T WATCH THIS, BUT IF THIS IS A GENTLE DENSITY PROPOSAL, WE CAN ADDRESS POLICIES AS WELL AS THEY MOVE ALONG.

BUT THE CORPORATE OWNERSHIP TARGETS HOUSES THAT ARE SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES THAT ARE TYPICALLY AROUND, NATIONALLY WAS 295,000.

IN GEORGIA, THE AVERAGE PRICE WAS 256,000.

THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE TARGETING.

INVESTORS ALSO PAY LOWER THAN THE MARKET PRICE.

I DON'T WANT TO SPEAK OUT OF TURN, BUT I THINK THERE'S SOME TAKING ADVANTAGE OF HOUSEHOLDS THAT DON'T KNOW THEIR HOUSE VALUE.

I'M ALSO HOPING WITH THE LAND TRUST THAT IF WE CAN MAKE OFFERS TO PEOPLE AND HAVE PEOPLE COME IN AND GIVE APPRAISALS OF THEIR HOUSES SO THEY KNOW THAT THEY'RE GETTING THE RIGHT AMOUNT.

IF THEY DECIDE THEY WANT TO SELL THAT, MAYBE THEY WOULD SELL TO AN ENTITY LIKE THAT AND NOT TO A CORPORATE INVESTOR.

>> THE REASON I ASKED THAT QUESTION IS BECAUSE IN MY UNDERSTANDING, AND I WANTED TO SEE IF YOU AGREED AND IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU DO, IS THAT THE PHENOMENON OF CORPORATE INVESTORS COMING IN, BUYING PROPERTIES AND THEN RENTING THEM OUT BASICALLY TURNING OWNER OCCUPIED NEIGHBORHOODS INTO RENTAL NEIGHBORHOODS IS A BIGGER PHENOMENON IN LOWER PRICED COMMUNITIES THAN IT IS IN A COMMUNITY LIKE THIS ONE, BECAUSE THE COST OF THE LAND MAKES IT A LOT LESS PROFITABLE THAN IF YOU GO SOMEWHERE ELSE.

>> YEAH. THEY'RE BUYING SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES PREDOMINANTLY AT THE $250,000 LEVEL.

THAT JUST DOESN'T EXIST HERE.

THEY'RE ALSO BUYING IN HEAVILY BLACK AREAS AND GENTRIFYING AREAS, AREAS WITH A LOT OF RENTERS.

THOSE ARE SOME CHARACTERISTICS THAT I'VE READ ABOUT WHERE THE SINGLE-FAMILY HOME BUYING IS HAPPENING.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE MAP, YOU CAN SEE THAT A LOT OF THE GENTRIFYING AREAS ESPECIALLY AROUND THE BELT LINE ARE ONES THAT ARE SEEING A LOT OF THAT ACTIVITY.

BUT I DO THINK WE NEED TO BE READY WITH POLICIES.

I THINK THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT.

I'M NOT TRYING TO DISMISS ANYONE'S FEARS ABOUT THINGS LIKE THIS.

BUT I THINK THAT WE COULD PUT THIS POLICY IN PLACE IN A WAY THAT IS SEEN AS FIT, ADDRESS THESE CONCERNS AND LOOK AT OTHER POLICIES SUCH AS THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL THAT YOU MENTIONED, HAVING POLICY IDEAS AROUND CORPORATE OWNERSHIP AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

I ALSO WANT TO SAY THERE ARE SOME SMALLER OWNERS OF RENTAL IN DECATUR THAT SERVE A VALUABLE PURPOSE AS WELL.

WE'VE HEARD FROM A COUPLE OF THEM TONIGHT.

I KNOW THERE'S FEAR IN GENERAL AROUND RENTERS OR PEOPLE THAT HAVE RENTAL PROPERTY, BUT IT DOES PLAY A PART IN THE HOUSING ECOSYSTEM HERE.

>> DOES ANYONE ELSE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR KRISTIN?

>> JUST A COUPLE OF COMMENTS.

I THINK GROWING UP IN VIRGINIA HIGHLAND MIDTOWN, PARTS OF DECATUR, MORE DUPLEXES AND SOME TRIPLEXES SPRINKLED IN.

IT'S FINE. IT'S GOOD, IT BRINGS A VIBRANCY.

BUT A LOT OF THOSE THAT ARE DONE THAT FIT IN WE'RE DONE BEFORE THE LAND PRICE SPIKES THAT WE'VE SEEN.

THERE'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT DYNAMIC AT PLAY.

TODAY WHEN SOMEBODY BUYS SOMETHING IN TERMS OF WHAT THEY HAVE TO DO, I COULD IMAGINE THERE BEING A LITTLE RISK THAT SHE COULD HAVE SOME HIGH-END RENTAL COME IN ON WILLY-NILLY AND A SINGLE-FAMILY NEIGHBORHOOD THAT YOU'D BE FORCED TO MAX IT OUT IF YOU'RE GOING TO DO IT AS A HIGH-END RENTAL.

I CAN IMAGINE WITH HIGHER INTEREST RATES ON MORTGAGE THAT THAT BEING LESS ATTRACTIVE AND HIGH RENTAL RATES MAKING THAT MORE ATTRACTIVE THAT SHE COULD GET SOME MERCHANT BUILDERS TRYING TO TARGET HIGH-END RENTING IN SINGLE-FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

THOSE PROJECTS, AS AN ARCHITECT I COULD TELL YOU, WON'T LOOK PROBABLY LIKE YOUR SINGLE-FAMILY HOUSES, AND THAT WOULD BE ONE OF MY UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCE FEARS WHEN IT'S SO BROADLY PUT OUT THERE IN ANY SINGLE-FAMILY AREAS.

THAT'S THE ONE THING I'M STRUGGLING WITH.

I THINK 95 PERCENT OF THE THINGS NOBODY WOULD THINK ANYTHING OF IT WOULD BE NON ISSUE.

IT'D BE FINE. IT'D BE GOOD.

>> I'VE GONE AROUND AND PHOTOGRAPHED A LOT OF NEW HOUSES IN DECATUR.

A LOT IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD. I LIVE IN THE GREAT LAKES.

A LOT OF IN OAKERS TO LOOK AT WHAT COULD BE DIFFERENT IF THIS WERE A MULTI-UNIT VERSUS A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME.

MOST OF THE DESIGNS HONESTLY, YOU CAN IMAGINE PRETTY EASILY, AS A DUPLEX OR A QUADPLEX BECAUSE A LOT OF THEM ARE SQUARE.

THEY MIGHT LOOK LIKE AN OLD CRAFTSMEN OR IT LOOKS A LOT OF THEM ARE MORE MODERN RIGHT NOW.

[04:50:01]

NOW, THE AFFORDABILITY, YOU HAVE THE SAME SITUATION.

WE'RE AT A CRUX RIGHT NOW IN DECATUR WHERE YOU CAN HAVE THEM AS THESE $1.5 MILLION HOMES, OR YOU CAN HAVE THEM BROKEN UP INTO SMALLER UNITS.

THAT'S THE WHOLE CRUX OF THE PROBLEM IS THAT THERE IS A LOT OF FEAR AROUND THIS.

BUT ULTIMATELY, WHERE DOES THE TRAJECTORY GO? DO WE TRY TO HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR SMALLER UNITS? IT DOESN'T MEAN PEOPLE HAVE TO TAKE THAT OPPORTUNITY.

THEY CAN STILL BUILD A NEW SINGLE-FAMILY HOME.

THE MARKET WOULD DETERMINE THAT.

DO WE TRY TO MIX IN THE AFFORDABLE UNITS? THAT'S WHAT MY WHOLE JOB IS RIGHT NOW [LAUGHTER], IS TO PUT IN PLACE THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TASK FORCE, INCLUDING THE LAND TRUST, WHICH IS SUCH AN IMPORTANT VEHICLE FOR PERMANENT HOME OWNERSHIP OR CONTROLLED RENT FOR 99 YEARS RENEWING FOR ANOTHER 99 YEARS.

THAT'S WHY THIS POLICY MAKES SENSE TO ME BECAUSE IT DOES THE MARKET RATE THAT IS UNSUBSIDIZED BUT GIVING MORE OPTIONS AND IT DOES THE AFFORDABILITY RATE THAT IS SUBSIDIZED THROUGH THE LAND TRUST CREATING PERMANENTLY AFFORDABILITY, BUT A REALLY GOOD USE OF FUNDS BECAUSE IT DOES NOT GO BACK ON THE MARKET.

>> ANYONE ELSE?

>> I JUST WANT TO COMPLIMENT YOU ON ALL OF YOUR PUBLIC OUTREACH.

IT HAS BEEN EXTENSIVE AND VERY INFORMATIVE.

>> THANK YOU. I JUST WANT TO POINT OUT TO HAVE BEEN OUT TO SOME NEIGHBORHOODS AND THINGS LIKE THAT AND I AM STILL MORE THAN WILLING TO DO THAT.

I KNOW THAT PEOPLE DON'T TUNE IN, CAN'T TUNE IN, ARE BUSY.

I'VE TRIED REALLY HARD TO REACH PEOPLE WITH POSTCARDS AND FORUMS AND VISITS AT THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD, ANYWAY THAT I CAN, BUT I'M STILL WILLING TO DO THAT AS THIS MOVES FORWARD AND TRY TO MAKE THIS RIGHT FOR OUR COMMUNITY.

I THINK WE HEARD SOME GREAT COMMENTS TONIGHT.

I'M REALLY VESTED IN AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I WANT AFFORDABLE HOUSING TO WORK HERE.

I THINK THAT IT CAN, AND I THINK WE HAVE VERY LIMITED OPTIONS TO MAKE THIS WORK AND THAT'S WHY THIS IS A REALLY IMPORTANT ONE.

BUT I WANT TO MAKE IT RIGHT. I CAN GO OUT AND TALK TO PEOPLE AS NEEDED OR WHATEVER OTHER OUTREACH IS NEEDED ON MY PART.

>> WELL, AND TO PIGGYBACK ON THAT.

I HAD ALL THESE NOTES AND I'VE GOT LITERALLY 26 ITEMS THAT SO MANY PEOPLE BROUGHT UP THAT I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE I KNOW THAT I'M IN FAVOR OF SOME FORM OF THIS.

THE QUESTION IS, IS THIS THE RIGHT FORM? THERE'S SO MANY DIFFERENT IDEAS, COMMENTS, AND QUESTIONS THAT WERE VERY VALID.

I CAN TELL YOU THERE WERE QUITE A FEW I HADN'T THOUGHT OF THAT SOME OF THE INDIVIDUALS THAT CAME UP AND SPOKE WERE VERY VALID AND AGAIN, THE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCE COULD KICK US ALL IN THE HIND IN.

TO YOUR POINT, WE WANT TO DO THIS AND WE WANT TO DO IT RIGHT.

THE QUESTION IS, WHAT IS THE NEXT STEP? WHAT DOES THAT MEAN FOR TONIGHT?

>> WE'LL BE TALKING ABOUT THAT AFTER.

>> RIGHT.

>> I GUESS NOBODY ELSE HAS ANY QUESTIONS BEFORE WE GO INTO OUR INTERNAL DISCUSSION.

THANK YOU SO MUCH.

>> THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.

WHERE DO WE GO NEXT?

>> WE GET TO CLOSE THE POLL.

>> WELL, [LAUGHTER] SINCE THERE WERE NO MORE QUESTIONS FOR CHRIS AND I WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC COMMENT AND OPEN COMMISSION DISCUSSION AMONGST OURSELVES.

WHAT I WAS ABOUT TO SAY IS THAT WHILE THIS CURRENT EFFORT HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR FOUR YEARS, THE CITY OF DECATUR HAS BEEN STRUGGLING AND HAND-WRINGING OVER WHAT TO DO ON [NOISE] AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR AT LEAST 14 YEARS.

I THINK WE'VE COME TO AN INFLECTION POINT BECAUSE WHILE WE HAVE BEEN FIDDLING WITH THIS PROBLEM, ALL OF OUR AFFORDABLE HOUSING HAS GONE UP IN FLAMES.

THESE ARE NATURALLY OCCURRING AFFORDABLE HOUSING ANYWAY, THE DUPLEXES HAVE BEEN RIPPED OUT.

THE QUADRUPLEXES HAS BEEN RIPPED OUT.

IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD, I HAD TWO DUPLEXES, ONE DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET FROM ME AND ONE, TWO DOORS DOWN FROM ME.

THE ONE ACROSS THE STREET GOT TORN DOWN A LONG TIME AGO AND WAS REPLACED WITH A SINGLE-FAMILY HOUSE AT THE TOP OF THE MARKET.

THE ONE, TWO DOORS DOWN WAS RIPPED OUT AND THEN ADDING INSULT TO INJURY, THEY CUT THE LOT IN TWO, TORE DOWN THE DUPLEX, AND BUILT TWO MORE HOUSES AT THE TOP OF THE MARKET, ONE OF WHICH WE HAVE BEEN CALLING THE BIG GREEN MONSTER EVER SINCE IT WENT IN.

AT [NOISE] THIS POINT AND I THINK IT'S REALLY TIME TO DO SOMETHING OR DON'T, THE TIME FOR TRIAL IS OVER.

[04:55:03]

EITHER WE ARE A COMMUNITY THAT WANTS TO BE INCLUSIVE AND HAVE A DIVERSE RANGE OF PEOPLE.

WHEN PEOPLE SAY DIVERSITY, THEY ALWAYS WANT TO REDUCE THAT, JUST ERASE BUT I'VE SEEN OLD PEOPLE FORCED OUT OF MY NEIGHBORHOOD.

I HAVE SEEN PEOPLE WHO HAVE LOWER SOCIOECONOMIC LEVELS PUSHED OUT OF MY NEIGHBORHOOD AND EITHER, THAT'S NOT OKAY.

IN WHICH CASE WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING AND WE NEED TO DO IT SOONER RATHER THAN LATER OR WE NEED TO DECIDE THAT THAT IS NOT WHAT WE BELIEVE AT ALL AND JUST LEAN INTO IT AND SAY, WE ARE A WEALTHY COMMUNITY THAT IS NOT OPEN TO EVERYBODY AND ONLY THE PRIVILEGED FEW GET TO LIVE HERE.

BUT WE CAN'T DO BOTH.

WE CAN'T KEEP SPOUTING THESE FEEL-GOOD SHIBBOLETHS AND CONTINUE TO DO NOTHING WHILE THE PROBLEM GETS WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE.

MY SUGGESTION OR MY THOUGHT IS THAT THIS ORDINANCE, THE WAY IT'S DRAFTED, MAY NOT BE PERFECT.

BUT IT IS THE CULMINATION OF YEARS AND YEARS, AND YEARS AND YEARS OF WORK.

I THINK THAT MY POSITION WOULD BE NOT TO MAKE THE PERFECT, THE ENEMY OF THE GOOD.

I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY THERE IS WORK TO DO ON THIS.

BUT IF WE DON'T DO THIS, WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO? IT'S GOING TO BE ANOTHER 10 YEARS BEFORE WE GET BACK HERE.

>> WELL, I DO FEEL THAT THERE WERE SIGNIFICANT COMMENTS MADE TONIGHT THAT SHOULD BE ADDRESSED AND MAYBE THERE'S A POLICY PAPER THAT GOES ALONG WITH THIS AND A COUPLE OF TWEAKS THAT ADDRESS SOME OF THE COMMENTS THAT WE MADE TONIGHT.

>> I AGREE, AND FOR EXAMPLE, I DON'T KNOW THAT I SUPPORT ADDING ADUS ON TOP OF MISSING MIDDLE.

I THINK THAT'S JUST TOO MUCH.

>> THAT WOULD MEAN FIVE UNITS ON A SINGLE FAMILY LOT.

>> CORRECT. THREE TO FIVE NOT TWO TO FOUR.

>> RIGHT.

>> WHAT'S THE TIMELINE EXTENSION IF YOU TABLE THIS? WELL, I DON'T THINK IT'S A FOUR-YEAR ADD.

I AGREE WITH THE HAIRLINE.

PERCENT AGREE WITH YOU THAT, WE'VE GOT TO, WE NEED TO, SAVE THE PUBLIC, I SWEAR.

WE'VE GOT A BLANK OR GET OFF THE POT AT SOME POINT WHEN IT COMES TO AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

BUT I ALSO, THERE WERE SOME REALLY GOOD VALID THINGS BROUGHT UP TODAY THAT I THINK COULD BE INCORPORATED WITHOUT ADDING YEARS AND TIME, MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF TIME THAT ARE FAIRLY IMPACTFUL.

ESPECIALLY LIKE THE OVERSIGHT COMPONENT.

THE LAURA, LIKE YOU SAID, ON A TRI OR A QUAD, ADDING IN THE SPECIAL USE.

[OVERLAPPING] THAT'S AN EASY THING TO ADD SO THAT THERE'S AN EXTRA LEVEL THAT COULD HELP TO ELIMINATE MORE THAN HALF OF WHAT'S ON MY LIST HERE.

>> I AGREE.

>> I DON'T THINK THAT'S A HUGE ASK.

>> LET ME ASK ANGELA A QUESTION AND THEN I'LL GET BACK TO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING BECAUSE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS VALID.

ANGELA, WOULD YOU DESCRIBE THE PROCESS THAT THIS IS GOING TO HAVE TO GO THROUGH FROM THIS POINT TO COMPLETION BECAUSE THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY HAS CHANGED THE ZONING PROCEDURES TO MAKE IT MUCH MORE CUMBERSOME TO DO ZONING? JUST IF YOU COULD SHARE THAT WITH US.

>> OF COURSE, THE CITY COMMISSION IS ASKING FOR YOU TO PROVIDE A RECOMMENDATION TONIGHT.

THIS IS BEING FORWARDED TO THE CITY COMMISSION AT THEIR MEETING ON MONDAY, OCTOBER 17TH.THAT IS ALSO A REQUIREMENT THAT IS WITHIN OUR UDL PRESENTLY WITHOUT EVEN THE CHANGES TO THE ZONING PROCEDURES LAW BUT IT SPECIFICALLY STATES FOR AMENDMENTS.

FOLLOWING THE PUBLIC HEARING, THE PLANNING COMMISSION SHALL MAKE A RECOMMENDATION ON EACH ZONING PROPOSAL, REVIEWED AND SUBMITTED ITS REPORT TO THE CITY COMMISSION PRIOR TO THE DATE OF THE PUBLIC HEARING ON WHICH THE ZONING PROPOSAL WILL BE HEARD BY THE CITY COMMISSION.

IF THE PLANNING COMMISSION FAILS TO SUBMIT A REPORT WITHIN SAID PERIOD, IT SHALL BE DEEMED [NOISE] TO HAVE MADE NO RECOMMENDATION REGARDING THE PROPOSED CHANGE.

COME MONDAY NIGHT, THAT IS GOING TO BE A SECOND PUBLIC HEARING THAT IS REQUIRED BY THE REWRITE OF THE ZONING PROCEDURES LAW THAT WAS DONE BY HOUSE BILL 1405,

[05:00:06]

THAT CHANGE THE ZONING PROCEDURES LAW SO THAT WHENEVER THERE IS A CHANGE TO SINGLE FAMILY ZONING, THERE HAS TO BE A MINIMUM OF TWO PUBLIC HEARINGS, WHICH IS TONIGHT AND MONDAY NIGHT.

THEN THERE'S A BIT OF TIME A MINIMUM OF THREE MONTHS, BEFORE IT GOES BACK TO THE CITY COMMISSION AND THEY HAVE TO TAKE TWO VOTES, AND THAT IS SCHEDULED FOR JANUARY 17TH, AND AGAIN ON FEBRUARY 6TH OF 2023.

THERE'S A PERIOD OF WHICH WE HAVE TIME TO CONSIDER ALL THE COMMENTS THAT WERE MADE TONIGHT, TRY TO ADDRESS THOSE CONCERNS.

AS MS. ALLEN POINTED OUT, SHE WILL CONTINUE TO WORK AND SPEAK WITH COMMUNITY MEMBERS WHO YOU WERE INTERESTED IN, AND IF POSSIBLE, WE'LL BE TAKING FURTHER DIRECTION FROM THE CITY COMMISSION ON MONDAY NIGHT.

[OVERLAPPING] BASICALLY, TO THE EXTENT THAT WE HAVE SOME UNREADINESS WITH WHERE THIS IS RIGHT NOW, I THINK THAT WE SEND AN ADVERSE RECOMMENDATION TO THE CITY COMMISSION RATHER THAN TRYING TO TABLE IT AND RECOMMEND THAT THEY DENY THAT.

>> IN ITS CURRENT FORM. YEAH, IT'S COOL.

>> IN ITS CURRENT FORM.

>> SO MAKE A MOTION TO DENY IT BASED ON ITS CURRENT FORMAT RATHER THAN TABLE.

>> CORRECT.

>> IF WE DO THAT, CAN WE ALSO LIST THE SPECIFIC CONCERNS?

>> ABSOLUTELY. I DON'T HAVE ANY COMMENT ON THAT ONE. [OVERLAPPING]

>> YEAH. I MEAN, CANDIDLY, I DON'T THINK I COULD VOTE FOR IT ITS CURRENT FORM.

>> THERE'S THREE ESSENTIALLY RECOMMENDATIONS THAT YOU COULD MAKE TONIGHT.

ONE IS APPROVE WITH CONDITIONS OR DENY.

IF YOU WANT TO MAKE SUGGESTIONS ON HOW TO IMPROVE AND TRY TO ADDRESS THE CONCERNS, THEN PERHAPS YOU CAN ADD CONDITIONS TO YOUR RECOMMENDATION.

[BACKGROUND]

>> YEAH.

>> ITS A COMPLICATED ADD GUYS.

>> I'M VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES AS WELL.

I UNDERSTAND THAT THE DECATUR LAND TRUST IS LOOKING FOR THESE OPTIONS SO THAT THEY CAN FULFILL THEIR MISSION AND MOVE FORWARD TO PROVIDING MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING BUT AT THE SAME TIME, IT OPENS IT UP TO ALL THE PRIVATE DEVELOPERS.

I THINK THEIR ACTIVITIES ARE GOING TO OUTPACE WHATEVER DEVELOPMENT THAT DECATUR LAND TRUST [NOISE] ABLE TO DO.

THEIR MARKET FORCES HAVE THE POTENTIAL TO MOVE IN THE NEGATIVE DIRECTION.

WE CAN'T CONTROL IT.

IT MAY MAKE THE LAND VALUES INDICATOR CONTINUE OR INCREASE IT IN EVEN HIGHER RATE, AND VERY LIKELY WILL INCREASE THE RATE OF TEAR DOWNS OF OUR DWINDLING OLDER HOUSING STOCK.

>> I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH DOING IT THAT WAY, WITH RECOMMENDING DENIAL AND THEN LISTING THE CONCERNS THAT LED TO THE RECOMMENDATION, OR DOING IT WITH CONDITIONS IF THAT'S THE WAY WE WANT TO TRY TO DO IT TOO.

BUT, I'M A LITTLE CONCERNED ABOUT SPIT-BALLING SOMETHING IN THE MOMENT.

>> TABLING IS REALLY NOT AN OPTION BECAUSE OF [OVERLAPPING].

>>OKAY.

>> EVERYBODY HAS A MOTION.

WE'RE MERELY MAKING A RECOMMENDATION.

WE CAN RECOMMEND DENIAL AND LIST ALL OF THE DEFICIENCIES THAT WE SEE FOR THE CITY COMMISSION TO WORK ON, OR WE CAN RECOMMEND APPROVAL WITH CONDITIONS WHICH I WOULD NOT PERSONALLY BE COMFORTABLE WITH.

>> CONDITIONS ARE TOO COMPLICATED. [OVERLAPPING]

>> EXACTLY.

>> YOU'VE GOT THINGS LIKE THE OVERSIGHT, THE PARKING, THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL, THE SQUARE FOOTAGE MINIMUMS. I THINK ANGELA ADDRESSED THAT ONE, HONESTLY.

>> I'D LIKE TO MOVE THAT WE DENY THE APPLICATION FOR PROPOSED TEXT AMENDMENTS TO ARTICLES 2, 3, 6, 7, AND 12 OF THE ADU WITH THE COMMENTS THAT WE PREFER A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT PROCESS BE IN

[05:05:01]

PLACE FOR TRIFLEX AND QUADFLEX.

THAT ADUS NOT BE PERMITTED FOR TRIPLEX AND QUADFLEX.

>> ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ABOUT THE DEFINITION.

I WAS GOING TO SAY ADDITIONAL DEFINITION ABOUT PARKING SHOULD BE STUDIED.

>> ADDITIONAL DEFINITION OF PARKING STANDARDS?

>> YEAH.

>> THEY SUBMITTED ADDITIONAL DEFINITIONS OF DESIGN BE INCLUDED IN TOWNHOUSE POSSIBILITIES.

>> THIS IS WHY IT GETS VERY CONVOLUTED.

>> IT'S THERE TO PREVENT OR?

>> I'M NOT REALLY SAYING PREVENT BUT JUST TO CLARIFY.

>> I WOULD SAY MAYBE IT WOULD BE BETTER TO HAVE PERHAPS A MOTION THAT SIMPLY RECOMMENDS DENIAL WITH A SERIES OF LISTED CONCERNS, EXHIBIT A.

THERE'S JUST SO MUCH COMPLEXITY. [OVERLAPPING]

>> CAN WE DO THAT THEN?

>> IT'S TRUE.

>> BUT DO WE HAVE TO SAY IT ALL OUT LOUD?

>> YOU CAN BASE IT ON THE COMMENTS, GO AHEAD.

>> I THINK THAT WHATEVER WE SEND UP, WE HAVE TO DO IN THIS FORUM.

>> IT'S WHAT I THOUGHT.

>> WE CAN MAKE A STRAIGHT MOTION TO RECOMMEND DENIAL, AND SAY BASED ON THE COMMENTS THAT WE RECEIVED, AND LAURA, YOU CAN SPECIFY YOUR SPECIFIC ONES, BUT I THINK THAT THAT SHOULD COME AFTER THE VOTE.

>> AFTER THE VOTE, OR JUST AS A PART OF THE MOTION THAT ADDITIONAL CONSIDERATION IS BEING GIVEN TO THE COMMENTS SUBMITTED THIS EVENING?

>> I'D SAY AFTER THE VOTE BECAUSE DENIAL WITH THE LIST ATTACHED IN THE MOTION IS LIKE PLEADING GUILTY WITH AN EXPLANATION.

ONCE YOU PLEAD GUILTY, IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER WHY.

>> [LAUGHTER] YOU'RE A LAWYER.

>> JUST MAKE A MOTION TO DENY? I MOVE THAT WE DENY THE APPLICATION BEFORE US FOR THE PROPOSED TEXT AMENDMENTS TO ARTICLES 2, 3, 6, 7, AND 12 OF THE ADU.

>> DO WE HAVE A SECOND.

>> I SECOND THAT.

>> IT HAS BEEN PROPERLY MOVED AND SECONDED TO RECOMMEND THE DENIAL OF THIS TEXT AMENDMENT TO THE CITY COMMISSION.

IS THERE ANYONE WHO HAS ANY QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS ABOUT THE MOTION? EVERYONE IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE.

>> AYE.

>> NOW THAT WE HAVE PASSED THE MOTION.

LAURA, IF YOU WANT TO.

>> WHAT AM I DOING NOW?

>> YOU'RE GIVEN THE REASONING FOR THE MOTION.

THIS IS WHY WE MADE THE RECOMMENDATION.

>> WELL, THE REASON I MADE THE MOTION TO DENY IS THAT WE HAVE DISCUSSED THAT A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT PROCESS SHOULD BE IN PLACE FOR TRIFLEX AND QUADFLEX, THAT ADUS NOT BE PERMITTED FOR TRIPLEX AND QUADFLEX?

>> OR WOULD THAT BE DIFFERENT IF THERE WAS AN EXISTING ONE ALREADY? [OVERLAPPING]

>> WELL, JUST LET HER GET PREFERRED.

>> THAT THERE'LL BE ADDITIONAL DEFINITIONS ON STREET PARKING, THAT THERE'LL BE ADDITIONAL DEFINITIONS FOR THE DESIGN OF HORIZONTALLY ORIENTED HOUSING AND ADDITIONAL CONSIDERATIONS BE MADE FOR A COMPANION POLICY PAPER.

>> GO AHEAD, GREG.

>> WHAT ABOUT THE CONCERN THAT SOME OF THE COMMENTERS HAD ABOUT SHORT-TERM RENTALS AND LACK OF CONTROL OVER THEM?

>> SHORT-TERM RENTALS IS A CONCERN OF MINE AND NOT JUST THE TRADITIONAL AIRBNB.

IN MY PROFESSIONAL CAPACITY, WHAT I'M STARTING TO SEE ARE COMPANIES THAT TRIED TO GET AROUND PROHIBITIONS AGAINST SHORT-TERM RENTAL BY SAYING,

[05:10:01]

WE'RE NOT RENTING UNITS, WE'RE SELLING MEMBERSHIPS IN OUR BUSINESS.

THE SOLE BENEFIT FOR BEING A MEMBER IS YOU JUST HAPPEN TO GET TO LIVE IN THIS UNIT, AND YOU'RE PAYING US DUES AND NOT RENTS. THAT'S THE LATEST [OVERLAPPING] THING ABOUT IT.

>> WE'LL ADD THAT TO THE LIST THAT THOSE SHORT-TERM RENTALS NOT BE ALLOWED IN THE MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING?

>> OKAY. ANYBODY ELSE HAVE ANYTHING.

>> ANYONE ELSE TO TAKE ON THERE?

>> THIS IS WHAT WE COULDN'T DO IN THE MOTION BECAUSE IT'S HARD TO.

>> I MIGHT ADD CONSIDERATION OF TREATMENTS VERSUS TEAR DOWNS VERSUS RENOVATIONS I MEAN THERE YOU MAY HAVE A.

>> COULD WE ROLL THAT INTO PRESERVATION OF NEIGHBORHOOD CHARACTER OR SOME WORDING.

>> YEAH THE COMMENT THAT WE DO NOT WANT TO INCENTIVIZE TEAR DOWNS.

>> WELL AND I WOULD ADD TO THAT LIST BY SAYING THAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME PROVISION MADE WHERE IF SOMEONE WANTS TO TEAR DOWN MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING THAT THEY BE REQUIRED TO GET A USE PERMIT AND GO BEFORE THE FIRING SQUAD AND JUSTIFY WHY THEY'RE DOING THAT SINCE WE DON'T WANT NATURALLY OCCURRING MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING TO DISAPPEAR.

>> IS THAT ONLY ON BEHALF OF SOMEBODY WANTS TO DO A DUPLEX, TRIPLEX, OR QUADPLEX.

WHAT IF THEY WANTED TO JUST DO A REGULAR HOUSE?

>> THAT'S THE PROBLEM.

>> YEAH.

>> THAT'S THE PROBLEM.

>> YOU WANT TO PUT A COMMENT IN HERE ABOUT A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT TO TURN DOWN [OVERLAPPING].

>> FOR A MISSING MIDDLE DEMOLITION.

>> WHAT DEFINES A MISSING DEMOLITION?

>> THEY BOUGHT THE HOUSING THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IN THIS FOR POTENTIAL CODE.

>> IT FEELS [LAUGHTER] OFF.

>> I THINK WE'RE GETTING A LITTLE OFF TOPIC THERE.

>> I DON'T THINK SO BECAUSE WHAT WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IN PART IS THE DISAPPEARING MISSING MIDDLE AND THAT'S A BIG PROBLEM.

>> BUT THIS IS SPECIFIC TO A DUPLEX, TRIPLEX, OR QUADPLEX AND NOT STANDARD SINGLE-FAMILY.

I'M NOT ARGUING THE POINT.

>> I'M NOT SAYING DEVALUES SOMEBODY'S WHO ALREADY IN MY MIND ON ANY HARM FOR SINGLE-FAMILY.

>> RIGHT.

>> IF YOU KEEP DOING WHAT YOU'VE ALWAYS DONE YOU'RE GOING TO KEEP GETTING WHAT YOU'VE ALWAYS GOTTEN.

>> IT'S YOUR COMMENT TO MAKE. [LAUGHTER]

>> I THINK WHAT MIKE'S SAYING IS CAN YOU SINGLE OUT THAT TYPE OF HOUSING STOCK AND PUT SPECIAL CONDITION THAT [OVERLAPPING].

>> YOU'RE CREATING A VERY SLIPPERY SLOPE BY ADDING THAT COMMENT IN THERE.

>> OKAY. I STILL MAKE THE COMMENT.

>> THAT'S FINE.

>> THAT THE POWERS THAT WE CAN DO WITH IT AND WE WILL IT IS A COMMENT THAT THE COMMISSIONER IT'S THERE I UNDERSTAND.

[LAUGHTER]

>> THE ONE SUBMITTING THE COMMENT.

>> WE HAVE.

>> OKAY. NEXT ITEM FORWARD.

>> WE HAVE A COMMON SLATE HERE.

>> WE HAD TALKED ABOUT TAKING A BREAK [OVERLAPPING].

>> BUT I THINK WE NEED TO POWER THROUGH THIS JUST TOO LATE.

>> GET IT.

>> THE NEXT ITEM IS TALIA AND JOE BUNTING,

[III.B. Talia and Joe Bunting have requested a conditional use permit to allow an 8-bedroom lodging house to function as a boutique inn within a R-60 zoning district for the property located at 620 Pinetree Drive.]

THEY'VE REQUESTED A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT TO ALLOW AN EIGHT BEDROOM LODGING HOUSE TO FUNCTION AS A BOUTIQUE IN WITHIN OUR 60 ZONING DISTRICT FOR THE PROPERTY LOCATED AT 620 PINETREE DRIVE.

IS THERE ANYONE HERE TO PRESENT THIS APPLICATION?

>> THAT IS ME AND I WILL ONLY TALK FOR 45 MINUTES SO IT'S OKAY.

[LAUGHTER] MY NAME IS TALIA BUNTING AND I LIVE AT 813 WEST PONCE DE LEON WHICH IS 13 HOUSES UP 620 PINETREE DRIVE AND WE ARE SEEKING A RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A LODGING HOUSE AT 620 PINETREE DRIVE.

I GUESS YOU GUYS CAN'T SEE THE PRETTY SLIDESHOW PUT TOGETHER BUT.

>> YEAH, WE CAN SEE IT.

>> OH, YOU CAN. OH, PERFECT, SO FANCY LOVE IT.

>> WHEN WE'RE LOOKING DOWN THIS WAY WE ARE NOT ACTUALLY IGNORING YOU.

>> OKAY. THAT'S YOU'RE NOT IGNORING ME I APPRECIATE IT.

>> WE ACTUALLY LOOKING AT THIS.

>> OKAY. SO SHE IS PULLING IT UP BUT ONE I'LL START BY SHARING A LITTLE BIT ABOUT MYSELF AND YOU JUST GO STRAIGHT TO SLIDE THREE ONCE YOU GET UP THERE, IT'S GOING TO BE THE QUEEN BEE IN AND MY FAMILY SLIDE THREE I WANT TO SHARE A LITTLE BIT ABOUT US FIRST.

THAT'S MY HUSBAND AND I AND OUR THREE CHILDREN, MARSTON, REMI, AND SHAUNA AND MY HUSBAND JOE AND THAT WAS THE DAY WE MOVED TO DECATUR.

MY SON MARSTON HE'S AT 4TH GRADE AND REMI IS AT 2ND GRADE AT WESTCHESTER AND WE DEEPLY CARE ABOUT THE CITY OF DECATUR.

WE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT A SPECIAL PLACE THIS WAS UNTIL WE MOVED HERE AND JUST FALLEN IN LOVE WITH THE COMMUNITY AND DEEPLY CARE ABOUT BETTERING THIS COMMUNITY AND CONTINUING TO IMPROVE

[05:15:04]

AT THE LEVEL THAT WE ARE ABLE TO AND HOW WE'VE BEEN BEST EQUIPPED TO DO THAT.

JOE AND I BOTH HAVE A DEEP LOVE FOR HOSPITALITY AND CREATING SPACES WHERE PEOPLE CAN FEEL WELCOME AND AT HOME AND ESPECIALLY IN A COMMUNITY THAT WE'RE DEEPLY INVESTED IN AND YOU CAN GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE.

WE'RE BOTH SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS HERE IN THE CITY OF DECATUR.

JOE IS A WRITER AND RUNS AN ONLINE BLOG WHICH IS ACTUALLY VERY MUCH IMPORTANT BUSINESS BUT TO THE WIFE IT'S JUST A BLOG AND I'M AN EXPERIENCED PROPERTY MANAGER.

MY COMPANY RUNS OVER 19 SHORT-TERM RENTAL PROPERTIES.

WE HAVE CREATED 15 JOBS AND WE HOST 7,500 GUESTS A YEAR IN HERE IN METRO ATLANTA.

WE STARTED DREAMING.

WE FIRST MOVED TO THE ATLANTA AND METRO ATLANTA AREA SEVEN YEARS AGO AND STARTED DREAMING ABOUT WHAT WOULD IT BE LIKE TO HAVE A PLACE WHERE OUR IN-LAWS, MY HUSBAND'S PARENTS COULD COME VISIT AND STAY, AND EVERY TIME THEY WOULD COME TO TOWN THEY WOULD HAVE TO STAY IN DOWNTOWN ATLANTA THERE WASN'T ANYWHERE ELSE FOR THEM TO STAY.

IT WAS US DRIVING BACK AND FORTH WITH THEM WE'RE A ONE CAR FAMILY AND IT DIDN'T FEEL WELCOMING, IT DIDN'T FEEL HOSPITABLE AND THERE WASN'T A GREAT WAY FOR THEM TO REALLY WAKE UP AND ENJOY THEIR GRANDKIDS IN THE MORNINGS.

WE LIVED IN A SMALL HOUSE AT THE TIME AND SO THAT'S WHEN WE STARTED DREAMING ABOUT A NEIGHBORHOOD IN IT WOULD BE SMALL, BOUTIQUE AND IT WOULD SERVE THE NEEDS OF A COMMUNITY RATHER THAN A BIG CORPORATE FIELD OF A HOTEL AND IT'S SOMETHING I THINK THAT THE CITY OF DECATUR CARES ABOUT AS WELL.

THERE ARE TO 20, 30 MASTER PLAN CALLS FOR ATTRACTING A BOUTIQUE HOTEL OR BED AND BREAKFAST AND WE'RE HOPING TO BE THE BED AND BREAKFAST, 620 PINETREE IS IDEALLY SUITED FOR THAT LEVEL OF SERVICE.

JUST TO GIVE YOU A COUPLE OF SENSE OF WHAT WE'VE BEEN DOING SO FAR.

WE HAVE A SHORT-TERM RENTAL ON OUR PROPERTY, WE HAVE HAD AMAZING REVIEWS.

PEOPLE LOVE STAYING THERE, THEY TALK ALL ABOUT THE WALKABILITY OF DECATUR AND I WILL SAY I JUST SHARED A COUPLE OF REVIEWS YOU CAN JUST FLIP THROUGH THEM I WON'T READ THEM ALL OUT.

BUT ALWAYS A GOOD EXPERIENCE.

THEY LOVE WALKING DOWNTOWN, WE HAVE A 4.96 AVERAGE OUT OF FIVE AND IT'S BEEN A GREAT WAY TO BE ABLE TO SHARE THE CITY THAT I LOVE OUT-OF-TOWN OWNERS AND PEOPLE I CARE ABOUT AND ALSO MANY OF OUR NEIGHBORS WE OFTEN HOST NEIGHBORS.

I'M HOSTING A WOMAN FROM PARKWAY HER PARENTS ARE FROM UKRAINE THEY'RE COMING IN NOVEMBER FOR TWO WEEKS AND THEY'RE STAYING AT MY PLACE AND IT WAS THE ONLY PLACE AVAILABLE AND IT'S CLOSE TO THEM AND IT'S REALLY SPECIAL BEING ABLE TO DO THAT AND SO WE HOPE TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT AT THE QUEEN BEE AS WELL WHICH AGAIN WILL REITERATE IS ONLY 13 HOUSES DOWN FROM MY HOUSE.

SUITABILITY IT IS SURROUNDED BY SIMILARLY SCALED PROPERTIES.

YOU HAVE FIRST CHRISTIAN CHURCH AND ST. THOMAS MORE WHICH IS ACROSS THE STREET FROM IT.

IT'S THE HOUSE WITH THE LIONS AND THE BIG PALM TREES.

THOSE ARE BOTH INSTITUTIONALLY ZONED.

THE POST OFFICE IS CLOSE AS WELL AND THAT'S OBVIOUSLY PUBLICLY ZONE PUBLIC SPACE.

THEN YOU HAVE HAMPTON COURT WHICH HAS 16 UNITS IN JUST OVER AN ACRE OF LAND AREA AND THE PINETREE SITS ON ABOUT A HALF AN ACRE.

WE'RE ONLY GOING TO HAVE EIGHT GUEST BEDROOMS AND WE WOULD HOST 16 GUESTS MAX IN THAT SPACE AND THE CITY ORDINANCE SECTION 6.57 DOES ALLOW FOR A LODGING HOUSE WITH A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT OF UP TO EIGHT GUEST BEDROOMS.

>> ADVERSE EFFECTS. I'VE SPENT A LOT OF TIME TALKING WITH AS MANY NEIGHBORS AS I COULD GET MY HANDS ON.

IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO ME THAT I'M A GOOD PARTNER TO THE CITY AND A GOOD PARTNER TO OUR NEIGHBORS IN THIS PROCESS.

THERE WAS THREE OR FOUR DIFFERENT THINGS THAT THEY BROUGHT UP.

THE MAIN THING IS TRASH, TRAFFIC, AND PARKING WHICH AFTER THE LAST FEW HOURS I CAN DEFINITELY SEE THAT PARKING IS A BIG CONCERN FOR EVERYBODY.

THE PROPOSED END IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE EXISTING SPACES ADJACENT NEARBY TO THE PROPERTY.

I DON'T FORESEE RESIDENTS OF THESE PROPERTIES OR USERS OF THESE PROPERTIES TO BE ADVERSELY AFFECTED.

[05:20:01]

THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO CONTINUE USING THEIR SPACES UNHINDERED.

IF YOU GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE, ST. THOMAS MORE HAS 489 STUDENTS, NOT INCLUDING PARISHIONERS ON SUNDAY.

HAMPTON COURT HAS 16 UNITS, AND FIRST CHRISTIAN CHURCH HAS 100 ATTENDEES ON SUNDAYS.

WE'RE GOING TO HAVE 16 GAS MAX, EIGHT CARS MAX.

ONE OF THE THINGS ALSO THAT IS WONDERFUL [NOISE] IS THAT IT'S CENTRALLY LOCATED, WHICH ALLOWS FOR TRANSPORTATION.

NINETY PERCENT OF MY GUESTS THAT STAY AT MY SHORT-TERM RENTAL WALK TO TOWN.

THEY CHOOSE MY PLACE BECAUSE IT IS WALKING DISTANCE.

THEY'D LEAVE THEIR CARS, I WATCH THEM WALK DOWN MY DRIVEWAY EVERY SINGLE DAY.

MR. MOE, WHO HAS LEFT, HE'S MY NEXT-DOOR NEIGHBOR, HE CAN ATTEST TO THAT AS WELL.

THEY LOVE THE WALKABILITY, AND THAT WOULD BE OUR GOAL TOO IS TO REALLY ENCOURAGE PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION, TO ENCOURAGE RIDE SHARES TAXIS, AND WALKABILITY OR WALKING.

IN ADDITION, THAT IN IS RIGHT ON WEST PONCE, WHICH IS A HIGH-CAPACITY ROAD, AND PINETREE JUMPS RIGHT UP TO SCOTT BOULEVARD.

BOTH HIGH-CAPACITY ROADS, WE DON'T ANTICIPATE THAT THE QUEEN BE IN WILL CONTRIBUTE TO CONGESTION.

WE THINK PEOPLE WILL WALK OR DRIVE, I GET A LOT OF MEDICAL TOURISM AS WELL.

PEOPLE VISITING EMORY FOR TREATMENT SO THEY'D BE DRIVING TO THAT AS WELL.

HERE IS THE PROPOSED PARKING THAT WE'VE BEEN WORKING WITH STUDIO WIFE ON, THE CITY CALLS FOR ONE PARKING SPOT FOR EVERY TWO GUESTS ROOMS. WE'VE DEVELOPED A PLAN FOR ABOUT FIVE PARKING SPOTS, AS WELL AS AN ADA-ACCESSIBLE SPOT.

AGAIN, I'M TRYING TO THINK MIDNIGHT IS NOT MY BEST TIME FOR TALKING, SO I APOLOGIZE.

ALSO, EVERYBODY DOESN'T BRING A CAR.

SO I DON'T ANTICIPATE THIS BEING A PROBLEM.

I'VE BEEN THINKING THROUGH ALTERNATIVE OPTIONS AS WELL.

AGAIN, LIKE I'VE TOLD THE NEIGHBORS, I WANT TO BE A GOOD NEIGHBOR.

I WANT TO BE A GOOD PARTNER.

MY GOAL IS AT THE END OF THIS PROJECT, ONCE WE LAUNCHED THOSE NEIGHBORS ON THAT STREET AND IN HAMPTON COURT SAY, "OH MY GOSH, I WILL BUY A HOUSE, BUY ITALIAN BUSINESS EVERY SINGLE TIME." SHE WAS A DREAM. I'M STILL THINKING THROUGH THAT.

BUT EVEN WITHOUT DOING ANYTHING ADDITIONAL, I THINK THAT THIS IS MORE THAN ENOUGH TO MEET DEMAND.

IN TERMS OF TRASH, WHICH IS THE NEXT SLIDE WE'LL HAVE AN ENCLOSURE THERE IN THE BACK FOR THE TRASH BINS.

I THINK ONE THING THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER, WELL, TWO THINGS, AND IF YOU COULD GO BACK TO THE OTHER SLIDE REAL QUICK, ALSO WHERE YOU SEE THE ROUNDABOUT.

IT'S NOT A ROUNDABOUT, IT'S A CIRCULAR THING.

WE'RE GOING TO PLANT TREES THERE TOO, AND SHRUBBERY TO HIDE THE CARS.

I KNOW THAT LOOKING INTO A PARKING LOT IS NOT FUN FOR ANYBODY.

MY FRIEND LIVES ACROSS THE STREET, AND SO I'VE TOLD HER WE'LL PLANT TREES THERE.

ANYWAYS BACK TO THE OTHER ONE, TRASH THERE IT HAS TO BE PRETTY THIS IS GOING TO BE AN UPSCALE BED AND BREAKFAST AND NOBODY WANTS TO GO AND STAY AT A PLACE WHERE THERE'S TRASH LYING ABOUT AND NOT A GOOD TRASH SYSTEM.

WE'RE GOING TO MAKE SURE WE DO IT WITH EXCELLENCE AND WE'RE GOING DO IT RIGHT.

THE NEXT COUPLE OF PAGES ARE JUST SOME IMAGES THAT SERVE AS INSPIRATION FOR THE FIELD AND THE VIBE.

I WANT TO CREATE A SPACE THAT WILL ADD TO THE VALUE OF THE CITY OF DAKOTA.

SOMETHING THAT CITY OF DAKOTA CAN BE PROUD OF.

IF YOU GO BACK TO THE OTHER ONE WAS A BED AND BREAKFAST WE STAYED AT IN RHODE ISLAND.

IT'S HOMEY AND IT'S WELCOMING AND IF YOU GO TO THE NEXT ONE, THIS WE'VE BEEN WORKING WITH OUR ARCHITECT, AND ONE OF THE IDEAS HE HAS IS TO CREATE THIS MASSIVE SHAFT OF LIGHT GOING UP TO THE CEILING WITH A SKYLIGHT.

[NOISE] IT'S REALLY BEAUTIFUL.

WE'LL HAVE LOTS OF SKYLIGHTS, LOTS OF NATURAL LIGHT.

I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT PEOPLE WILL REALLY WANT TO BE A PART OF.

NICE FINISHES, THERE'S AN EXAMPLE OF THE SKYLIGHT.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN SEE IT. NICE FINISHES, GOOD WOODWORKING.

ALL OF IT WILL DO TO PRESERVE THE CHARACTER OF CRAFTSMAN HOMES IN DAKOTA.

THAT'S JUST ANOTHER PRETTY PICTURE.

THAT'S THE QUEEN BEE IN.

I WANT TO REITERATE AGAIN THAT WE'RE REALLY COMMITTED TO DOING THIS WELL, WE CARE ABOUT THIS CITY.

I WANT TO CONTINUE TO INTERACT WITH THE NEIGHBORS WELL, IN A WAY THAT THEY CAN FEEL LIKE THEY'RE A PART OF THIS AND THAT IT SERVES THEIR COMMUNITY AS WELL.

QUESTIONS FROM YOU ALL.

>> I HAVE ONE QUESTION.

>> YES, SIR.

>> WHICH IS, IN TERMS OF EMPLOYEES,

[05:25:02]

HOW MANY EMPLOYEES WILL BE ON THE SITE AT ANY GIVEN TIME WHEN YOU'RE UP AND RUNNING?

>> THE INNKEEPER WILL BE THERE AT ALL TIMES.

THEY CAN GO TO THE GROCERY STORE, BUT THE INNKEEPER, ACCORDING TO THE CITY ORDINANCE, IS REQUIRED TO LIVE ON-SITE.

THEY CAN'T LEAVE FOR VACATION.

THAT WOULD BE EITHER A COUPLE OR A SINGLE PERSON WOULD BE THERE AT ALL TIMES.

THEN WE'LL HAVE 3-4 EMPLOYEES FOR CLEANING STAFF AT DIFFERENT TIMES THROUGH THE DAY.

TYPICAL CLEANING TIMES ARE 10 AM - 3 PM.

THERE WOULD BE A COUPLE OF STAFF THEN AND THEN THERE'S GOING BE FEWER IN THE EVENINGS JUST BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT NEEDED THEN. DOES THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION?

>> YES. THANK YOU.

>> IF YOU HAVE AN INNKEEPER AND CLEANERS, HOW DOES THAT IMPACT THE PARKING?

>> THE INNKEEPER WOULD EITHER HAVE NO CAR.

WE'RE GOING TO CHARGE FOR PARKING.

THAT IS ONE OTHER THING I FORGOT TO MENTION, TO ENCOURAGE PEOPLE USING PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION AND UBER OR LYFT OR WHATEVER RIDESHARE THING.

WE WOULD REQUIRE THAT THE CLEANERS AND THE OTHER STAFF WOULD HAVE TO TAKE PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION IN OR GET DROPPED OFF.

TECHNICALLY THERE ARE SIX SPOTS AND ONLY FOUR ARE REQUIRED.

ONE OF THOSE COULD BE USED FOR THE INNKEEPER IF THEY DO HAVE A CAR. [NOISE]

>> OKAY.

>> DOES THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION?

>> IS THIS CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, DOES IT HAVE A TIME PERIOD OR IS IT IN PERPETUITY?

>> I BELIEVE IT'S IN PERPETUITY.

>>THERE IS NOT A LIMIT UNLESS THAT IS A RECOMMENDATION OR A FINAL ACTION BY THE CITY COMMISSION.

BUT WHAT TALIA HAS PUT FORWARD IS IN PERPETUITY.

>> IS IT [NOISE] FOR YOU OR WOULD IT BE TRANSFERRED TO A SUBSEQUENT OWNER?

>> MY HOPE WOULD BE IN THE EVENT OF SOMETHING CATASTROPHIC HAPPENING TO ME, THAT THE CITY WOULDN'T LOSE SUCH A VALUABLE ASSET AND SO IT COULD BE TRANSFERRED.

I THINK THAT WOULD BE REALLY SAD BECAUSE YOU WILL GET BOOKINGS FAR OUT IN ADVANCE AND I WOULD HATE TO SEE THAT HAPPEN.

IT'LL BE SUCH A DIFFERENT PROPERTY FROM THE OTHER HOTELS IN THE CITY.

THAT WOULD BE ONE OF MY CONCERNS.

>> THAT'S BECAUSE SOMETIMES CONDITIONAL USE PERMITS ARE ISSUED TO A SPECIFIC OPERATOR.

>> SURE.

>> ANY SUBSEQUENT OPERATOR WOULD HAVE TO REAPPLY.

I'M JUST WONDERING WHAT THIS APPLICATION IS FOR.

>> NOT IN OUR CODE.

IF A NEW OWNER WAS TO COME ALONG THE SAME PERMIT AND ANY REQUIREMENTS OR CONDITIONS OF THAT CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT WOULD CARRY FORWARD.

YES. THANK YOU.

>> THE LOCATION THAT WAS SHOWN FOR A TRASH APPEAR TO BE [NOISE] IN THE SAME PLACE OR CONFLICTING WITH THE ADA ACCESS TO THE BUILDING.

CAN YOU DESCRIBE HOW THAT [OVERLAPPING]?

>> YES. IT'S A LARGE WALKWAY.

I DON'T KNOW THE EXACT DIMENSIONS OF WHAT IS REQUIRED FOR AN ADA RAMP.

BUT WE WOULD MAKE SURE THAT THAT WAS NOT A PROBLEM.

OBVIOUSLY, BECAUSE YOU CAN'T BRING A WHEELCHAIR THROUGH A TRASH CAN.

THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS WE'LL HAVE TO GO THROUGH ALL OF THE ORDINANCES AND PERMITTING FROM ALL THE MARSHALS AND PEOPLE.

>> THESE WILL BE CANS, NOT A DUMPSTER OR ANYTHING?

>> NO. YEAH. [NOISE] WE'RE ONLY SERVING BREAKFAST.

THERE'S NOT GOING TO BE OTHER MEALS.

ALSO, ONE THING I FORGOT TO MENTION, I REALLY CARE ABOUT SUSTAINABILITY.

WE'RE LOOKING AT USING A COMPOST SERVICE.

WE'RE TRYING TO REUSE ALL THE LINENS AND THE TOWELS.

WE DO A LOT OF RECLAIMING SO THAT WE CAN REUSE THEM AND REDUCE OUR WASTE THAT WAY AS WELL.

>> THERE WERE A NUMBER OF QUESTIONS ON THE SUBMITTED COMMENTS ABOUT THE LIQUOR LICENSE.

CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT THAT?

>> SURE. THE CURRENT ORDINANCE ALLOWS FOR REFRESHMENTS IN THE AFTERNOON.

WE [NOISE] CANNOT SERVE ALCOHOL TO THE PUBLIC, SO WE WOULD NOT DO THAT.

I BELIEVE THE STATE OF GEORGIA HAS A LICENSE FOR SMALLER PROPERTIES TO SERVE ALCOHOL TO THEIR PRIVATE GUESTS.

WE WOULD SEEK TO DO THAT, BUT NOT TO THE PUBLIC.

>> IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO HAS A QUESTION? THANK YOU.

[05:30:07]

WE ONLY HAVE TWO PEOPLE WHO SIGNED THE SIGNING SHEET.

FASU, YES.

>> FASU.

>> FASU, EXCUSE ME. [LAUGHTER]

>> THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

BOY, THIS IS A LATE NIGHT AND I'M NOT AS ARTICULATE AT THIS TIME OF NIGHT EITHER.

MY NAME IS ANNE FASU AND I'M MARRIED TO MIKE LEAF, AND I LIVE AT 627 PINETREE DRIVE, WHICH IS PART OF THE HAMPTON COURT CONDOMINIUM BUILDINGS THAT ARE RIGHT ACROSS FROM 620, THE PROPOSED LARGE HOUSE.

OUR NEIGHBORHOOD IS VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THIS.

WE WOULD LIKE FOR YOU NOT TO APPROVE THE CONDITIONAL LIST USAGE FOR SEVERAL REASONS.

FIRST OF ALL, THIS WOULD BE A PERMANENT CHANGE TO OUR NEIGHBORHOOD.

PINETREE DRIVE IS A REALLY SPECIAL ROAD INDICATOR.

WE HAVE A BOOK CLUB, WE HAVE SPRING AND FALL NEIGHBORHOOD [NOISE] GET TOGETHERS, WE ALL WALK OUR DOGS TOGETHER, WE SPEAK TO EACH OTHER, WE TAKE CARE OF EACH OTHER, WE HAVE VERY ELDERLY RESIDENTS IN THE AREA THAT WE TAKE CARE OFF, AND IT'S JUST A VERY SPECIAL AREA THAT WE FEEL WOULD BE HARMED BY PLUNKING A COMMERCIAL ENTERPRISE RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF IT.

THAT'S OUR FIRST CONCERN, THAT IT IS A PERMANENT CHANGE TO OUR NEIGHBORHOOD.

OUR SECOND CONCERN IS THAT IT REALLY ISN'T GOING TO BE A BENEFIT TO OUR NEIGHBORHOOD.

THE PRICES THAT THEY'RE GOING TO CHARGE.

I DID TALK TO TALIA AND SHE WAS VERY OPEN TO TALKING TO THE NEIGHBORS, BUT THEY PLAN TO CHARGE SOMEWHERE BETWEEN $300 AND $500 A NIGHT.

THAT'S NOT REALLY SOMETHING THAT OUR GENERAL NEIGHBORHOOD IS GOING TO BE ABLE TO AFFORD AND IT STRIKES ME SO IRONIC THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING, AND HERE WE ARE NOW TALKING ABOUT A $500 A NIGHT PLACE TO STAY INDICATOR.

THAT'S REALLY NOT GOING TO BE A BENEFIT TO US.

THEN AGAIN, WE'VE ALL TALKED ABOUT THE PARKING.

WE THINK THAT TALIA IS SEVERELY UNDERESTIMATING THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT ARE GOING TO BE PARKING THERE.

WE THINK THAT THERE'LL BE MORE LIKE NINE OR 10 CARS AND THEN THERE'LL BE DELIVERY SERVICES AND TALIA HAS TALKED ABOUT HAVING MICRO WEDDINGS THAT'LL BE CATERED, THERE'LL BE CATERING TRUCKS, THERE'LL BE 10 TRUCK DELIVERIES.

THERE'S JUST A WIDE VARIETY OF PARKING PROBLEMS THAT COULD EXIST.

THAT'S REALLY GOING TO IMPACT HAMPTON COURT BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF PARKING.

WHERE THOSE PEOPLE AT THE QUEEN BEE WILL BE PARKING IS WHERE OUR GUEST NORMALLY PARKED, SO OUR GUESTS WILL HAVE NOWHERE TO PARK.

WE THINK THAT PARKING WILL BE A BIG PROBLEM.

ALSO, THERE'S GOING TO BE A BIG ISSUE WITH TRAFFIC.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN THINK BACK TO HER PICTURE, BUT SHE'S GOING TO MAKE A CIRCULAR, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD, DRIVEWAY AND IT'S GOING TO HAVE TO CUT THE CURB RIGHT AT WEST PONDS AND PINETREE AND THAT'S ALREADY A VERY CONGESTED AREA BECAUSE DAILY, THE CATHOLIC SCHOOL HAS A LOT OF PICKUP, THE CATHOLIC CHURCH HAS SERVICES AND WEDDINGS, AND IT'S JUST A VERY CONGESTED AREA THAT PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE EXITING FROM WHERE WE'RE TRYING TO GET OUT AND THE CATHOLICS ARE TRYING TO PICK UP THEIR CHILDREN OR PARK TO GO TO CHURCH, AND THAT'S VERY PROBLEMATIC TO CUT THAT EXIT RIGHT THERE AT THAT POINT.

ALSO, WE'RE CONCERNED ABOUT THE LACK OF PERVIOUS SURFACE WHEN SHE PUTS IN THIS NEW DRIVEWAY AND THIS WALKWAY, THE HOUSE ALREADY TAKES A LOT OF SPACE ON THE PROPERTY, AND THERE ALREADY IS A BIG RUNOFF PROBLEM IN THAT AREA.

WE'VE HAD TIMES WITH HEAVY RAINS THAT THE DRAINS HAVE BEEN CLOGGED AND WITH LACK OF PERVIOUS SURFACE IN THAT AREA, IT'S ONLY GOING TO EXACERBATE THAT PROBLEM.

ALSO, OUR CONCERN IS ABOUT TRASH.

WHEN WE TALK TO TALIA EARLIER, WE BROUGHT IT UP AND SHE DIDN'T HAVE A REAL SOLUTION AT THAT TIME, BUT WE THINK SHE'S UNDERESTIMATING THE AMOUNT OF TRASH SHE'S GOING TO HAVE TOO.

THEN AGAIN, WE'RE VERY CONCERNED ABOUT SAFETY ISSUES.

[05:35:04]

SHE'S RIGHT ACROSS THE WAY FROM A SCHOOL, SHE'S SERVING ALCOHOL, THERE ARE LITTLE CHILDREN AROUND AND GEORGIA IS AN OPEN CARRY GUN AREA.

HERE PEOPLE COMING INTO STAY ACROSS THE STREET FROM A SCHOOL, AND WE ALL CAN THINK ABOUT THE TERRIBLE THINGS THAT HAVE HAPPENED WITH CHILDREN AND GUNS IN OUR NEIGHBORHOODS.

LIKE THE LAS VEGAS SHOOTING WHERE A MAN TOOK A GUN UP INTO A HOTEL AND SHOT AT PEOPLE AT A MUSIC FESTIVAL.

THAT'S A, YOU MAY SAY A BIT OF A STRETCH, BUT NOT REALLY.

NOT IN THIS ENVIRONMENT.

EVERY CHILD THAT GOES TO SCHOOL, THEIR PARENTS PROBABLY PRAY EVERY NIGHT THAT THEY'RE GOING TO COME HOME SAFELY.

WE JUST DO NOT THINK THIS IS A FIT FOR OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, IT'S A PERMANENT CHANGE AND WE REALLY ASK FOR YOU TO DENY THIS REQUEST.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR LISTENING TO ME. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

JOE PETERSON.

IS JOE PETERSON HERE? THOSE ARE THE TWO PEOPLE WHO SIGNED THE SIGN-IN SHEET.

IS THERE ANYONE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK WHO HAS NOT SPOKEN? YES, GO AHEAD.

>> GOOD MORNING. [LAUGHTER] I'M CAROL RAPPOL AND I LIVE AT 605 PINETREE DRIVE AND I THINK IT SEEMS LIKE I'VE HEARD HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE TONIGHT TALK ABOUT HOW YOUR HOUSE IS YOUR BIGGEST ASSET FOR MOST PEOPLE AND I KNOW THAT'S VERY TRUE OF ME.

WHEN MY HUSBAND AND I GOT MARRIED, HE WAS A NATIVE OF DECATUR, BUT WE WERE GOING TO LIVE IN DECATUR, BUT WE COULDN'T AFFORD DECATUR.

AND THEN AFTER A TIME WE SPENT IN FLORIDA, WE MOVED BACK.

I TAUGHT AT ST. THOMAS MORE SCHOOL AND WE STILL COULDN'T AFFORD TO LIVE IN DECATUR, AND THEN OUR KIDS WENT TO COLLEGE AND WE COULDN'T AFFORD TO LIVE IN DECATUR.

IT WAS ONLY AFTER WE RETIRED AND SOLD THE HOUSE WE LIVED IN THAT WE COULD BUY A LITTLE PLACE IN DECATUR.

IT IS A BIG ECONOMIC ASSET AND NOW WE'RE TALKING ABOUT JUST DOING SOMETHING I CAN'T BELIEVE THE CITY OF DECATUR WOULD DO TO ME.

JUST PUT A BUSINESS RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET FROM MY HOUSE.

IF THAT'S WHAT IT'S GOING TO BE, THAT THE MICRO PARTIES THAT WILL TAKE PLACE THERE.

THIS IS A PLACE THAT IS IN BUSINESS TO MAKE MONEY, SO WHY WOULDN'T YOU HAVE AS MANY MICRO PARTIES AS YOU POSSIBLY COULD? THAT MEANS THERE'S GOING TO BE PEOPLE AND ALCOHOL AND PARTIES QUITE FREQUENTLY, WHICH I THINK IS DETRIMENTAL TO WHAT MY HOUSE WOULD BRING ON THE MARKET.

THAT'S GOING TO HURT AND I EVEN HEARD SOME TALK ON THIS COMMITTEE ABOUT HOW OLD PEOPLE ARE BEING RESOLVED IN DECATUR, AND I CERTAINLY AM CLASSIFIED AS AN OLD PERSON.

I'M LIVING IN A HOUSE THAT IS MY BIGGEST ASSET FOR ME TO LEAVE TO MY CHILDREN, AND I THINK WOULD BE HURT BY THIS.

I THINK TOO THE GARBAGE IS BEING UNDERESTIMATED BECAUSE IN THE BACK OF THIS HOUSE, THERE IS A SMALL POOL LIKE A CABANA, AND I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU'RE GOING TO FIT A BIG PLACE THERE ALSO FOR A DRIVE IN FOR THE ADA AND THEN ALSO HAVE PLACE FOR GARBAGE.

JUST NOT QUITE SURE HOW THAT WOULD WORK.

I CAN'T VISUALIZE IT AT ALL.

I THINK A PROBLEM.

THIS IS GOING TO BE A VENUE FOR PARTIES.

I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE WOULD POSSIBLY WALK INTO THIS VENUE.

LOTS OF THE PEOPLE WOULD BE COMING FROM DISTANT PLACES.

[05:40:04]

WHY WOULD THEY TAKE MATTER TO THIS VENUE? I THINK THEY WOULD DRIVE.

I DON'T THINK THE CITY OF DECATUR HAS BEEN REALLY SUCCESSFUL IN GETTING PEOPLE TO GIVE UP THEIR CARS.

I DON'T THINK THAT THE QUEEN BEE WILL BE VERY SUCCESSFUL IN GETTING PEOPLE TO GIVE UP THEIR CARS.

I THINK THERE'S GOING TO BE EIGHT GUESTROOMS AND THERE'S SIX PARKING PLACES.

THAT ALREADY MEANS WE HAVE AN OVERFLOW OUT ONTO THE STREET.

THEN WITH THE WORKERS THAT ARE COMING, ESPECIALLY FOR THE MICRO PARTIES, THERE'S GOING TO BE AN OVERFLOW ON THE STREET.

I THINK ONE OF THE LAST THINGS I'D LIKE TO SAY IS THAT A COMMUNITY IS A NEIGHBORHOOD.

[LAUGHTER] IT'S WHAT PEOPLE BUY THEIR HOUSES FOR AND ESPECIALLY IN DECATUR, I THINK MOST OF THE PEOPLE WHO BOUGHT THEIR HOUSES IN PINETREE DRIVE, WE'RE VERY HAPPY TO BE ABLE TO MOVE INTO DECATUR AND VERY HAPPY TO LIVE IN A VERY VIBRANT COMMUNITY AND HAVING [NOISE] THAT VIBRANT COMMUNITY IS MORE THAN JUST BEING ABLE TO GO TO GOOD SCHOOLS OR BEING ABLE TO GO TO GOOD RESTAURANTS, IT'S CONNECTING WITH THE PEOPLE THAT YOU LIVE AROUND AND MAKING A COMMUNITY OF THOSE PEOPLE.

I JUST DON'T THINK OF BUSINESS IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS IS IN KEEPING WITH THE RESIDENTIAL QUALITY OF THIS NEIGHBORHOOD.

I DON'T THINK THAT THE FACT THAT HAMPTON COURT, WITH ITS 16 CONDOS BESPEAKS ANYTHING ABOUT MORE BUSINESS IN THE AREA, THEY'RE RESIDENTIAL.

I DON T THINK ST. THOMAS MORE MAKES THIS COMMUNITY MORE OF A BUSINESS COMMUNITY BECAUSE IT'S A CHURCH.

IT'S BEEN THERE FOR 70 YEARS.

IT CAME BEFORE ALMOST ANYTHING ELSE THAN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD DID.

I JUST THINK THAT A VENUE LIKE THIS IS DETRIMENTAL TO THE COMMUNITY THAT WE HAVE AND IT NEEDS TO BE FOUND SOMEPLACE ELSE BECAUSE ESSENTIALLY, THIS HOUSE, WHICH IS ON THE MARKET NOW FOR TWO-AND-A-HALF MILLION DOLLARS.

THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PAY, PRETTY CLOSE TO THAT.

THE INVESTORS WOULD HAVE TO PAY FOR JUST THE HOUSE AND THE PROPERTY AND THEN GUTTING THE INSIDE AND MAKING ALL THOSE BEDROOMS AND HAVING ALL OF THE PARKING AND ALL OF THE OTHER THINGS THAT ARE DONE TO THE HOUSE IS GOING TO BE A HUGE, HUGE INVESTMENT, AND IT'S MIDNIGHT AND I'VE LOST MY TRAIN OF THOUGHT ON THAT ONE.

[LAUGHTER] BUT IT'S JUST THAT IT'S GOING TO BE A VERY UPSCALE PLACE.

I DON'T SEE WHERE THAT WOULD BE BENEFICIAL FOR THE COMMUNITY.

FOR US, WE WOULDN'T BE MAKING USE OF IT AND I DON'T THINK THAT ANYBODY THAT'S GOING TO BE COMING IN ON MATTER IS GOING TO BE MAKING USE OF IT EITHER.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

>> THANK YOU. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK? YES.

>> [NOISE] EXCUSE ME. LOSING MY VOICE.

MY NAME IS TRISHA DRAKE.

I LIVE AT 617 PINETREE DRIVE IN THE HAMPTON COURT CONDOMINIUM AREA.

I HAD NOT PLANNED TO SPEAK TONIGHT.

BUT THERE IS ONE ADDITIONAL ISSUE IN ADDITION TO WHAT MY NEIGHBORS HAVE BROUGHT UP THAT I WOULD LIKE YOU-ALL TO ADDRESS AND CONSIDER AS YOU'RE DOING THIS.

THE BUNTINGS IN ADDITION TO THE PURCHASE OF THIS HOUSE, THE CONDITIONAL PURCHASE, THEY ALSO, I UNDERSTAND, HAVE FIRST RIGHT OF REFUSAL ON THE HOUSE NEXT DOOR.

SHOULD THIS BE APPROVED? MY CONCERN IS IF THIS IS APPROVED FOR THE LARGER HOUSE, THE ONE AT 620, WOULD THE OTHER ONE AUTOMATICALLY BE APPROVED AS WELL FOR A LODGING HOUSE? ARE THERE RESTRICTIONS ON HOW CLOSE THESE CAN BE TO ONE ANOTHER? IN A NEIGHBORHOOD, HOW MANY OF THESE WOULD BE ALLOWED? I HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT THAT PERIOD, [LAUGHTER] PERIOD AT THE END OF THAT SENTENCE.

[05:45:02]

>> IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK? YES.

>> [NOISE] HELLO. MY NAME IS SARAH BAREFOOT AND I LIVE AT 637 PINETREE DRIVE.

MY CONCERNS ABOUT THIS AND THE REASON I WOULD LIKE YOU TO DENY THE PERMIT IS PARKING AND GARBAGE.

THE IDEA THAT IT COULD BECOME A PARTY HOUSE THAT IS RIGHT ACROSS SOME ST. THOMAS MORE.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU KNOW THAT LITTLE AREA OR NOT.

BUT ON SATURDAYS AND SUNDAYS, ST. THOMAS MORE HAS MASS AVAILABLE, AND IT IS NOT UNUSUAL FOR A MINIMUM OF EIGHT CARS TO COME EVERY SATURDAY OR SUNDAY THERE.

THEN ON THE WEEKDAYS, PINETREE DRIVE ACTS AS A STAGING AREA DROPPING OFF AREA FOR ST. THOMAS MORE.

IN ADDITION TO ALL THIS, AT 620, THE CURRENT OWNERS THERE, IT'S GOT A LOVELY TWO CAR GARAGE, A BIG LONG DRIVEWAY, AND YET TWO OF THEIR VEHICLES WIND UP ON THE STREET EVERY DAY.

THE HOUSE NEXT DOOR, 630, WHICH THEY WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE RIGHT OF FIRST REFUSAL, WHICH THAT'S BRIGHTENING.

IT HAS BEEN UNDER CONSTANT RENOVATION.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT ELSE TO CALL IT.

SINCE AT LEAST MARCH OF 2020.

THERE ARE, ON AN AVERAGE DAY, THREE CARS THAT COME EVERY DAY THERE AND PARK, AS WELL AS A TRAILER IN THE FRONT AND USUALLY SOME VEHICLE MOVING IN AND OUT.

IT'S JUST TOO MUCH TRAFFIC.

IT'S JUST TOO MUCH CONGESTION.

HAMPTON'S COURTS GOT THERE THREE LITTLE HOUSES.

THEY ARE THEN THE DRIVEWAY AND ANOTHER HOUSE AND THERE'S MY HOUSE.

IT'S JUST A QUARTER IS NOT EVEN A QUARTER OF THE STREET THAT IT HAS ALL THIS TRAFFIC AND CONGESTION.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU-ALL HAVE TRIED TO TURN RIGHT ON WEST PONCE DE LEON ONTO THAT END OF PINETREE.

BUT YOU INVARIABLY DROP OVER, EXCUSE ME, THE KNOTS OR WHATEVER THOSE BIG WHITE THINGS ARE AND SOME HAVE TO BE REPLACED.

THAT'S ALSO RIGHT WHERE THE SIDEWALK COMES INTO THE STREET WHERE THE ACCESS CHANGES AND THE GRADE CHANGES.

I DON'T THINK IN THIS WORLD, I THINK WE MIGHT ALL AGREE, THAT JUST BECAUSE YOU CHARGE A HIGH PRICE FOR SOMETHING, DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU'RE GOING TO GET A QUALITY PERSON TO COME IN OR A QUALITY PERSON TO STAY THERE.

IT ALSO DOESN'T MEAN THAT IF YOU HAVE A CREDIT CARD, YOU CAN LIVE WHATEVER LIFE YOU WANT AS LONG AS YOU HAVE MONEY ON THAT CREDIT CARD AND SO I DON'T FEEL LIKE SAYING IT'S GOING TO BE AN UPSCALE AIRBNB, ASSURES ANYBODY OF ANYTHING.

THE IDEA THAT POSSIBLY THE HOUSE NEXT DOOR COULD POSSIBLY BECOME A LARGE HOUSE AS WELL IS VERY DISTURBING.

ANOTHER THING IS LIKE WE HEARD TONIGHT, A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE TALKED ABOUT ABSENTEE LANDLORDS.

IT DOESN'T MATTER THAT THE BURNINGS LIVE RIGHT DOWN THE STREET FROM IT.

THEY'RE NOT ON-SITE AND I JUST HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT OF NOT BEING OFF SITE OWNER.

THANK YOU FOR LISTENING TO ME AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND GOOD NIGHT.

>> THANK YOU. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK TO THIS APPLICATION? YES, SIR.

>> I'M MIKE LEAF, I'M ARCHITECT, USED TO WORK WITH JOE. HEY, JOE.

CHANGING 620 FROM A SINGLE-FAMILY TO A LODGING HOUSE MEANS YOU'RE INCREASING FOUR BEDROOM HOUSE TO A NON BEDROOM HOUSE AND BASS, YOU'RE INCREASING A HOUSE WITH THE OCCUPANT LOAD OF TWO PEOPLE A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO TO 17.

ON LIMITED LOT SIZE, THIS HOUSE IS NOT THAT BIG.

YOU'RE GOING TO BE PUTTING A LOT OF FOLKS IN A HOUSE AND LUXURY EXPERIENCE MAYBE ANY QUESTION AFTER THAT.

THIS ALSO PUTS STRESS ON PARKING, TRASH, FOOD LIKE WE ALL DISCUSS FOOD AND BEVERAGE SALES.

PERVIOUS SURFACES IS TRAFFIC SAFETY AND INTERSECTION PINETREE, AND WEST PONCE, AND ST. THOMAS.

ALL THIS IS AT THE EXPENSE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND ALSO ADA.

I THINK THIS HAS BEEN PUSHED ASIDE, BUT IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO GET THREE OR FOUR FT INTO

[05:50:03]

THAT HOUSE WITH THE LIMITED NUMBER RAMPS SHOWING ON THE PLAN.

THE TRASH IS IN THE WAY, THERE'S STUFF ON THE HOUSE THAT IMPACTS THE RAMP.

THAT'S GOING TO BE A VERY CHALLENGED AND THEN ONCE YOU'RE INSIDE NO BEDROOMS ON THE FIRST FLOOR, YOU GOT TO GO TO THE UPSTAIRS.

YOU GOT TO HAVE SOME LIFT ELEVATOR TO MAKE IT ACCESSIBLE FOR THE DISABLED.

I THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF PROBLEMS WITH THIS, AND I WOULD SAY THAT IT'S REALLY NOT DEVELOPED ENOUGH TO APPROVE IT AT THIS TIME, SO I WOULD SAY NO.

>> IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO HASN'T SPOKEN WHO'D LIKE TO SPEAK TO THIS APPLICATION? WE HAVE ONE MORE PERSON.

>> GOOD MORNING.

>> MY NAME IS LINDA TWILI AND I LIVE AT 609 PINETREE DRIVE.

I'VE LIVED THERE 38 YEARS.

I'VE SEEN A LOT OF WONDERFUL THINGS HAPPEN ON THAT STREET.

I AM VERY HAPPY TO SAY THAT I KNEW EACH ONE OF THE VISIONARIES THAT CREATED HAMPTON COURT.

I'M VERY PROUD OF IT.

I'M VERY PROUD OF THE FACT THAT I CAN LIVE THERE AMONG PEOPLE THAT CARE NOT ONLY ABOUT ME BUT ABOUT THE WHOLE STREET.

[NOISE] I'M WANTING TO SAY THAT I'VE WITNESSED FROM A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE WHAT MY NEIGHBOR HAS WITNESSED FOR THE LAST THREE AND A HALF YEARS.

WE'VE DEALT WITH OUR ISSUES OF PARKING OVER AND OVER.

WE AS NEIGHBORS, WE'LL TALK TO ONE ANOTHER.

WE'VE NEVER REALLY NOT HAD SOMETHING TO COME OUT OF THAT TALK AND THE PARKING WILL CEASE TO BE A PROBLEM.

THE MAIN THING THAT CONCERNS ME THE MOST IS THE ABILITY FOR PEOPLE TO COME INTO OUR SECTION.

WE CALL IT THE INNER SANCTUM AND THEN GO BACK OUT.

THOSE THAT EXIT OUT PARKS THE LEON DON'T NECESSARILY SEE WHAT WE SEE IN THE INSIDE.

BUT ONE OF THE BIGGEST CONCERNS THAT I HAVE, AND I'VE GONE THROUGH IT FOR THE LAST TWO YEARS IS THE ABILITY FOR THE CITY OF DECATUR FIRE DEPARTMENT AND FOR PARAMEDICS THAT HAVE TO COME INTO THE CONFLICT.

NOW, FROM GREAT EXPERIENCE, I KNOW THAT THE FIRE DEPARTMENT, IT'S NOT LACK IN GETTING TO US WHEN THEY NEED TO.

WE HAVE YEARS [NOISE] BACK WHEN WE DECIDED THAT WE WANTED TO LINE OFF OUR PARKING.

THAT'S WHEN WE HAD THE FIRE DEPARTMENT INVOLVED AND THEY HELPED US.

WE HAVE ON THE INSIDE PARKING FOR OUR GUEST, BUT WE DON'T PARK OUR OWN CARS THERE.

THEN WE HAVE THE PARKING OUT FRONT FOR OUR GUESTS ALSO.

BUT WE DIDN'T PUT UP A GATE TO SHOW THAT WE'RE NOT WELCOMING ANYBODY THAT COMES IN.

BUT WE HAVE CURRENTLY ARE TRUCKS THAT DELIVER OUR PACKAGES.

BUT WE DON'T HAVE THE PROBLEM OF PEOPLE PARKING LIKE WE DO NOW.

WITH ALL THE CONSTRUCTION THAT HAS GONE ON, IT'S BEEN UNINDATED, UNMARKED VEHICLES.

THEY PARK IN FRONT OF THE FIRE HYDRANT.

THE FIRE HYDRANT ITSELF SERVES THE CONDOMINIUMS AND THE ADDITIONAL HOUSES THAT ARE CROSS THE STREET AND ON DOWN, THERE'S A CERTAIN RANGE OF THAT.

NOW, I LIKE THE IDEA OF PROGRESSION AND INCLUSION.

[NOISE] BUT I LIKE MY HOME AND I LIKE MY VALUE OF IT.

I'VE INVESTED DEARLY 38 YEARS.

I'VE SEEN ALL OF THE WONDERFUL THINGS THAT HAVE HAPPENED INDICATOR.

BUT THERE COMES A TIME WHEN WE HAVE TO REALLY EVALUATE.

[05:55:04]

I RECENTLY WAS UNFORTUNATELY ALLOWED TO GO BACK AND BE A PARTICIPANT IN MY COMMUNITY.

I SEE NOW MORE THAN I DIDN'T SEE FOR AWHILE BECAUSE I HAVE AN OFFICE THAT SITS UPSTAIRS AND I DIDN'T TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION UNTIL SCHOOL STARTED BACK AND I'M OUT AND ABOUT THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE [NOISE] THAT JUST CHOOSE TO WAIT FOR THEIR CHILDREN.

THE CHILDREN KNOW THEY'RE GOING [NOISE] TO COME OUT AT SCHOOL AND THEY'RE GOING GET IN THEIR CAR.

WHAT I SEE IS MORE IS SET UP TO HAPPEN, POSSIBLY THAT WOULD BE DETRIMENTAL TO OUR COMMUNITY AND TO OUR CHILDREN, TO THE FAMILIES.

I JUST THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE SERIOUS CONSIDERATION WITH SO MUCH GOING ON WITH EVEN THE ZONING THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT FOR FOUR HOURS TONIGHT.

THAT'S A LOT TO TAKE IN TO JUST LISTENING.

I HOPE THAT YOU WILL GIVE THIS A LOT OF CONSIDERATION.

NOT TO INCUR THAT THEY WILL NOT HAVE THEIR VISION ANYMORE TO DO WHAT THEY WANT TO DO, BUT UNDERSTAND THAT WE LIKE OUR STREET, WE LIKE THE COMMUNITY, WE LIKE THE QUIETNESS THAT WE'VE HAD FOR MANY YEARS THAT I JUST WANTED TO LET YOU KNOW THAT'S 38 YEARS THERE HAS BEEN WONDERFUL.

I HOPE IT CONTINUES. THANK YOU.

IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK TO THIS APPLICATION? [NOISE].

MS. BUTTON, YOU HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR RE-BATTLE.

>> JUST A COUPLE OF THINGS, RIGHT NOW AS THE ORDINANCE IS STAND, I COULD TURN IT INTO AN AIRBNB AND MAKE IT A PARTY HOUSE WITHOUT HAVING TO APPLY FOR A PERMIT.

BUT BY APPLYING FOR THIS SPECIAL USE PERMIT, I'M ENSURING THAT THAT ACTUALLY DOES NOT HAPPEN AND THAT WE'RE REALLY LIMITING THE USE OF THE SPACE.

WE ARE GOING TO HAVE FOUR BEDROOMS ON THE FIRST FLOOR, THERE WILL BE AN ADA ACCESSIBLE ROOM.

IN TERMS OF MICRO WEDDINGS THAT IS SOMETHING THAT CAME UP DURING COVID.

IT'S ELOPEMENT, IT IS SMALL, IT'S A FAMILY MEMBERS IN THE BACKYARD, NOT A BIG DEAL.

WE WANT PEOPLE TO BE ABLE TO CREATE MEMORIES.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS?

>> HAVE YOU THOUGHT ABOUT ANY PARKING ARRANGEMENT FOR THE EVENTS? [OVERLAPPING]

>> I THINK WE WOULD DO VALET AND WE'D HAVE TO DO AN OFFSITE LOCATION.

AGAIN WE'RE NOT ANTICIPATING HAVING LARGE GROUPS THERE.

BUT IN THE EVENT WHERE WE WOULD ANTICIPATE A LARGER GROUP THAN THE PARKING WE HAVE ALLOTTED, WE WOULD ARRANGE FOR VALET.

>> ANYONE ELSE?

>> ONE OTHER THOUGHT I HAD TOO WHILE YOUR SITTING THERE, THAT I COULD DO IS WE COULD GET EVEN TAGS FOR THE CARS THAT THEY HAVE TO HAVE TO BE ABLE TO PARK THERE AND THEY PARK IN OUR LOT, AND WE TOLD THEM IF NOT AND I'M HAPPY, I'LL BE THE FIRST TO CALL A GUEST TO HAVE THEIR CAR TOWED IF THEY ARE NOT ADHERING WITH THAT.

>> WOULD YOU BE AMENABLE TO A CONDITION OF IT BEING FOR EVENTS THAT YOU HAVE OFF-SITE PARKING WITH [OVERLAPPING].

>> SURE ABSOLUTELY, I WANT THAT.

AGAIN LIKE I'VE SAID, I CARE THAT THIS IS A WIN FOR THEM.

I'M NOT TRYING TO MAKE THEIR LIVES DIFFICULT.

I KNOW THAT CHANGE IS HARD AND THEY DON'T KNOW ME, THEY DON'T KNOW HOW I OPERATE.

I TOTALLY GET IT. BUT YES, I WOULD.

>> REAL QUICKLY, JUST A QUESTION ON [NOISE] THE SCOPE OF THE RENOVATION WOULD BE TO ADD JUST [OVERLAPPING] THE LOWER LEVEL.

>> WILL HAVE FOUR BEDROOMS ON THE LOWER LEVEL PLUS AND THEN KEEP ROOM AND THEN WE'LL HAVE FOUR BEDROOMS ON THE SECOND LEVEL.

I MEAN, WE'VE GOT TO MAKE THINGS LIKE THE FIRECORE.

THE ARCHITECT HAS BEEN DOING ALL THE RESEARCH ON THAT, BUT THERE'S ALL THE THINGS THAT WE HAVE TO PASS.

WE'LL HAVE TO INSTALL A FIRE DOOR AND WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE'S 30 MINUTE WALLS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

THERE WILL BE THOSE RENOVATIONS.

>> HOW WILL YOU HANDLE AT TIMES OF HIGH OCCUPANCY WHEN THERE ARE MORE GUEST CARS THAN YOUR SPACES WANT?

>> I WOULD DO A VALET SITUATION IN THERE AS WELL.

[06:00:01]

>> ANYONE ELSE? [NOISE] THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

>> [OVERLAPPING] CLOSE PUBLIC COMMENT, AND MOVE ON TO COMMISSION DELIBERATIONS.

ANGELA, I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION.

>> YES SIR [NOISE].

>> IT PERTAINS TO THE MICROWAVE BECAUSE I KNOW THAT THE CODE PROVISIONS GOVERNING LODGING HOUSES INCLUDE A PROVISION THAT SAYS ACTIVITIES AND FUNCTIONS AT THE LODGING HOUSE SHALL BE PROVIDED FOR OVERNIGHT GUESTS ONLY.

HAS THERE BEEN AN INTERPRETATION AS TO WHAT THAT MEANS? [NOISE] IS THAT MEAN THAT YOU CAN'T HAVE EVENTS WHERE PEOPLE ATTEND WHO DON'T STAY OVERNIGHT, OR IS IT JUST THAT WHOEVER IS HOSTING THE EVENT HAS TO BE AN OVERNIGHT GUEST?

>> THE LATTER.

>> THE LAST SENTENCE OF THAT STATEMENT WHERE IT SAYS NO COMMERCIAL ACTIVITIES OTHER THAN PROVIDING LODGING FOR REGISTERED GUEST SHALL BE PERMITTED DOES NOT APPLY TO.

>> GUESTS OR IT DOESN'T APPLY TO GUEST TO GUESTS.

>> RIGHT. YOU COULD STILL HAVE A PARTY OR AN EVENT.

>> WELL, IF I HEARD TALIA SPEAK THERE, IF SHE WAS TO HAVE A SMALL EVENT THAT YOU WOULD HAVE TO BE FOR A GUESS THAT IS STAYING OVERNIGHT.

THIS IS NOT AN OUTSIDE PERSON COMING IN AND RENTING THE FACILITY AND NOT BEING AN OVERNIGHT GUEST.

THAT IS THE WAY THAT HAS BEEN INTERPRETED.

IS THAT THE ACTIVITIES AND FUNCTIONS THAT HAPPEN THERE HAVE TO BE TIED TO A GUEST THAT IS STAYING ON THE PROPERTY.

AS FAR AS COMMERCIAL THE COMMERCIAL SERVICES, THIS CAN TURN INTO A SPA WHERE PEOPLE COME, OR IT CAN TURN INTO A BAR WHERE THEY'RE STARTING TO SELL ALCOHOL [OVERLAPPING] TO THE GENERAL PUBLIC.

THOSE ARE THE TYPES OF COMMERCIAL SERVICES [OVERLAPPING] THAT'S PREVENTING.

>> WHY ARE THEY NOT HAVING TO MAKE IT A ZONING CHANGE TO MAKE IT COMMERCIAL? HOW IS THIS USE NOT COMMERCIAL? IT'S A HOTEL.

>> BECAUSE IT IS EIGHT ROOMS OR LESS, IT IS CONSIDERED A LODGING HOUSE ACCORDING TO OUR [OVERLAPPING] AND IT REQUIRES A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT.

>> CAN YOU CLARIFY FOR ME WHAT IS ALLOWED, WHAT SHORT-TERM RENTALS ARE ALLOWED, WHAT DOES OUR CODE ALLOW?

>> OUR CODES PRESENTLY DO NOT [NOISE] ADDRESS SHORT-TERM RENTALS.

WE DO NOT [NOISE] BACK THEM, WE DO NOT REGULATE THEM, AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT MS. ALLEN IS PRESENTLY WORKING ON.

>> IN TERMS OF LODGING, WE HAVE HOTELS AS A LODGING CATEGORY, WE HAVE LODGING HOUSES AS A LODGING CATEGORY WITH UP TO EIGHT GUESTS ROOMS, AND THEN WE HAVE BED AND BREAKFAST.

>> WE DO HAVE BED AND BREAKFAST [OVERLAPPING] WHICH IS UP TO TO FIVE ROOMS.

>> UP TO FIVE.

>> BUT ALL OF THESE, WHETHER IT'S A LODGING HOUSE, A BED AND BREAKFAST, A SHORT-TERM RENTAL, HOTEL-MOTEL, WE ARE COLLECTING HOTEL- MOTEL TAXES ON ALL OF THEM.

>> [NOISE] FOR SHORT-TERM.

>> CORRECT.

>> FOR SHORT-TERM RENTAL.

>> THAT'S THE WAY I READ IT WAS THAT, IT'S PERMITTED BUT YOU HAVE TO PAY TAXES ON IT FOR THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL.

>> THAT'S DUE TO THE RECENT STATE LEGISLATION FROM A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO.

>> CAN YOU ANSWER WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A LODGING HOUSE AND A BED AND BREAKFAST.

>> JUST A NUMBER OF THEM.

>> [OVERLAPPING] ARE THERE DIFFERENT ALLOWANCES MADE FOR ONE, FOR THE OTHER THAT WOULD NOT APPLY?

>> WITH FIVE ROOMS OR LESS, THAT IS CONSIDERED A BED AND BREAKFAST AND THAT DOES NOT REQUIRE A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT.

IT IS A LIMITED USE AND THERE WOULD BE NOTIFICATION TO ADJACENT NEIGHBORS BUT THERE'S NO PUBLIC HEARING, AND THEN PERMITS CAN BE ISSUED FOR THAT USE.

FOR THE LODGING HOUSE WHICH IS UP TO EIGHT ROOMS, THAT DOES REQUIRE A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT.

THE WHETHER OR NOT IT'S THE LIMITED USE OR THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, IT IS PRETTY MUCH THE SAME REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE EXPECTED OF BOTH.

>> THEY CAN HAVE UP TO FIVE GUESTS ROOMS BY RIGHT? IS THAT WHAT I'M HEARING?

>> BY RIGHT, YES.

>> WITH DOING NOTHING.

>> AS A LIMITED USE WITH THE NOTIFICATION TO ADJACENT NEIGHBORS.

>> WHAT IF YOU DO NOTHING AND YOU TRY TO VRBO IT, THAT WE DON'T REGULATE.

COULD YOU PUT EIGHT PEOPLE IN THERE AS A VRBO?

>> POTENTIALLY, YES.

[06:05:01]

>> ANYBODY ELSE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ON THE TECHNICAL SIDE FOR ANGELA, IF NOT.

>> MS. ALLEN IS LOOKING AT SHORT-TERM RENTAL AND THEN THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE WILL BE ADDRESSING IN THE FUTURE.

>> IN FACT, THE CITY OF DECATUR HAS BEEN MONITORING SHORT-TERM RENTALS FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS.

IT HAS NOT GOTTEN TO A POINT WHERE IT'S SIMILAR TO WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN MORE TOURIST-ORIENTED CITIES SUCH AS SAVANNAH, OR MACON, ATLANTA.

WE ARE NOT AT THAT LEVEL, WE ARE NOT A TOURIST [NOISE] CITY.

THAT'S WHY THERE HASN'T BEEN SUCH AN URGENCY TO DO SHORT-TERM RENTALS, BUT AS WE HEARD TONIGHT, IF WE ARE LOOKING AT INCREASING DENSITY WITH THE PREVIOUS PROPOSAL, THAT DEFINITELY WOULD PROBABLY NEED TO BE IN PLACE.

BUT WE'VE BEEN LOOKING AT THAT FOR A LITTLE WHILE.

IF YOU DON'T MIND, I DO WANT TO POINT OUT ONE MORE TECHNICAL ASPECT BECAUSE I DO KNOW THAT THERE IS A RESIDENT PARKING-ONLY DISTRICT.

THIS IS IN A DIFFERENT PART OF THE CODE.

IT'S NOT THE ZONING CODE, BUT IT'S SECTION 98-9 PINETREE DRIVE.

ON THE NORTH SIDE OF PINETREE DRIVE BETWEEN WEST PONCE DE LEON AVENUE, TO THE EASTERN PROPERTY LINE AT 637 PINETREE DRIVE IS A RESIDENT-ONLY PARKING.

YES, I JUST WANTED TO POINT THAT OUT.

>> ARE THERE SIGNS IN PLACE THAT MAKE THAT CLEAR TO PEOPLE WHO WOULD DRIVE IN FROM.

>> I CAN'T VERIFY THAT.

MAYBE THE GOOGLE STREET VIEW MIGHT BE ABLE TO VERIFY THAT RIGHT AT THIS VERY MOMENT, BUT I'M NOT SURE ON THAT ONE.

>> I KNOW THE ADDRESSES.

>> I'M ASSUMING THAT'S DUE TO CHURCH PARKING.

>> I'M NOT QUITE SURE THE REASONS BEHIND BUT THERE'S 37 DIFFERENT RESIDENT PARKING-ONLY DISTRICTS IN THE CITY.

>> IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE.

>> I'M ON THE STREET VIEW LOOKING AT PINETREE AND I DON'T SEE NOTICE SIGNS FOR THE PARKING RESTRICTIONS. YEAH, I DON'T SEE ANY.

>>THERE ARE TWO SIGNS?

>> [NOISE] I SAW A SIGN GOING THE OTHER WAY, THIS IS BLURRED.

>> YOU GOT A WEIRD BLURRY SPOT.

>> YEAH, SO MAYBE, YEAH.

>> [NOISE] JUST WANTED TO SHARE THAT WITH YOU ALL.

>>THANK YOU.

>> [NOISE] ONE CONCERN THAT I WOULD HAVE, BECAUSE IF THIS WAS NOT ACROSS THE STREET FROM ST. THOMAS MORE, AND IT WAS NOT A NEIGHBORHOOD THAT WAS ALREADY IMPACTED BY CHURCH ACTIVITIES, AND PARKING, AND TRAFFIC, AND ALL THAT STUFF, THEN I WOULD HAVE ZERO CONCERNS AT ALL.

I DO HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF PAUSE BECAUSE YOU DO HAVE THAT EXISTING IMPACT ALREADY.

BUT WHAT REALLY CONCERNS ME IS THE POTENTIAL FOR HAVING EVENTS THAT ARE ATTENDED BY MORE PEOPLE THAN WHO ARE STAYING ON THE PROPERTY.

MY QUESTION TO YOU MS. BUNTING IS, IF WE WERE TO RECOMMENDED A CONDITION PROHIBITING THOSE MICROWAVE EVENTS FROM BEING ATTENDED BY ANYONE WHO'S NOT STAYING AS AN OVERNIGHT GUESTS, WOULD THAT BE A PROBLEM OR IMPOSE A HARDSHIP ON YOU? IF YOU COME TO THE MICROPHONE, THAT'D BE GREAT.

>> YOUR QUESTION IS, IF WE WERE TO PROHIBIT EVENTS FOR ANYBODY OUGHT NOT INCLUDED.

>> ANYONE WHO'S NOT ONE OF YOUR GUEST?

>> SURE. I DO THINK IT GETS TRICKY ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU HAVE FAMILY MEMBERS WHO LIVE DOWN THE STREET AND THEY'RE COMING OVER TO VISIT, EVEN IF IT'S NOT AN EVENT.

I HAVE THAT ALL THE TIME AT ANY NUMBER OF MY PROPERTIES.

I THINK THE LINE GETS REALLY BLURRY THERE.

IT WOULD BE REALLY DIFFICULT.

I THINK WE COULD CERTAINLY PUT A CAP ON THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE, AND FIND A WAY TO KEEP IT IN A MANAGEABLE WAY, BUT IT WOULD BE REALLY DIFFICULT FOR US TO TOTALLY PROHIBIT ANYTHING ELSE.

>> [NOISE] I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT FAMILY COMING OR FRIENDS COMING TO SPEND TIME.

>> SURE, I'M JUST SAYING.

>> HAVING AN ORGANIZED EVENT,-

>> SURE.

>> -THAT'S ATTENDED BY NON-GUESTS WHO WILL NEED SOMEWHERE TO PARK MAYBE.

>> WE COULD DO IT IN A WAY THAT WE GUARANTEE THAT THERE AREN'T, WE CAN BRING PEOPLE, WE CAN REQUIRE OUR GUESTS TO PARK.

THEY CAN PARK AT MY HOUSE, ALTHOUGH I DON'T THINK MY NEIGHBORS WOULD LIKE THAT, BUT WE CAN FIND

>> [BACKGROUND]..

[06:10:06]

>> BUT YOU COULD DO SOMETHING LIKE VALET OR SOME SHUTTLE SYSTEM?

>> NOW, I'M [INAUDIBLE].

>> COULD MAYBE CONDITION IT ON OFF-SITE PARKING AND VALET FOR-

>> OR SHUTTLE SYSTEM.

>> -OR EVENTS.

>> [BACKGROUND]..

>> DEMANDS OVERFLOWS.

>> SAY THAT LOUD SO THAT OUR AUDIENCE CAN HEAR YOU.

>> I DON'T KNOW IF I CAN GET PAST THE COMMERCIAL USE OF IT.

>> IT'S AN R60.

>> LOOK AT THIS CHART, THERE IS VISION FOR THE CITY.

>> IT'S NOT UNUSUAL TO HAVE NON-RESIDENTIAL PURPOSES, LIKE A SPECIAL USE SPECIAL US CATEGORY. BUT I HEAR YOU.

I DO HEAR YOU. DOES ANYONE HAVE ANYTHING ELSE OR DOES ANYONE WANT TO MAKE A MOTION?

>> I'LL MAKE A COMMENT BEFORE A MOTION.

>> OKAY.

>> I DO THINK RELATIVE TO THE STRATEGIC PLAN, [NOISE] I HAD ALWAYS WONDERED WHY WE DIDN'T HAVE MORE BED AND BREAKFAST IN DECATUR.

FOR INSTANCE I WOULD SAY THAT THIS SITE, FOR THE MOST PART, SEEMS AS GOOD AS ANY YEAR ON A VERY FAIRLY BUSY ROAD WITH COMMERCIAL WRITE DOWN THE WAY IT'S SET BACK.

I THINK IT LENDS ITSELF FAIRLY WELL TO THAT WITH SOME OF THE PARKING QUESTIONS NOTWITHSTANDING.

IT'S GENERALLY A PRETTY GOOD FIT TO IT, BUT I WOULD ALSO SAY THAT, IN MY EXPERIENCE MOST BED BREAKFASTS DO NOT PLAY OUT OF KEEPING WITH NEIGHBORHOODS.

SOMETIMES THEY'RE A LITTLE BIT OF A VIBRANT ENHANCEMENT AND SOMETIMES YOU ARE ABLE TO HAVE A GUEST STAY NEARBY.

IT'S NOT USUALLY AN INCOMPATIBLE USE WHEN THEY'RE OF A SMALL-SCALE AND THEY'RE NOT ALLOWED TO HOST BIG LOUD PARTIES AND THAT SORT OF THING.

IN MY MIND, FROM THAT POINT OF VIEW, AGAIN PARKING SOME QUESTIONS MAYBE NOT RESOLVED.

IT DOESN'T FEEL INCOMPATIBLE TO ME EVEN THOUGH IT IS A LITTLE MORE COMMERCIAL THAN RESIDENTIAL, BUT YEAH.

>> BUT WHAT WOULD THE CUT BE ON ATTENDANCE FOR A PARTY LIKE THIS SETTING?

>> WELL, I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU WOULD.

>> HOW DO YOU CUT THAT.

>> [NOISE] THAT'S WHY I WAS ASKING YOU ABOUT THE VALET IN THE SHUTTLE SYSTEM OPTION FOR EVENTS THAT ARE ATTENDED BY PEOPLE WHO AREN'T REGISTERED GUESTS.

>> I WAS THINKING MORE OF THE NOISE AND HOW LATE IT COULD GO INTO THE EVENING AND THE DISRUPTION TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

>>I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY THAT THE FIRE CODE WOULD ALSO LIMIT THE OCCUPANCY AS WELL.

>> SURE.

>> ARE THERE OTHER, IN OTHER WORDS, SAY BARS AND RESTAURANTS HAVE DIFFERENT NOISE ORDINANCES THAN RESIDENTIAL AREAS? DOES THIS FALL IN RESIDENTIAL WORLD SO YOU HAVE TO BE CONSISTENT WITH WHAT WOULD BE RESIDENTIAL AS I UNDERSTAND IT.

>> CORRECT. THERE IS A DECIBEL LIMIT IN THE RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS THAT WE'D NEED TO BE COMPLIED WITH.

THAT'S ALREADY IN THE CODE.

>> WOULD THAT PROHIBIT A BAND?

>>AMPLIFIED PROBABLY.

>> [LAUGHTER] YOU'D PROBABLY PROHIBIT AN AMPLIFIED BAND, YES.

>> BUT A HARPIST.

>> [LAUGHTER] ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR MOTION?

>> I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT WITH ADDITIONAL CONDITIONS APPLIED THAT THE OWNER HAVE AN OUTSTANDING CONTRACTUAL RELATIONSHIP WITH OFF-SITE PARKING FOR SPECIAL EVENTS AND OVERFLOW SITUATIONS.

>> WOULD YOU ALSO INCLUDE IN YOUR MOTION THE CONDITIONS THAT THE STAFF IS RECOMMENDING, WHICH ARE THE TERMS OF SECTION 6.5.7.B.2 OF THE UDL? THOSE BEING THE MINIMUM FLOOR AREA SHALL NOT BE LESS THAN 3,500 SQUARE FEET, LEGALLY ESTABLISHED, BUT NON-CONFORMING LOTS ARE ELIGIBLE FOR A LODGING HOUSE UNIT.

[06:15:02]

IT INCLUDES THE REQUIREMENT FOR THE FULL-TIME RESIDENT MANAGER IN THE LODGING HOUSE.

IT INCLUDES THE PROVISION THAT WE TALKED ABOUT, ACTIVITIES AND FUNCTIONS ARE JUST FOR OVERNIGHT GUESTS.

MEAL SERVICE SHALL BE LIMITED TO BREAKFAST AND IN AFTERNOON AND OR EVENING REFRESHMENT.

NO COMMERCIAL ACTIVITIES OTHER THAN PROVIDING LODGING FOR REGISTERED GUESTS SHALL BE PERMITTED.

NO DISPLAYS OF GOODS, PRODUCTS, SERVICES, OR OTHER ADVERTISING SHALL BE VISIBLE FROM OUTSIDE OF THE BUILDING.

THE MAXIMUM NUMBER OF GUESTS ROOMS PROVIDED SHALL BE NO MORE THAN EIGHT, AND THE LENGTH OF STAY FOR GUESTS SHALL NOT EXCEED 30 DAYS?